Locked out: The 12 million people without a country - Santo Domingo

RE: Locked out: The 12 million people without a country

Quote:

Belly previously said:

Quote:

Atabey previously said:

Quote:

Belly previously said:

Articles like this is where the agenda shows the most of trying to have DR take care of Haiti's problem. Haitians born in DR are NOT stateless.

Haitian Constitution states"

ARTICLE 11:
Any person born of a Haitian father or Haitian mother who are themselves native-born Haitians and have never renounced their nationality possesses Haitian nationality at the time of birth.

ARTICLE 41:
No person of Haitian nationality may be deported or forced to leave the national territory for any reason. No one may be deprived for political reasons of his legal capacity and his nationality.

So the sons of illegal Haitians are NOT stateless as they claim the problem is that the citizenship they are suppose to have they don't want it and are now trying to have DR pay for their parents irresponsible behaviors. The way out is very simple go back to Haiti and claim your citizenship get in-line and come back to DR LEGALLY and your kids would not have to go through what you are going through. But I guess that's TOO much to ask. Right?

The huge problem now facing DR with undocumented workers-largely Haitian migrants- will only get worse over time unless a fundamentally new activism and professional operation takes place in DR. It is high time that the DR national government, along with the different provinces initiate a new program to identify and document all people within DR. This policy would gain great accuracy if the same process happened in Haiti, too. The Haitian State and Nation must accept ownership of its people. To deny citizenship to people who are clearly Haitian is to engage in the business of making people "stateless" and I would argue encouraging people trafficking by the State of Haiti. The DR was suppose to have a National Census this coming month of September. It should use this opportunity to begin the process of identifying real Dominicans from migrants. Then based on the information gained, have all undocumented people given provisional documentation according to a personal interview with international monitors, if needed. Translators should be present and photo ID's made available. Unless steps like these are undertaken, in a few more years it will become impossible to discern a national policy, and great harm could arise from this lack of central government and private sector interests in its correction.

Atabey

There have been many cases where Haitian getting deported back to Haiti get denied access back to Haiti by Haitian authorities by stating that this person does not have a Haitian birth certificate there fore they don't know whether he/she is Haitian or not. Keep in mind as much as 65% of Haitians don't have a birth certificate. The question here is simple how does a person who only speaks Creole in this island cannot be from Haiti. This is the only issue where both PRD and PLD have been in-sync as far as protecting DR and it was made even more clear in the new DR constitution. DR should not provide anything to illegals because they have a legal way out if we do then we would be doomed for real. And yes Haiti is in the business of traffic of humans but UN is too much on their side to actually admit this. They are "stateless" because of their own choosing is that simple and there is nothing DR should do but deportation.

Belly,

The government and people of the DR need to counteract the international campaign against the DR by insisting:

1. That the State of Haiti make their citizens legal. That is, all Haitians born in Haiti or to Haitians on the island of Hispaniola.

2. That those currently in a "stateless" status have a review to determine their nationality. Certainly, someone who speaks Haitian Creole and whose family ties are found in Haiti cannot be but from the nation-state of Haiti.

And another very important point: Dominicans need to use the term: Dumping, as in Human dumping in reference to the on-going national strategy of neglect that the state and nation of Haiti have traditionally espouse in these human matters. The term is factual in that the State and the Nation have abandoned and sought to deny their own people the rights of citizenship. Instead, the State and Nation of Haiti have encouraged human trafficking and the creation of a huge stateless population on the island of Hispaniola. It is inadmissible, in respect of human rights, to return refugees to a country in a state of war. According to the criteria of the United Nations High Commissioner for Refugees (UNHCR), and Haiti is not in a state of war.

Edited on 8/28/2010 11:12 AM by Atabey.

"If you want to sleep well at night, it's best to avoid watching the making of sausages or politics." Otto Von Bismarck

#12 - Posted 27 August 2010, 11:16 PM
Belly Location: United States, Seattle, W.A. Join date: April 2009 Member #: 2555 Posts: 3423	RE: Locked out: The 12 million people without a country Quote: Atabey previously said: Quote: Belly previously said: Quote: Atabey previously said: Quote: Belly previously said: Articles like this is where the agenda shows the most of trying to have DR take care of Haiti's problem. Haitians born in DR are NOT stateless. Haitian Constitution states" ARTICLE 11: Any person born of a Haitian father or Haitian mother who are themselves native-born Haitians and have never renounced their nationality possesses Haitian nationality at the time of birth. ARTICLE 41: No person of Haitian nationality may be deported or forced to leave the national territory for any reason. No one may be deprived for political reasons of his legal capacity and his nationality. So the sons of illegal Haitians are NOT stateless as they claim the problem is that the citizenship they are suppose to have they don't want it and are now trying to have DR pay for their parents irresponsible behaviors. The way out is very simple go back to Haiti and claim your citizenship get in-line and come back to DR LEGALLY and your kids would not have to go through what you are going through. But I guess that's TOO much to ask. Right? The huge problem now facing DR with undocumented workers-largely Haitian migrants- will only get worse over time unless a fundamentally new activism and professional operation takes place in DR. It is high time that the DR national government, along with the different provinces initiate a new program to identify and document all people within DR. This policy would gain great accuracy if the same process happened in Haiti, too. The Haitian State and Nation must accept ownership of its people. To deny citizenship to people who are clearly Haitian is to engage in the business of making people "stateless" and I would argue encouraging people trafficking by the State of Haiti. The DR was suppose to have a National Census this coming month of September. It should use this opportunity to begin the process of identifying real Dominicans from migrants. Then based on the information gained, have all undocumented people given provisional documentation according to a personal interview with international monitors, if needed. Translators should be present and photo ID's made available. Unless steps like these are undertaken, in a few more years it will become impossible to discern a national policy, and great harm could arise from this lack of central government and private sector interests in its correction. Atabey There have been many cases where Haitian getting deported back to Haiti get denied access back to Haiti by Haitian authorities by stating that this person does not have a Haitian birth certificate there fore they don't know whether he/she is Haitian or not. Keep in mind as much as 65% of Haitians don't have a birth certificate. The question here is simple how does a person who only speaks Creole in this island cannot be from Haiti. This is the only issue where both PRD and PLD have been in-sync as far as protecting DR and it was made even more clear in the new DR constitution. DR should not provide anything to illegals because they have a legal way out if we do then we would be doomed for real. And yes Haiti is in the business of traffic of humans but UN is too much on their side to actually admit this. They are "stateless" because of their own choosing is that simple and there is nothing DR should do but deportation. Belly, The government and people of the DR need to counteract the international campaign against the DR by insisting: 1. That the State of Haiti make their citizens legal. That is, all Haitians born in Haiti or to Haitians on the island of Hispaniola. 2. That those currently in a "stateless" status have a review to determine their nationality. Certainly, someone who speaks Haitian Creole and who's family ties are found in Haiti cannot be but from the nation-state of Haiti. And another very important point: Dominicans need to use the term: Dumping, as in Human dumping in reference to the on-going national strategy of neglect that the state and nation of Haiti have traditionally espouse in these human matters. The term is factual in that the State and the Nation have abandoned and sought to deny their own people the rights of citizenship. Instead, the State and Nation of Haiti have encouraged human trafficking and the creation of a huge stateless population on the island of Hispaniola. It is inadmissible, in respect of human rights, to return refugees to a country in a state of war. According to the criteria of the United Nations High Commissioner for Refugees (UNHCR), and Haiti is not in a state of war. First thing we need to do is stop calling them "Stateless" our self because they are NOT. They have a nationality that according to their own constitution cannot be denied to them. If they don't want it well that's they own responsibility and whether many people recognize it or not DR has played this game very good is called "the LA LA LA game". In fact the Jan.12 showed that DR can play them game very well when put to the test. "People who don't like their beliefs being laughed at shouldn't have such funny beliefs"
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#11 - Posted 27 August 2010, 10:44 PM
Atabey Location: United States, NYC Join date: October 2009 Member #: 3761 Posts: 12043	RE: Locked out: The 12 million people without a country Quote: Belly previously said: Quote: Atabey previously said: Quote: Belly previously said: Articles like this is where the agenda shows the most of trying to have DR take care of Haiti's problem. Haitians born in DR are NOT stateless. Haitian Constitution states" ARTICLE 11: Any person born of a Haitian father or Haitian mother who are themselves native-born Haitians and have never renounced their nationality possesses Haitian nationality at the time of birth. ARTICLE 41: No person of Haitian nationality may be deported or forced to leave the national territory for any reason. No one may be deprived for political reasons of his legal capacity and his nationality. So the sons of illegal Haitians are NOT stateless as they claim the problem is that the citizenship they are suppose to have they don't want it and are now trying to have DR pay for their parents irresponsible behaviors. The way out is very simple go back to Haiti and claim your citizenship get in-line and come back to DR LEGALLY and your kids would not have to go through what you are going through. But I guess that's TOO much to ask. Right? The huge problem now facing DR with undocumented workers-largely Haitian migrants- will only get worse over time unless a fundamentally new activism and professional operation takes place in DR. It is high time that the DR national government, along with the different provinces initiate a new program to identify and document all people within DR. This policy would gain great accuracy if the same process happened in Haiti, too. The Haitian State and Nation must accept ownership of its people. To deny citizenship to people who are clearly Haitian is to engage in the business of making people "stateless" and I would argue encouraging people trafficking by the State of Haiti. The DR was suppose to have a National Census this coming month of September. It should use this opportunity to begin the process of identifying real Dominicans from migrants. Then based on the information gained, have all undocumented people given provisional documentation according to a personal interview with international monitors, if needed. Translators should be present and photo ID's made available. Unless steps like these are undertaken, in a few more years it will become impossible to discern a national policy, and great harm could arise from this lack of central government and private sector interests in its correction. Atabey There have been many cases where Haitian getting deported back to Haiti get denied access back to Haiti by Haitian authorities by stating that this person does not have a Haitian birth certificate there fore they don't know whether he/she is Haitian or not. Keep in mind as much as 65% of Haitians don't have a birth certificate. The question here is simple how does a person who only speaks Creole in this island cannot be from Haiti. This is the only issue where both PRD and PLD have been in-sync as far as protecting DR and it was made even more clear in the new DR constitution. DR should not provide anything to illegals because they have a legal way out if we do then we would be doomed for real. And yes Haiti is in the business of traffic of humans but UN is too much on their side to actually admit this. They are "stateless" because of their own choosing is that simple and there is nothing DR should do but deportation. Belly, The government and people of the DR need to counteract the international campaign against the DR by insisting: 1. That the State of Haiti make their citizens legal. That is, all Haitians born in Haiti or to Haitians on the island of Hispaniola. 2. That those currently in a "stateless" status have a review to determine their nationality. Certainly, someone who speaks Haitian Creole and whose family ties are found in Haiti cannot be but from the nation-state of Haiti. And another very important point: Dominicans need to use the term: Dumping, as in Human dumping in reference to the on-going national strategy of neglect that the state and nation of Haiti have traditionally espouse in these human matters. The term is factual in that the State and the Nation have abandoned and sought to deny their own people the rights of citizenship. Instead, the State and Nation of Haiti have encouraged human trafficking and the creation of a huge stateless population on the island of Hispaniola. It is inadmissible, in respect of human rights, to return refugees to a country in a state of war. According to the criteria of the United Nations High Commissioner for Refugees (UNHCR), and Haiti is not in a state of war. Edited on 8/28/2010 11:12 AM by Atabey. "If you want to sleep well at night, it's best to avoid watching the making of sausages or politics." Otto Von Bismarck
	Post IP/Country: 74.68.159.19* / US

#13 - Posted 29 August 2010, 12:28 PM
Atabey Location: United States, NYC Join date: October 2009 Member #: 3761 Posts: 12043	RE: Locked out: The 12 million people without a country 27 August 2010 Last updated at 09:58 ET Share this pageFacebookTwitterShareEmailPrint UN urges France to avoid Roma deportations France says it is acting in line with EU law A UN committee has urged France to avoid collective deportations of Roma (Gypsies) to Romania. The Committee on the Elimination of Racial Discrimination also said it was concerned about "discriminatory" political speeches in France. The French government said it was "scrupulously respecting European law" and helping deported Roma reintegrate. France has recently sent hundreds of Roma back to Romania and Bulgaria and dismantled more than 100 illegal camps. French President Nicolas Sarkozy has announced that 300 such camps are to be removed. The latest round of deportations took place on Thursday. 'Residency limits' The UN committee issued a series of recommendations urging France to "avoid" collective deportations and "strive for lasting solutions". "Our concern is that the removal or return of the Roma has been done on a collective basis rather than examining their individual circumstances," said Pierre-Richard Prosper, a member of the committee. Continue reading the main story Related stories Sarkozy 'to continue' Roma policy Hewitt: Sarkozy's daunting autumn Members of the UN panel also expressed concern about "political speeches of a discriminatory nature in France". The policy of deportations has drawn fierce criticism from human rights and anti-racism groups, while the EU says it is reviewing the legality of the move. Mr Sarkozy's opponents accuse him of using the issue to boost his flagging support by appealing to the French right wing. But the French government, which says it expelled thousands of Roma this year and in 2009, says it is acting in accordance with EU law by repatriating Roma who have been in France for more than three months without work. It also says most of the repatriations are voluntary. The French foreign ministry on Friday pointed to "two limits on residency rights" under EU law: "respect for public order and possession of sufficient resources to not impose an excessive burden on the host country's social welfare system". It said those asked to leave were being given a grant, "which can help those concerned to re-enter social and professional life", and that expulsions to Romania were being carefully co-ordinated with the government there. "In only a minority of cases are departures carried out as forced deportations, under the authority of civil magistrates and judges, who rule on a case-by-case basis." "If you want to sleep well at night, it's best to avoid watching the making of sausages or politics." Otto Von Bismarck
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#14 - Posted 29 August 2010, 11:16 PM
ElFactor Location: United States Join date: June 2010 Member #: 5216 Posts: 665	RE: Locked out: The 12 million people without a country Billionaire George Soros at it again! This is related to 'stateless people,' Haitian illegals in D.R. http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=w0Ztm0iRf24 Edited on 8/29/2010 11:22 PM by ElFactor.
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#15 - Posted 29 August 2010, 11:19 PM
ElFactor Location: United States Join date: June 2010 Member #: 5216 Posts: 665	RE: Locked out: The 12 million people without a country Billionaire George Soros at it again! This is related to 'stateless people,' Haitian illegals in D.R. http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=IT8fuUfW-Bg&feature=channel Edited on 8/29/2010 11:23 PM by ElFactor.
	Post IP/Country: 64.131.136.23* / US

#16 - Posted 30 August 2010, 12:10 AM
guillermone Location: United States Join date: March 2008 Member #: 522 Posts: 5801	RE: Locked out: The 12 million people without a country Quote: Gringo_1 previously said: I suppose from their point of view it is obviously better to be stateless in the DR rather than a citizen in Haiti. IT IS SO, SO BAD TO BE HAITIAN, THAT NOT EVEN THE HAITIANS WANT TO BE HAITIANS.
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#17 - Posted 9 September 2010, 9:29 PM
mrchivo Location: United States Join date: August 2010 Member #: 5624 Posts: 147	RE: Locked out: The 12 million people without a country Quote: guillermone previously said: Quote: Gringo_1 previously said: I suppose from their point of view it is obviously better to be stateless in the DR rather than a citizen in Haiti. IT IS SO, SO BAD TO BE HAITIAN, THAT NOT EVEN THE HAITIANS WANT TO BE HAITIANS.
	Post IP/Country: 64.131.136.23* / US

May 23, 2012, Updated 6:47 AM
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