Dominican Today Forum » Dominicans Abroad » Latin America » Dominicans and Haitians, what is the problem?
#231 - Posted 20 June 2008, 1:15 PM
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RE: DOMINICANS AND HAITIANS, WHAT IS THE PROBLEM?
Quote:
Consuello previously said:

Quote:
USADR previously said:

Quote:
Consuello previously said:

Quote:
Serpent previously said:

Your right with the history of things,but you need to realize your troubling yourself with matters that date back longer then when columbus arrived. This hatred seed dates back thousands of years we are nothing more the victims of lies fed upon generation after generation. I myself am Spanish,Dominican and Haitian. Everyone born in D.R. has haitian blood whether they accept it or not. Now to answer one of the questions you were asking. Im not quite sure how long Haiti reigned over D.R but supposedly when they were in power they massacred alot of Dominicans and thats were the hate of the Trujillo era generation comes from. Anyways our people need a reality check either way.


Wow,

I agree that both people on the Island need a reality check. Oh I know all the well the story of the Island of Hispaniola as well as I have researched both Countries Constitutions. Be careful with that statement...

That is the one thing most Dominicans have been trying to distance themselves from for decades is that the reject any notions that they may carry Haitian blood in them as to say the least, to me it seems like a sense of rejection of the part African that they carry in them. However and no matter, hey if they believe in identifying themselves as Spaniards and Taino and throw away the rest of their genetic inheritance that is African, I say that it is their prerogatives you know... However this should not be a reason why peace cannot be established on the Island where two nations can at least on many Economical, Social point stances live or co-exist amicably, humanity and civility as well as respect for Human Rights.

One good post I have stumbled upon is this one thread by this Hispanolo dude that is titled "GETTING TO KNOW YOUR NEIGHBOR HUMANELY." subtitled A DAY IN HAITI: One Video At A Time. It was a well-put together thread as it presents a clip of a day with about four individuals telling stories. I wonder how many Dominicans even give this post the second look to even make the effort to know of the other culture and their plights...

What's all the fuzz!!!


Lies.
Please spare us your armchair psychoanalysis.


One wonders why you come on to a Dominican forum infecting it with your ignorant posts and then cry when Dominican posters strike back. What psychological problems affect Haitians that they always feel like they have to impose their views on us?


Dear Human Friend I hope the least,

It is you and most of some other Dominicans along with the help of this site who are doing exactly just that of what you have mentioned and described . This is the World Wide Web thus the Net.

The last time I check, I do not remember ever that it was limited as to who gets to browse it. Dominican Today does not mean Dominican Only nor does it give you the permit to rant and express all your negativities of views freely and stand against others such s the Haitians to express their's openly, mate... Especially when those derogatory comments often have been made about them by mostly Dominicans on here as I have observed throughout this whole site and this site does not help when they go about conducting partiality, bias persecutions of deleting, banning and censoring the posts, comments and remarks of those they suspect are Haitians or are reported by other Dominican members when it is done the other way around the double standards Terms & Rules are not enforced. As I said, an individual can Identify with whatever chose to identify with. So in your own words, if:

1). Dominicans do not self-identify as Spaniards.
2). Dominicans do not self-identify as Tainos.
3). Surely Dominican do not self-identify as Africans.
4). Dominicans also don't care how Haitians self-identify at all.

So tell me this dear Human (I hope) friend. Then what the hell do Dominicans Identify with and while you are at it, describe and define the three C's: Contradiction, Confusion & Conflicting? Also remember save to yourself the trouble of even saying "Latino-Americans" because the fact is, that is not a race as it is more of a "Regional Category" and Haitians fall in that Category as well. Anyhow, most of the comments made by those Haitians you are talking down to way too often are always in response, reply and retaliation of comments made by Dominicans on here about them, as people, their Country as a nation.

Oh, so they do not reserve the rights to contest and oppose defaming and condescending remarks when made by most of some Dominicans on here? Do you want me to give you a list of Articles that were commented on here in the Forums so that you can see yourself?

Awaiting your version of truth,

A fellow "Human" friend.

PS: Well, it is nice to see what and who is supporting most of some Dominicans racist views and I now can confirm not to expect anything else less than bias and prejudicial hypocrisy on here when derogatory comments from Dominicans get to be expressed and roam freely, and the ones from Haitians get to be deleted, censored as the adamant direct personal persecutions this site goes to, they go the length to monitor and even banned those they believe is not in favor of those divisive racist views carried by most of most of you on here who coincidentally happen to be oh yeah Dominicans even when it is a negative Article about Haiti and Haitians... Yeah, way to go to expressed your views on a Double Standard Terms & Rules forum website since you want your negative defaming comments to go uncontested right... Right? Let me guess, your next come back is going to be " If Haitians do not like it, they should LEave this site" right? So cliche...



Why did you add African? Why would a Dominican self-identify as African? Or Spaniard or Taino? Does this make sense to you? Where on earth have you seen/heard this?

1) Dominican is a Nationalilty.
2) Dominican Republic is a LatinAmerican/Hispanic nation.
3) Dominican phenotype can vary greatly due to their genetic mixture. A Dominican can be anything from pure Euro looking to pure Afro looking and every possible combination in between.

When in the USA, if asked a Dominican will self-identify as:

-I am Dominican
-The city/region in DR they are from.
-I am HIspanic/Latino (they fall under this ethnic label in the USA)
If asked about their actual physical appearance, they will describe themselves

Like mutli-award winning Dominican artist Juan Luis Guerra sings "Soy de un puelo blanco,negro y taino'

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#232 - Posted 20 June 2008, 1:17 PM
Location: Dominican Republic, Montellano
Join date: June 2008
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RE: DOMINICANS AND HAITIANS, WHAT IS THE PROBLEM?
Quote:
USADR previously said:

Quote:
antonioj previously said:

Quote:
Serpent previously said:

Your right with the history of things,but you need to realize your troubling yourself with matters that date back longer then when columbus arrived. This hatred seed dates back thousands of years we are nothing more the victims of lies fed upon generation after generation. I myself am Spanish,Dominican and Haitian. Everyone born in D.R. has haitian blood whether they accept it or not. Now to answer one of the questions you were asking. Im not quite sure how long Haiti reigned over D.R but supposedly when they were in power they massacred alot of Dominicans and thats were the hate of the Trujillo era generation comes from. Anyways our people need a reality check either way.

Serpent and Consuelo I am glad you guys came on board to share with me with your delusional outlooksI take it, you are both Dominicans born from Haitian parents. I will have a few questions for you. By the way Consuelo you are very articulate and good grace you do can take care of yourself.

The Carlo and Arcatype like ... in a positive way have help me understand better the rethoric behind their mind, I can now easily curtail my babblings toward my own flawed misconception of facts

(psst I don't think Haiti is fixable)



*fixed*


The blind leading the blind, lmao!!!


You see this, although vague and indirectly incriminatingly discriminative, I say is a begging for the question type of argument that requires for further emphasis and elaboration on your part that must stay within constructiveness and cordiality to debate. Because this view is not yours alone as many Haitian born tend to also tend to at times believe that. So continue...
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#233 - Posted 20 June 2008, 1:22 PM
Location: United States
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RE: DOMINICANS AND HAITIANS, WHAT IS THE PROBLEM?
A suggesting, when discussing/debating a certain topic, it helps greatly if you have at least a grasp of the fundamentals of said topic. It will help your understanding alot better and avoid the trap of being a one trick pony or being married to one assumption that can easily be proven false and thus shattering supposed biased opinions passing as 'facts'.

Exhibit A: Asking why Dominicans self-identfiy as Spaniards displays all the flaws I just mentioned.
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#234 - Posted 20 June 2008, 1:24 PM
Location: Dominican Republic, Montellano
Join date: June 2008
Member #: 944
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RE: DOMINICANS AND HAITIANS, WHAT IS THE PROBLEM?
Quote:
USADR previously said:

Quote:
Consuello previously said:

Quote:
USADR previously said:

Quote:
Consuello previously said:

Quote:
Serpent previously said:

Your right with the history of things,but you need to realize your troubling yourself with matters that date back longer then when columbus arrived. This hatred seed dates back thousands of years we are nothing more the victims of lies fed upon generation after generation. I myself am Spanish,Dominican and Haitian. Everyone born in D.R. has haitian blood whether they accept it or not. Now to answer one of the questions you were asking. Im not quite sure how long Haiti reigned over D.R but supposedly when they were in power they massacred alot of Dominicans and thats were the hate of the Trujillo era generation comes from. Anyways our people need a reality check either way.


Wow,

I agree that both people on the Island need a reality check. Oh I know all the well the story of the Island of Hispaniola as well as I have researched both Countries Constitutions. Be careful with that statement...

That is the one thing most Dominicans have been trying to distance themselves from for decades is that the reject any notions that they may carry Haitian blood in them as to say the least, to me it seems like a sense of rejection of the part African that they carry in them. However and no matter, hey if they believe in identifying themselves as Spaniards and Taino and throw away the rest of their genetic inheritance that is African, I say that it is their prerogatives you know... However this should not be a reason why peace cannot be established on the Island where two nations can at least on many Economical, Social point stances live or co-exist amicably, humanity and civility as well as respect for Human Rights.

One good post I have stumbled upon is this one thread by this Hispanolo dude that is titled "GETTING TO KNOW YOUR NEIGHBOR HUMANELY." subtitled A DAY IN HAITI: One Video At A Time. It was a well-put together thread as it presents a clip of a day with about four individuals telling stories. I wonder how many Dominicans even give this post the second look to even make the effort to know of the other culture and their plights...

What's all the fuzz!!!


Lies.
Please spare us your armchair psychoanalysis.


One wonders why you come on to a Dominican forum infecting it with your ignorant posts and then cry when Dominican posters strike back. What psychological problems affect Haitians that they always feel like they have to impose their views on us?


Dear Human Friend I hope the least,

It is you and most of some other Dominicans along with the help of this site who are doing exactly just that of what you have mentioned and described . This is the World Wide Web thus the Net.

The last time I check, I do not remember ever that it was limited as to who gets to browse it. Dominican Today does not mean Dominican Only nor does it give you the permit to rant and express all your negativities of views freely and stand against others such s the Haitians to express their's openly, mate... Especially when those derogatory comments often have been made about them by mostly Dominicans on here as I have observed throughout this whole site and this site does not help when they go about conducting partiality, bias persecutions of deleting, banning and censoring the posts, comments and remarks of those they suspect are Haitians or are reported by other Dominican members when it is done the other way around the double standards Terms & Rules are not enforced. As I said, an individual can Identify with whatever chose to identify with. So in your own words, if:

1). Dominicans do not self-identify as Spaniards.
2). Dominicans do not self-identify as Tainos.
3). Surely Dominican do not self-identify as Africans.
4). Dominicans also don't care how Haitians self-identify at all.

So tell me this dear Human (I hope) friend. Then what the hell do Dominicans Identify with and while you are at it, describe and define the three C's: Contradiction, Confusion & Conflicting? Also remember save to yourself the trouble of even saying "Latino-Americans" because the fact is, that is not a race as it is more of a "Regional Category" and Haitians fall in that Category as well. Anyhow, most of the comments made by those Haitians you are talking down to way too often are always in response, reply and retaliation of comments made by Dominicans on here about them, as people, their Country as a nation.

Oh, so they do not reserve the rights to contest and oppose defaming and condescending remarks when made by most of some Dominicans on here? Do you want me to give you a list of Articles that were commented on here in the Forums so that you can see yourself?

Awaiting your version of truth,

A fellow "Human" friend.

PS: Well, it is nice to see what and who is supporting most of some Dominicans racist views and I now can confirm not to expect anything else less than bias and prejudicial hypocrisy on here when derogatory comments from Dominicans get to be expressed and roam freely, and the ones from Haitians get to be deleted, censored as the adamant direct personal persecutions this site goes to, they go the length to monitor and even banned those they believe is not in favor of those divisive racist views carried by most of most of you on here who coincidentally happen to be oh yeah Dominicans even when it is a negative Article about Haiti and Haitians... Yeah, way to go to expressed your views on a Double Standard Terms & Rules forum website since you want your negative defaming comments to go uncontested right... Right? Let me guess, your next come back is going to be " If Haitians do not like it, they should LEave this site" right? So cliche...



Why did you add African? Why would a Dominican self-identify as African? Or Spaniard or Taino? Does this make sense to you? Where on earth have you seen/heard this?

1) Dominican is a Nationalilty.
2) Dominican Republic is a LatinAmerican/Hispanic nation.
3) Dominican phenotype can vary greatly due to their genetic mixture. A Dominican can be anything from pure Euro looking to pure Afro looking and every possible combination in between.

When in the USA, if asked a Dominican will self-identify as:

-I am Dominican
-The city/region in DR they are from.
-I am HIspanic/Latino (they fall under this ethnic label in the USA)
If asked about their actual physical appearance, they will describe themselves

Like mutli-award winning Dominican artist Juan Luis Guerra sings "Soy de un puelo blanco,negro y taino'


Aww ahh sorry to disappoint you as I must agree with you when you say Dominican is a Nationality thus a Demonym that only pinpoints one to the specify Sovereign Country of thr Dominican Republic much like it does for any Nationals to each and their respective Nations... It is not a race by itself. As you may not find the definition of these two words in regular basic scholar dictionary, however I will advise you and most Dominicans on here to look up Demonym and Ethnonym. Or if you guys do not wish or want to do the work, luckily we have a great researcher as Lautaro you all could ask to research them for you.
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#235 - Posted 20 June 2008, 1:27 PM
Location: Dominican Republic, Montellano
Join date: June 2008
Member #: 944
Posts: 191
Send Message
RE: DOMINICANS AND HAITIANS, WHAT IS THE PROBLEM?
Quote:
USADR previously said:

Quote:
Consuello previously said:

Quote:
USADR previously said:

Quote:
Consuello previously said:

Quote:
Serpent previously said:

Your right with the history of things,but you need to realize your troubling yourself with matters that date back longer then when columbus arrived. This hatred seed dates back thousands of years we are nothing more the victims of lies fed upon generation after generation. I myself am Spanish,Dominican and Haitian. Everyone born in D.R. has haitian blood whether they accept it or not. Now to answer one of the questions you were asking. Im not quite sure how long Haiti reigned over D.R but supposedly when they were in power they massacred alot of Dominicans and thats were the hate of the Trujillo era generation comes from. Anyways our people need a reality check either way.


Wow,

I agree that both people on the Island need a reality check. Oh I know all the well the story of the Island of Hispaniola as well as I have researched both Countries Constitutions. Be careful with that statement...

That is the one thing most Dominicans have been trying to distance themselves from for decades is that the reject any notions that they may carry Haitian blood in them as to say the least, to me it seems like a sense of rejection of the part African that they carry in them. However and no matter, hey if they believe in identifying themselves as Spaniards and Taino and throw away the rest of their genetic inheritance that is African, I say that it is their prerogatives you know... However this should not be a reason why peace cannot be established on the Island where two nations can at least on many Economical, Social point stances live or co-exist amicably, humanity and civility as well as respect for Human Rights.

One good post I have stumbled upon is this one thread by this Hispanolo dude that is titled "GETTING TO KNOW YOUR NEIGHBOR HUMANELY." subtitled A DAY IN HAITI: One Video At A Time. It was a well-put together thread as it presents a clip of a day with about four individuals telling stories. I wonder how many Dominicans even give this post the second look to even make the effort to know of the other culture and their plights...

What's all the fuzz!!!


Lies.
Please spare us your armchair psychoanalysis.


One wonders why you come on to a Dominican forum infecting it with your ignorant posts and then cry when Dominican posters strike back. What psychological problems affect Haitians that they always feel like they have to impose their views on us?


Dear Human Friend I hope the least,

It is you and most of some other Dominicans along with the help of this site who are doing exactly just that of what you have mentioned and described . This is the World Wide Web thus the Net.

The last time I check, I do not remember ever that it was limited as to who gets to browse it. Dominican Today does not mean Dominican Only nor does it give you the permit to rant and express all your negativities of views freely and stand against others such s the Haitians to express their's openly, mate... Especially when those derogatory comments often have been made about them by mostly Dominicans on here as I have observed throughout this whole site and this site does not help when they go about conducting partiality, bias persecutions of deleting, banning and censoring the posts, comments and remarks of those they suspect are Haitians or are reported by other Dominican members when it is done the other way around the double standards Terms & Rules are not enforced. As I said, an individual can Identify with whatever chose to identify with. So in your own words, if:

1). Dominicans do not self-identify as Spaniards.
2). Dominicans do not self-identify as Tainos.
3). Surely Dominican do not self-identify as Africans.
4). Dominicans also don't care how Haitians self-identify at all.

So tell me this dear Human (I hope) friend. Then what the hell do Dominicans Identify with and while you are at it, describe and define the three C's: Contradiction, Confusion & Conflicting? Also remember save to yourself the trouble of even saying "Latino-Americans" because the fact is, that is not a race as it is more of a "Regional Category" and Haitians fall in that Category as well. Anyhow, most of the comments made by those Haitians you are talking down to way too often are always in response, reply and retaliation of comments made by Dominicans on here about them, as people, their Country as a nation.

Oh, so they do not reserve the rights to contest and oppose defaming and condescending remarks when made by most of some Dominicans on here? Do you want me to give you a list of Articles that were commented on here in the Forums so that you can see yourself?

Awaiting your version of truth,

A fellow "Human" friend.

PS: Well, it is nice to see what and who is supporting most of some Dominicans racist views and I now can confirm not to expect anything else less than bias and prejudicial hypocrisy on here when derogatory comments from Dominicans get to be expressed and roam freely, and the ones from Haitians get to be deleted, censored as the adamant direct personal persecutions this site goes to, they go the length to monitor and even banned those they believe is not in favor of those divisive racist views carried by most of most of you on here who coincidentally happen to be oh yeah Dominicans even when it is a negative Article about Haiti and Haitians... Yeah, way to go to expressed your views on a Double Standard Terms & Rules forum website since you want your negative defaming comments to go uncontested right... Right? Let me guess, your next come back is going to be " If Haitians do not like it, they should LEave this site" right? So cliche...



Why did you add African? Why would a Dominican self-identify as African? Or Spaniard or Taino? Does this make sense to you? Where on earth have you seen/heard this?

1) Dominican is a Nationalilty.
2) Dominican Republic is a LatinAmerican/Hispanic nation.
3) Dominican phenotype can vary greatly due to their genetic mixture. A Dominican can be anything from pure Euro looking to pure Afro looking and every possible combination in between.

When in the USA, if asked a Dominican will self-identify as:

-I am Dominican
-The city/region in DR they are from.
-I am HIspanic/Latino (they fall under this ethnic label in the USA)
If asked about their actual physical appearance, they will describe themselves

Like mutli-award winning Dominican artist Juan Luis Guerra sings "Soy de un puelo blanco,negro y taino'


So now to get an idea of your mind before I determine your anguish toward Haitians... With that being said as mentioned above, where do you put a Haiti and Haitians?
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#236 - Posted 20 June 2008, 1:29 PM
Location: Dominican Republic, Santo Domingo
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RE: DOMINICANS AND HAITIANS, WHAT IS THE PROBLEM?
[QUOTE=arcatype]

I wonder why you dont question Haiti's emigration patterns, was that a bold move to whiten the black republic of Haiti, in a country where french colonist were massacred by the vast majority black slave populace. [/B]

[/QUOTE]

Funny that you're asking me that, since you have been one of the people that have accused them time and again of letting their people migrate to the DR in order for them to alleviate their social burdens. Are you amnesiac or something?
Edited on 6/20/2008 1:36 PM by Lautaro.
"A man who strives after goodness in all his acts is sure to come to ruin, since there are so many men who are not good."

Niccolo Macchiavelli - The Prince

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#237 - Posted 20 June 2008, 1:32 PM
Location: Dominican Republic, Montellano
Join date: June 2008
Member #: 944
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RE: DOMINICANS AND HAITIANS, WHAT IS THE PROBLEM?
Quote:
USADR previously said:

A suggesting, when discussing/debating a certain topic, it helps greatly if you have at least a grasp of the fundamentals of said topic. It will help your understanding alot better and avoid the trap of being a one trick pony or being married to one assumption that can easily be proven false and thus shattering supposed biased opinions passing as 'facts'.

Exhibit A: Asking why Dominicans self-identfiy as Spaniards displays all the flaws I just mentioned.


Exhibit A(a): Dominicans are the ones always demeaning Haitians for their strong Afro backgrounds, as they are often the ones talking about how against it they are about DR becoming Africanized if Haitians are given rights within the Country as though being African was a bad thing...

Suggestion: If you are willing or even have the time that is, go read over the posts and comments in both the threads and forums where constant Dominican & Haitian lashing is taking place.
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#238 - Posted 20 June 2008, 1:33 PM
Location: United States
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RE: DOMINICANS AND HAITIANS, WHAT IS THE PROBLEM?
Quote:
Consuello previously said:



So now to get an idea of your mind before I determine your anguish toward Haitians... With that being said as mentioned above, where do you put a Haiti and Haitians?



Consuello you are paying a semantic game. Since USADR told you that he identifies as Dominican, and not any of these other labels that would make you holler 'racist', now you want him to label Haitians for you. Everyone here, Haitian, Dominican or otherwise is free to SELF identify so what is the relevance of this question?

The only double standard is that arca hasn't been harassed by the moderator along with you, although arca for all his rudeness at least never flooded or bumped threads or broke any rules.
I'm sorry, I can't hear you over the sound of how awesome I am.

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#239 - Posted 20 June 2008, 1:38 PM
Location: Dominican Republic
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RE: DOMINICANS AND HAITIANS, WHAT IS THE PROBLEM?

LAUTARO, SAID
Funny that you're asking me that, when you have been one of the people that have accused them time and again of letting their people migrate to the DR in order for them to alleviate their social burdens. Are you amnesiac or something?

ARCATYPE: Where have i ever encourage illegal haitians to come to the Dominican Republic, show me where? Im 100% against this quiet invasion. You got the wrong person here, and i have the same screen name since i joined Dominican Today, haven't changed it.
Arcatype
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#240 - Posted 20 June 2008, 1:42 PM
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RE: DOMINICANS AND HAITIANS, WHAT IS THE PROBLEM?
Quote:
ny4life previously said:

Quote:
USADR previously said:

Quote:
Serpent previously said:

Your right with the history of things,but you need to realize your troubling yourself with matters that date back longer then when columbus arrived. This hatred seed dates back thousands of years we are nothing more the victims of lies fed upon generation after generation. I myself am Spanish,Dominican and Haitian. Everyone born in D.R. has haitian blood whether they accept it or not. Now to answer one of the questions you were asking. Im not quite sure how long Haiti reigned over D.R but supposedly when they were in power they massacred alot of Dominicans and thats were the hate of the Trujillo era generation comes from. Anyways our people need a reality check either way.



It never ceases to amaze me everytime I read about all the 'Haitian blood' every Dominican supposedly has....and your statement is 100% false. Everyone born in DR has Haitian blood? These are the types of ignorant statements that always provoke a backlash.
If you read the ethnohistory between the 2 nations you will quickly realize how wrong your statement is, do you have a unbiased third party scientific source?
Just one casual observation should give you an example: Due to historical and cultural reasons, look how isolated Haitians are in DR (even after being there for more than a generation). Look how completely absorbed were the West Indian Cocolos who came to do the same type of jobs the Haitians do. It has nothing to do with 'race' before the racialist here come in with their usual crying.

I also find it arrogant how Haitians are always exaggerating/overplaying or downright lying about all their 'influences' on DR while simultaneously getting angry defense when Dominican rightly proclaim that Cuba & PR had 10000x more influence in DR's genetics & culture. Very easy to verify.

By the way, your screen name of Serpent (father of all lies) suits you well. Remember, the Serpent will always get trampled.


Very well said. I share the same view points as you. I don't why he thinks or Haitians think they can impose our views on us. They think they knew better about who wer are then our very selves. It's pathetic and ignorant to think like that. Everyone one in DR has Haitian blood??? That's why Dominicans respond and Hispanolo cries foul. Very ignorant comments.



Huh as also serpent is the sign for PRUDENCE why it is the medical symbol.. Show me a text where in your words where it says "Father Of All Lies" ? Serpents nonetheless have been given this title withthe given notion that it was used to coerce Eve to eat the Apple thus is the belief attained by all who are Christians... a lie is only as bad as the one who accept it knowing that it is a lie I think...
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