Then no census is accurate .Immigration ,discrimination etc.... and all the garbages ( affecting census, I sensible said : affecting census ) are in every country .And it is the same techniques applied for the Jews and now for Africa ,America and south Asia .

561,949 for the first number (6% of 9,365,819) and 540,000 for the second (6% of 9,000,000), still, I find that 6% to be highly inaccurate, because, for one that lives and roams the country as much as I do, I believe that number would amount only for the ones on Santo Domingo city and its neighbouring parishes alone (Eastern, Western and Northern Santo Domingo), and I still find it very conservative, as such, given the overcrowded state in which the capital finds itself right now, with those construction projects and all, and the numbers of people selling things on its streets and sidewalks.

I need to go back on this b/c I think I didn't reply in a proper way.
I don't mean to be hard on you "Consuelo" same that I am not showing off ( don't have anything to show off). I Understand you said "censors" referring to whom that collect the informations .What I want to say is Census Has nothing to do with racial and discrimination tensions ,because it deals with sampling of the population. Sure there're bias from those collecting the information. The question is why would you put Bias , since there was no immigration census nor economical census , business census, etc... what have been done in DR was population census . Usually done by non-governmental organizations.
Simple if you want to collect info from Immigrants send an immigrant to collect it, there will be no scare.

may be you should say , it is not exact but it is accurate , because they based on it to make decisions as send humanitarian aids and so more.

Oh my friend, in contrary it does at times depending on who is on the other hand trying to conduct the census and for what motivated purpose and political gain and propaganda because we still have to have Dominicans Officials with us, translators and so forth.

As I said which maybe you have misunderstood. I said with the high number of Human Rights Violations and the known racial discrimination as motives, it is rather guile to think such a census would not be partial and are conducted with prejudice and bias pre-notions. Anyway, no illegal immigrants knowing that they are illegals would openly be willing to be subject to such a scrutiny of a census. Such a campaign for a census would have to be advertised so that the public is aware as well as the laws of Entrapments would have had to be gaged so that reprisals are not taken against those so called the categorical group you are trying to conduct the survey and census upon which irregardless, the people are not always prone to accept visit leave alone talk of their status to the Agents simply because the fear is still the plausible factor that always render those census surveys to be not be accurate along again I said other factors of villages and areas that are not accessible and are too remote that we have to result to top of the head estimations.

Thus, that alone leaves room for such census to be inaccurate along with all kind of multitude of factors and worse case scenarios.

PS: I have conducted censuses before as we the US ARMY are often the ones who are the foot agents or are sent by the US government at times to collect those datas along with surveys and all kind of PhD savvy Agents.

Like I said Lautaro,

Do not sculpture this to cater to your claim that of which you have chosen to stick with and which you may be all entitled to do so with all your every reserved rights. But however, that 2 Million Haitians in question, those people youa re mentioning are told to be included in that figure number.

Let us say for once the number was 2 Million, now when the figure is being reported they say that all of those 2 Millions are illegals. How could that be if as said by this census that this general 2 Millions are considered illegals and yet you would still have the legal Haitians that have not been included and are not considered Dominicans no matter of how legal they are due to the fact that DR does not grant Citizenship especially to Haitians even when their grand and great grand children are born on DR soil which are considered to be in "Transition." Thus exists a contradiction or conflicting sets of information and suspicious factor that if 2 Millions are illegals then what is the census for those that are legals living in DR?

Lastly, what is the total census of all Haitians living in DR legal or illegal or not? You cannot have two sets of populace after the 6 % of that total of Haitians living in DR period has been given.

P.S: Fact, Haitians legal or illegal make up only 6% of DR's population which is an estimated population of 9, 500, 000 people if not more given and take 3 % plus or minus margin of possible room for error and inaccuracy. Now let us give you the benefit of the doubt that if even Haitians were to have made up a firm estimation of 8 to 10 % of DR's population you do the math Lautaro...


Thus let us upped the number of higher far fetched margin or percentage of Haitians living in DR and say... Haitians are, in general legal or illegal, a make up of 10% of DR's population of 9, 500, 000 people.

What is now your answer and number?

950,000 people, an estimate that, given the free-for-all state of the issue (the utter lack of a proper control of the border by both states on the island), I still find that it does not reflect the reality of the affair. If there has been reported an overabundance of jamaican weaponry on the streets of the main dominican cities (weaponry that stems from the contraband trade between Haiti and Jamaica, and which the majority end up being resold at the dominican-haitian border), how could you be naive enough to believe that it would be any different with human trafficking, may I ask? specially when one have to consider that it is said "sotto voce" among the people that human trafficking might be the main branch of the contraband trade on that zone, and that, unlike the inmigrants that came to cut sugar cane from the 1950's to the 1980's, the new inmigrants don't look forward to returning home but, on the contrary, many of them do backbreaking work in order to save enough money to pay the traffickers for the chance of bringing their entire families to this country, or at least that's the impression that I get after querying the ones that live on the colony near my sector and the ones from other barrios of the capital if they'll get back to their homeland were the socioeconomical situation to improve. Apparently, a lot of them are afraid that the present situation might be only temporary, like the calm before the storm.

So you see,

You have 950,000 people which is not 1 Million. Even with that number you are still trying to add up to it as I even went the extra length of leaving the reported fact of 6% behind just to give or take into consideration of all the others factors. Your adding factors will never end as it is what most Dominicans do and it is expected.

Look at this, you are still trying to add which I even say for sake of impartiality let us say and hypothetically 10% just so that no discrepancies were left out, you are still adding to it which is so typical of anyone who is Dominican and who wants to portray the situation with their over exaggeration in justifying reasons behind the excuses of Ant-Haitiasmos deep resentments. Okay to even satisfy your conveying this your way, let us even add that so called factor which you have just mentioned, you still would not have the long stretch boldface exaggeration of 2 Million. As fact estimates that Haitians make up only and only 6% of the Dominican population that is for both legals and illegals period.

I went on the limb with a hypothetical exaggeration of saying 10% if you want me to go to 15% you could still do the math lautaro. However, what I see you are doing is still going out of your way to add in factors just so and until you reach a 2 Million number.

P.S: I thought you were trying to say this was between me, Carlos and Arc that you were just a bystander trying to point out how I could disprove them? I rest my case, Lautaro... In the mean time, here is an article quotes and link from a "guess what" yeah a Dominican source, not a Haitian or international source again giving you an estimate figure which even in the end of it they try to give you a long stretch just to satisfy their over exaggerations.

"Estimates of the number of Haitians currently in the Dominican Republic range from 700,000 to as high as more than one million, a situation Immigration director Carlos Amarante called "untenable" a few days ago."

http://www2.dominicantoday.com/dr/local/2008/7/4/28543/Dominican-Consulate-in-NY-picketed-for-Haitians-rights-Diario-Libre-says

That is the whole point my friend. No census is ever accurate. No scientists, doctors or any officials in their right mind or left who are terms can claim any census to be accurate as always a census always end up being finished with an estimation due to many rooms for plus and minus errors, discrepancies that may include all kinds of factors.

For or against, good or bad, all depending on the message you are trying to convey or its purpose. It is the same methods, techniques being applied World Wide. Indeed many things are sensible when conducting a census or survey and guess what, even polls of polls. Check this out whenever you are watching a poll, census or survey always look at the bottom and you will see, as they should provide it to you by law the margin of error to indicate or leave room for possible discrepancies. However, there can be censuses conducted that can come to something close to being a great estimation closed to being accurate only when within all your systematic methods, techniques and resource there were no actual presence of possible discrepancies.

Yet even then, the census is still considered and estimate and cannot be called accurate. For example, let me limbo to the dark side if I were to agree with someone who is fully Dominican and who believes in this over estimated figure.

P.S: I would say then, even then on their parts it is still an inaccurate estimation if they not take accountability for the legals ones, because when they are saying there are 2 Million illegals in DR then than that is to say that the population of Haitians period there is greater than that of that 2 millions now then because within that 2 Million mind you they never say both legals and illegals. They always say those 2 Million are only all illegals.

If that is the case, the problem does not lie in the hands of the Haitian migrants as well as DR has a bigger problem at hand that would furthermore push them to the point of granting amnesty due to the fact that that would put such a Haitian population to a high of let us stretch a good 2.5 Millions thus put them in the populace constituency clause by law and if that is the case, DR just has proven themselves they are part of extreme HUMAN RIGHTS violations. Thus is surpass in consideration to just say or view this as being only a dilemma, but rather a grave predicament.

As I said earlier, we'll just have to agree to disagree. You'll not be able to convince me with your points, seeing as I do how Haiti's food security and employment situations haven't improved at all since 2004, and they don't show signs of improving on the short run. So it's a given that the haitian common joe will not let famine nor disease take his or the lives of his family away, having the opportunity of getting food and employment just a few miles from home, so to speak. In other words, given the current crisis affecting food prices worldwide, and Haiti's dependence on food importations, it might all come down to a "sálvese quien pueda", if things don't improve both at the national and international levels.

Then the absurdity in this Lautaro is that you might as well say all of or most of Haiti's population then are in DR. The reported unemployment rate in Haiti is 50% and may be greater, I think. So you are saying because of lack of jobs let us even say half of that 50% are in DR?

Surely for a smart guy like yourself you can clearly see how preposterous this is. Then it would not have been only 2 Millions now, would it? Haiti has slightly over a 9 Million population itself. Only 8% of that is reported crossing to DR. Now I want you to minus 8% from 9 Million. If you wanted to know how exactly the census had figure a better estimate, it is in part because they know of the population of both Countries on the Island as they took into consideration those Haitians that only go to the border to do trade in border Cities like Ouanaminthe & Dajabon. Yes, indeed, I have given you by far way more leverage to work with in this argument as I went from the reported fact of 6%, then for over exaggeration's sake I brought it to a 10% and to further your greed of reluctancy, stubbornness and justification I even went to 15% you still could not come up with an addition of 2 Million.

What makes this claim even more absurd for both those conducting the census and DR is that, if that 2 Million is only those illegals one; than that would leave you with a greater Haitian population in DR due to the fact the legals ones with rights have not been accounted for. Is this the stretch youa re going for?

P.S: Then guess what, you would still be wrong with your estimate dear smart friend no matter how much you want to stick to your guns with that 2 Million "estimate."
Already I suppose: "Sin dudas si, salvese quien pueda... claro que si."