Dominican Today Forum » Living in the DR » General Info » Haitianos Destruyendo LOS HATISES 46 ENCONTRADO CORTANDO VEGETACION
#91 - Posted 22 November 2009, 5:52 PM
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RE: Haitianos Destruyendo LOS HATISES 46 ENCONTRADO CORTANDO VEGETACION
Quote:
Micaela previously said:

Regarding the famous Haitians, pride will be stem in kids outside Haiti, because I don't see how a kid eating dirk cookies, when eating something, could have different perspectives because anybody claims to be Haitian. Contrary to you, they don't see the negativities that somebody has focused on projecting about Haiti; They just live them and have nothing to do with psychological thinking, just lack of food, school, heath care, shelters, jobs, safety, etc.




Indeed as I said, this "may" stem greater confidence among Haitian youths no matter or regardless where there are. In Haiti or abroad, because if they see positive images of their kinds making it, or care to claim with pride their Haitian heritage, that takes away certain already believed stigmas that these youths themselves might have had in mind about their own nations and might be inspired to want to be better citizens. You are not a general clairvoyant foreseer or psychic to know or deeming(ly) claim in whose heart or area of the world inspiration will develop regardless of where hopeless disparity lives.
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#92 - Posted 22 November 2009, 6:01 PM
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RE: SOME PROUD HAITIANS
Quote:
joblitsky previously said:

Clearly someone (the reporter/interviewer, w/e) is showing her how to say those specific Haitian Creole phrases. You can even make out his voice as he guides her through it towards the end. And this automatically gives some Haitians to claim her as their own? If that were the case then we might as well claim she's latina since she actually sang an entire song in spanish for the latino audience.


Okay,

Let us say you are right. Does that defeat her acknowledgement of being Creole. I mean, the journalist did not go out on a limb claiming her to be Haitian. Be it if it was on speculations, rumors that he might have believed that she is Haitian, her omitting to such heritage might have been reasons why the Journalist seem compelled to have asked her.

Anyway, what if she was full blown Haitian, is the hate for Haiti and Haitian so strong that Haitians should not try to take pride in claiming those they feel might be Haitians as Haitians? Well, in terms of her claiming she is Creole and most creole came about to be due to mixture of Africans with former colonizers indeed she could be latina as fact is Haitians are considered Black Latinos given the region and all. Something many Dominicans want to dismiss as well. You know what, is it okay if we claim her "Human" too (lol)? Or maybe just because she is breathing, speaking and walking dose not justify her to be "human" since somebody might have showed her how to walk, speak and breathe a certain way...

I mean wow, is that hatred for Haiti and Haitian this strong that damn if they do, damn if they do not is the only policy to deal with them many of you on here deem necessary?
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#93 - Posted 22 November 2009, 6:11 PM
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RE: SOME PROUD HAITIANS
Quote:
AfroLatino1 previously said:

Okay,

Let us say you are right. Does that defeat her acknowledgement of being Creole. I mean, the journalist did not go out on a limb claiming her to be Haitian. Be it if it was on speculations, rumors that he might have believed that she is Haitian, her omitting to such heritage might have been reasons why the Journalist seem compelled to have asked her.

Anyway, what if she was full blown Haitian, is the hate for Haiti and Haitian so strong that Haitians should not try to take pride in claiming those they feel might be Haitians as Haitians? Well, in terms of her claiming she is Creole and most creole came about to be due to mixture of Africans with former colonizers indeed she could be latina as fact is Haitians are considered Black Latinos given the region and all. Something many Dominicans want to dismiss as well. You know what, is it okay if we claim her "Human" too (lol)? Or maybe just because she is breathing, speaking and walking dose not justify her to be "human" since somebody might have showed her how to walk, speak and breathe a certain way...

I mean wow, is that hatred for Haiti and Haitian this strong that damn if they do, damn if they do not is the only policy to deal with them many of you on here deem necessary?

LOL You really took it overboard didn't you. Why are you so paranoid? The video itself is using edited interviews just to try to make her out to be Haitian simply because she said a haitian phrase. Beyonce says she has creole heritage but that's all she says, nothing else. All of a sudden you've managed to spin this into me having hate for haitians? Get real, you're trying way to hard to make yourself (and haitians) the victims in every argument.

BTW, do haitians even consider themselves latinos? That says it all...
Edited on 11/22/2009 6:13 PM by joblitsky.
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#94 - Posted 22 November 2009, 6:19 PM
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RE: Haitianos Destruyendo LOS HATISES 46 ENCONTRADO CORTANDO VEGETACION
Quote:
Micaela previously said:


Don't you know why people are ridiculed when they talk about "Human Right" violation issues in DR? Because the same that talk about it, have never, ever, said anything about Human Right violation and racism in Haiti. Why if they do not care about the rights of the 9 millions in Haiti, are they so interested in the rights of the 2 millions in DR?



That is a boldfaced lie! People do talk about Racism and among many other issues in Haiti out loud all the time.

If they did not, there would never be a reasons why there has been power struggles and classism in Haiti between the mass black populace with the minority mulattoes which control for the longest time most of Haiti's institution. People, especially Haitians, do talk about "Human Right Violations" in Haiti jsut as they do about it everywhere since documentaries, articles as well as reports are on many issues in Haiti all over the world.

The "Restavek, Child prostitution and Child Abuse" issues which are "Human Right Violation" issue were all over CNN and world media.


THIS VIDEO IS ON CHILD PROSTITUTION.


THIS ONE IS ON CHILD ABUSE.


THIS VIDEO IS ON THE RACIAL DIVIDE SOCIAL CLASS APPARATUS IN HAITI.


THIS ONE IS ON POVERTY IN HAITI.
Edited on 11/22/2009 6:21 PM by AfroLatino1.
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#95 - Posted 22 November 2009, 6:27 PM
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RE: Haitianos Destruyendo LOS HATISES 46 ENCONTRADO CORTANDO VEGETACION
Quote:
AfroLatino1 previously said:


That is a boldfaced lie! People do talk about Racism and among many other issues in Haiti out loud all the time.

If they did not, there would never be a reasons why there has been power struggles and classism in Haiti between the mass black populace with the minority mulattoes which control for the longest time most of Haiti's institution. People, especially Haitians, do talk about "Human Right Violations" in Haiti jsut as they do about it everywhere since documentaries, articles as well as reports are on many issues in Haiti all over the world.




How can it be a lie when nobody talks about putting the haitian governing classes on their knees in order to change the status quo? How can it be a lie, when the same people talking about human rights violations in the DR are practically screaming to the international community to put the DR as a whole on its knees if it doesn't comply with their knee-jerk liberal BS? Are they not aware that people would hate haitians even more if the DR is economically sanctioned because of this?
"A man who strives after goodness in all his acts is sure to come to ruin, since there are so many men who are not good."

Niccolo Macchiavelli - The Prince

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#96 - Posted 22 November 2009, 6:30 PM
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RE: SOME PROUD HAITIANS
Quote:
joblitsky previously said:

BTW, do haitians even consider themselves latinos?


Those Haitians that do not consider themselves "Latinos" is something that is due in part to the known xenophobic reaction by those in "Latinos Communities" around the world who usually have a pre-notion image in mind as to who they accept as "Latinos" and often most seem to reject those with a stronger African presence "Latinos" to also to the lack of education on or of what makes one "Latinos" many seem reluctant to accept the premises of categorical facts as to what considers one to be "Latinos."



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#97 - Posted 22 November 2009, 6:34 PM
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RE: SOME PROUD HAITIANS
Quote:
AfroLatino1 previously said:

There is such a hate and resentments for Haitians that you guys will stop at nothing to demean. debase and denote anything Haiti or Haitians stand for and I suppose it is understandable given the historical bad blood DR has with Haiti to always justify their hatred, yet Spain and other Europeans are roaming the earth free without resentment of hatred for what they have done.


So in other words you'd prefer for there to be some hatred and resentment against the spanish for their past aggressions? What a sorry way to feel. Spain has long since established good healthy relationships with her ex colonies including the DR. Spain even donates money and contributes to DR's development through social and economic programs. Santo Domingo's colonial zone was actually restored in some areas due to spanish donations. Haiti on the other hand offers nothing good to the DR besides, well, cheap labor. Is that even a good thing? Haiti has shown little efforts to establish a good relationship with the DR despite Leonel desperately trying to kiss ass and support and speak up for Haiti internationally and locally. Haiti on the other hand spends her time bashing the DR constantly. Tell me, how are there not going to be resentments/hatred among Dominicans with a country that acts this way?
Edited on 11/22/2009 6:42 PM by joblitsky.
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#98 - Posted 22 November 2009, 6:47 PM
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RE: Haitianos Destruyendo LOS HATISES 46 ENCONTRADO CORTANDO VEGETACION
Quote:
Lautaro previously said:


How can it be a lie when nobody talks about putting the haitian governing classes on their knees in order to change the status quo? How can it be a lie, when the same people talking about human rights violations in the DR are practically screaming to the international community to put the DR as a whole on its knees if it doesn't comply with their knee-jerk liberal BS? Are they not aware that people would hate haitians even more if the DR is economically sanctioned because of this?





My friend,

There are movements that make the news and there are those that do not. That does not mean those that do not make the news are not just as pro-active in struggle as those that do. "The absence of evidence is not the evidence of absence" itself.

The world media seem to be focus more where there actually see situations are more grave, more dire and more sensational thus to make it more legitimate enough to make the news but that does not necessarily fall on certain nations' fault be it DR or Haiti among others... What makes any differences are efforts on those nations' part internally (thus, governments of those nations) to address those issues themselves before foreign Amnesty International Groups among of all kinds of other affiliations comes in to marginalize, or put sensational twists that are often could be viewed unnecessary or to some necessarily valid at the same time.

I said it was a boldface lie due to the fact that the poster said that people who are antagonizing DR on the issues are not doing so for those same issues in Haiti. So, I posted videos that proved otherwise that in fact they are being pressed just as well.

P.S: Are you familiar with any of the UN Human Rights Charters, Lautaro? Most, if not all of them, are not binding resolutions. DO you know why that is? Well that is because they cannot infringe on the reservation rights sovereign nations have, but nevertheless can the UN not still try to influence world consensus to worldly issues that are deemed to be inhumane.
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#99 - Posted 22 November 2009, 7:03 PM
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RE: SOME PROUD HAITIANS
Quote:
joblitsky previously said:

So in other words you'd prefer for there to be some hatred and resentment against the spanish for their past aggressions?


I never said that resentments or hatred toward Spain would be justified over the the one DR has for Haiti.

I said it is not shown as clearly I said, as much resentments DR has toward Haitians or Haiti; I have never seen DR demonizing the acts of past European invaders. Infact, DR shows no kind of hatred or resentments toward Spain, France, Portugal and all other past imperial colonizers and occupiers like those I have just names which have killed, enslaved, raped and capitalized on barbaric savage institutions for so long and to some minds, even till today.

Yet, Haiti's revolutionary acts which were reactionary to those practices thus in effort to stop the existence of those practices are met with such vilified treatments.

SPAIN, FRANCE, PORTUGAL AND OTHER EUROPEANS: Have invaded, killed close to annihilated, Enslaved, Raped, Capitalized and Oppressed as they Suppressed. When was the last time DR among many other nations have demonized their acts as barbaric to hold any resentments toward them as DR been toward Haiti?

P.S: Instead we see, they are indirectly (at times directly) being glorified, idolized and praised through psychological conditioned mantra that their looks are accepted over one that is Africanist in nature. The global world fashion trend view European looks as most attractive, pleasant to look at over much of the world Africanist or other tribalistic appearances.
Edited on 11/22/2009 7:16 PM by AfroLatino1.
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#100 - Posted 22 November 2009, 7:14 PM
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RE: SOME PROUD HAITIANS
Quote:
joblitsky previously said:


Haiti has shown little efforts to establish a good relationship with the DR despite Leonel desperately trying to kiss ass and support and speak up for Haiti internationally and locally. Haiti on the other hand spends her time bashing the DR constantly. Tell me, how are there not going to be resentments/hatred among Dominicans with a country that acts this way?


With that there could be disagreement on both sides. Many in Haiti are saying otherwise as I am sure many in DR are saying theirs.

Haiti indeed has shown little initiative in tackling down issues in Haiti which could prevent amount of influx migrant into DR due the the fact, well, Haiti is in a deep-assed hole and as insufficient as Haiti is today, you can imagine the difficulty that it will take for them to get out of this stinking hole.

Haiti, if anything, uses DR as model example when they are talking about national improvements that need to take place in Haiti.

P.S: Do not listen, believe or buy into the premises of some "radical over-protectionist neo-conservative extremist" Dominicans whom their only agenda is to see a divisive Hispaniola to validate their negative rants.

* There are better relations at hand between DR & HAITI than the fundamentalist media has sprung about. It might be little and in need of improvement, but nevertheless there are regardless of dim and gloom it might seem.
Edited on 11/22/2009 7:14 PM by AfroLatino1.
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