Dominican Today Forum » Living in the DR » General Info » Question regarding Sammy Sosa
#11 - Posted 12 August 2008, 12:46 PM
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RE: Question regarding Sammy Sosa
Quote:
Lautaro previously said:

I don't know if any of you are aware of the seething contempt that I hold for the US Congressional Black Caucus, but really, anyone (dominican or related) that hears or reads any statement made by them about Hispaniola's situation can't help but holding the same grudge that I do. For them, it's as if every misfortune that had ever happened on Haiti's history has to be somehow our fault. That's why I'm not so cheerful for Obama's candidacy for the US presidency, even though I particularly hold him on high regard and the fact that he's a better person (for the world's sake) than the republican mummy. Sorry about the rant, but I felt that I had to get this off my chest.



Lautaro, I agree with what you said regarding the Congressional Black Caucus here in America. All those things they accuse DR of is obviously the result of huge historical distortion and not knowing the real facts. Everything always has to be a skin color issue, I hate that shit (excuse my language!). Regarding that Sammy Sosa issue, there' s alot of stories. The one I had heard was that he got invited to something here being held by the Black Caucus and that he declined the invitation, therefore leading to all these comments about him. What they don't mention is that I believe that invitation conflicted with his invitation to the White House by President Clinton. I mean I don't know if it's true, but that's a rumor I heard too. A ese pobre moreno le han caido arriba desde que empezo a triunfar. Aqui a mucha gente le molesta desde que un Dominicano progresa en algo y de una vez le quieren "manchar" la imagen. Que Vaina!
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#12 - Posted 12 August 2008, 12:47 PM
Location: United States
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RE: Question regarding Sammy Sosa
Quote:
Lautaro previously said:

Quote:
USADR previously said:

Race and Stuff (RAS) is one forum, but to view the threads now you must become a member:

http://raceandstuff.phpbb-host.com/index-forum.php

HumanBiodiversity Forum is my preferred Anthro. forum, alot more posters from all over the world, and it deals with alot of other topics:
http://www.biodiversityforum.com/

But there server is down (first time I've witnessed this)

The thing is, I'm like one Dominican vs a bunch of foriegners who are going by biased isolated 'byte' sized info. and twisting it out of proportion.
The good thing is that many other Latinos (Peruvians, Mexicans, etc.)often come to our defense and try to explain the Latino view of things.
I'll post some excerpts when the forum becomes available if you guys want, but alot of it wil make you angry/surprised at the ignorance and insults.


It seems that we have a loooong battle ahead of us, USADR. If you have the time, please visit the forums of dr1.com. Although there are some very intelligent dudes out there (like the poster NALs), there are some foreigners sharing a lot of views with the people that you mentioned. Some of the things that they have said out there are downright revolting (specially on the DR/Haiti issue). Plus, many of the said bunch of whiners can't still believe that a great part of our population still posess obvious Taino pheno and genotypes on their DNA, even though reputed anthropologists like Jorge Estevez (which is himself a Taino descendent) have shown clear proofs about the fact.




Oh, I've read some of the things posted on dr1.com, believe me it goes way beyond that on these other forums because dr1.com is at least a Dominican site and usually will not let things get too far out of control. These threads on other forums are ALWAYS started by African Americans. Not Africans, not West Indians, but African Americans. And the funny thing is that they are usually from like down south or out west (away from the Dominican populated tri-state area). All their knowledge is based off of biased and twisted articles.
You go on YouTube and it too is a mess, filled with agenda driven videos. Someone took the time out to post 'the real face of DR' (that means we are all really a black nation)
One thing I'm glad of is that Dominican Americans have maintained their self-identity and refuse US type labels. There is even a sociological study that states the same.
Any talk of Taino or Eurodescendancy will label you a 'black denier and/or ashamed of blackness'.
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#13 - Posted 12 August 2008, 12:51 PM
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RE: Question regarding Sammy Sosa
Quote:
JEM237 previously said:

Quote:
Lautaro previously said:

I don't know if any of you are aware of the seething contempt that I hold for the US Congressional Black Caucus, but really, anyone (dominican or related) that hears or reads any statement made by them about Hispaniola's situation can't help but holding the same grudge that I do. For them, it's as if every misfortune that had ever happened on Haiti's history has to be somehow our fault. That's why I'm not so cheerful for Obama's candidacy for the US presidency, even though I particularly hold him on high regard and the fact that he's a better person (for the world's sake) than the republican mummy. Sorry about the rant, but I felt that I had to get this off my chest.



Lautaro, I agree with what you said regarding the Congressional Black Caucus here in America. All those things they accuse DR of is obviously the result of huge historical distortion and not knowing the real facts. Everything always has to be a skin color issue, I hate that shit (excuse my language!). Regarding that Sammy Sosa issue, there' s alot of stories. The one I had heard was that he got invited to something here being held by the Black Caucus and that he declined the invitation, therefore leading to all these comments about him. What they don't mention is that I believe that invitation conflicted with his invitation to the White House by President Clinton. I mean I don't know if it's true, but that's a rumor I heard too. A ese pobre moreno le han caido arriba desde que empezo a triunfar. Aqui a mucha gente le molesta desde que un Dominicano progresa en algo y de una vez le quieren "manchar" la imagen. Que Vaina!


The thing I hate about some of these Pan African/Afrocentric Idealogues is that many African Americans have made disparaging remarks about Latinos regardless of color. An African American does not look upon Sammy Sosa as a 'brother' thats bs one reads online.
Anyone with specific questions based on real life , feel free to ask, I was born in DR but raised here in the East Coast (Northern NJ (Newark, Passaic, Paterson) and MA. I was raised with AA's , went to school with them and dated their females.
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#14 - Posted 12 August 2008, 12:58 PM
Location: Dominican Republic, Santo Domingo
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RE: Question regarding Sammy Sosa
It doesn't help the fact that we have our own quinta columnas to contend with:

http://www.almomento.net/news/130/ARTICLE/11446/2008-06-03.html

Any thoughts about this?

“Since the two rarely come together, anyone compelled to choose will find greater security in being feared than in being loved.” Niccolo Machiavelli
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#15 - Posted 12 August 2008, 1:08 PM
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RE: Question regarding Sammy Sosa
Quote:
Lautaro previously said:

It doesn't help the fact that we have our own quinta columnas to contend with:

http://www.almomento.net/news/130/ARTICLE/11446/2008-06-03.html

Any thoughts about this?




NY4Life actually just sent it to me.
This will add fuel to what many of those that attack us will say 'we are all really descendants of Haitians'. If you read some of the comments on that site they mimic things I've read elsewhere.
I have nothing personal against Haiti or it's people, but the amount of illegals in DR add fuel to the fire of those anti-DR posters.
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#16 - Posted 12 August 2008, 1:11 PM
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RE: Question regarding Sammy Sosa
Quote:
USADR previously said:

Quote:
Lautaro previously said:

It doesn't help the fact that we have our own quinta columnas to contend with:

http://www.almomento.net/news/130/ARTICLE/11446/2008-06-03.html

Any thoughts about this?




NY4Life actually just sent it to me.
This will add fuel to what many of those that attack us will say 'we are all really descendants of Haitians'. If you read some of the comments on that site they mimic things I've read elsewhere.
I have nothing personal against Haiti or it's people, but the amount of illegals in DR add fuel to the fire of those anti-DR posters.


Trust me, if the DR's big press gives the green light to the news, then it'll be something BIG, considering that Sosa has hero (heck, more like God-like) status on this country.
“Since the two rarely come together, anyone compelled to choose will find greater security in being feared than in being loved.” Niccolo Machiavelli
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#17 - Posted 12 August 2008, 2:02 PM
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RE: Question regarding Sammy Sosa
I agree with the general sentiments here, however I have to play devil's advocate a bit. When educated Dominicans/Domi-Americans talk about our Taino or other heritage, yes we do properly put it in the context of the much greater African contribution. However I have seen with my own eyes the absolute denial of African roots. So while it is dubious when certain observers with an axe to grind to single out DR over the rest of Latin America for this behavior, it is not dubious that the behavior and attitude does exist. I never heard of Sammy Sosa saying such a thing but you know what? It is certainly possible. People can take self-deception to great lengths.
http://englishquisqueya.ning.com
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#18 - Posted 12 August 2008, 2:10 PM
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RE: Question regarding Sammy Sosa
Quote:
Manhattanite previously said:

I agree with the general sentiments here, however I have to play devil's advocate a bit. When educated Dominicans/Domi-Americans talk about our Taino or other heritage, yes we do properly put it in the context of the much greater African contribution. However I have seen with my own eyes the absolute denial of African roots. So while it is dubious when certain observers with an axe to grind to single out DR over the rest of Latin America for this behavior, it is not dubious that the behavior and attitude does exist. I never heard of Sammy Sosa saying such a thing but you know what? It is certainly possible. People can take self-deception to great lengths.


That's all well and true, Manhattanite. Unfortunately, these people wants us to adopt the american one-droppism, which for me (and for the majority of dominicans and latin americans alike) is a very unacceptable solution. In fact, it might be worst than the illness itself. As much as some of us might despise european colonialism, we can't deny that a great part of our culture is in itself pretty much westernized, with a great part of the campesino elements (specially the ones from the Cibao) remaining pretty much Taino, as Jorge Estevez' work can attest.
Edited on 8/12/2008 2:19 PM by Lautaro.
“Since the two rarely come together, anyone compelled to choose will find greater security in being feared than in being loved.” Niccolo Machiavelli
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#19 - Posted 12 August 2008, 2:59 PM
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RE: Question regarding Sammy Sosa
Quote:
Manhattanite previously said:

I agree with the general sentiments here, however I have to play devil's advocate a bit. When educated Dominicans/Domi-Americans talk about our Taino or other heritage, yes we do properly put it in the context of the much greater African contribution. However I have seen with my own eyes the absolute denial of African roots. So while it is dubious when certain observers with an axe to grind to single out DR over the rest of Latin America for this behavior, it is not dubious that the behavior and attitude does exist. I never heard of Sammy Sosa saying such a thing but you know what? It is certainly possible. People can take self-deception to great lengths.


Here is a generalized summary of their accusations:

-Dominican Republic is in reality a black Spanish speaking Haiti in terms of genetic ancestry
-Dominicans are black people who've been taught they are 'indians' as in Native Americans.
They avoid using the term black to describe themselves, they call themselves all shades of indian or they think they are white because they have been brainwashed by their 'oppresors' (the Spaniards?)
-Haiti is the shining example of Hispaniola, they are enslaved by the racist Dominicans.
-Dominicans are all of Haitian descent. Any light skinned Dominican is an extremely rare sight, sort of like spotting a unicorn.
-African Americans will teach Dominicans how to be proper proud black folks.
-Dominicans essentially equal=Trujillo.

I can go on and on.

So much lies, misinformation. I work in an office in Northern NJ open to the public. Many clients are Dominicans of all backgrounds and I freely ask them quetions. I have yet to meet a Dominican that tells me we are Spaniards or we are really Native Americans, they will always mention we also have black ancestry. I have yet to meet a Dominican that looks like Big Papi tell me he is really 'indio oscuro' lol. I know, this is not exactly scientific, but common sense and reality.

The one thing many African Americans cannot accept is actually that they have culturally adopted OneDroppism which was created by Eurodescendants in the USA to keep them seperated and 'pure' white. An African would never call Alisha Keys 'black' and neither would the rest of LatinAmerica. African Americans are okay with calling Halle Berry black and are confused when the rest of the world is puzzled by the American definitions of 'race'.

The funny thing is, that all these attacks just create further alienation and animosity that already exists between the Dominican community and AA's. Nothing antagonized more than an arrogant display of trying to impose foriegn (USA) labels on another nations' people.
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#20 - Posted 12 August 2008, 3:05 PM
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RE: Question regarding Sammy Sosa
Quote:
USADR previously said:


The funny thing is, that all these attacks just create further alienation and animosity that already exists between the Dominican community and AA's. Nothing antagonized more than an arrogant display of trying to impose foriegn (USA) labels on another nations' people.


If that imposing attitude was galling during the era of their greatest prestige (the 90's), how do you think the rest of the world is viewing that attitude today, when americans are viewed as "persona non-grata" on far too many countries for their liking?
Edited on 8/12/2008 3:09 PM by Lautaro.
“Since the two rarely come together, anyone compelled to choose will find greater security in being feared than in being loved.” Niccolo Machiavelli
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