Dajabon is NOT cibao

I am very familiar with Lemba (his views and opinions), and all I can say is that I am not one bit surprised by some of the replies to his posts here.

I've made this comment to Lemba before, since we've disagreed plenty of times:

Everyone is certaintly entitled to their own opinion, but not all opinions carry equal weight. One is certainly free to have their own personal belief system, however one should not allow said belief system to cloud ones understanding of facts, which can only distort their interpretations. In other words, try to be as free as possible from any type of cognitive biases.

While I am of the opinion that Lemba has alot of African focused ethnocultural/historical knowledge, it should be seen in its correct context and not used as the start and end of anything DR related (like the Palo references) think you know your own thoughts and views are very atypical and do not represent the great majority of Dominicans.

Here is an example of what I mean about getting carried away, or being "overenthusiastic" about one element in DR's heritage:

http://www.forumbiodiversity.com/showthread.php?t=6057&page=4
^
Feel free to look at the entire thread, but my point is captured in post #39, a reply from a Spaniard.

Everything i post is pertaining to D.R, because he proved one or two words i posted where not African, dose not make me Afro-centric, we all learn and that is what scholarly is about, i apreciated his reply. Althougho in all honesty la academia real has incorporated alot of non-spanish words, which where original taino or African. They have become part of the spanish language, some words are both. For example Mondongo is both a word of a spanish dish, and also the name of a congolese tribe which made iet to D.R, if you look at the bautismos de esclavos there are slaves in d.r with the surname mondongo.

My thoughts about Palo do represent the great majority of Dominicans, it is something well known. I am working on interviwing more nad more elders from my community in s.f.m, i already asked my grandfather about it, need to post the video on fb. Palo is very common in many parts of the cibao, this is not something unique to me or my family.

Without hte focus on elmenets in D.R's culture and their possible origins we may never learn anything. it is challenging and schoarly debates that make new knowledge get written in books. For example there where some articles found in caves in d.r and for years all of them where assumed to be native, and in fact about 90% of the items where confirmed ot be native decades later, but two items stood out. One of them was a clearly Kongolese Iron Bracelet, something that the Taino's didn't have, and a Kongoelse Nganga (sort of a witches cauldron). This is why we have to be careful to accept things 'as they are" and i stand corrected if i mislabeled, or misnamed something instead of breaking out into a flury of insults and name calling like most posters here do. Usadr you seem to be the more grounded one out of the bunch, and i thankyou for showing this post as a great example of the need for scholarly work to be done in D.R culture.

"As far as looks, that is also very wrong. I think you are speaking for like Sajoma, And Sajoma only."

I suggest you take a gander at Batioa, Sabana Iglesia, Puñal, El Rubio, Janico, Junacalito, Pedro Garcia, Tamboril, Rio Verde, Tavera, Lome de Coco, Juana Diaz, etc...towns located (and you can verify this easily) in THE MOST DENSELY POPULATED REGION of what is considered the Cibao. These are not locations on the fringe of Cibaeño culture or identity as you are attempting to insinuate. THEY ARE THE CIBAO AND ITS CULTURE. I can fit SFM in a corner of Santiago and no one would notice..and yet, just as JEM pointed out, most of the people I have met from there don't deviate much in appearence from those that stem from the heart of the Cibao, namely the triangle formed by Santiago, Moca, and La Vega and the surrounding towns (and they typically suffer from a second city mentality when it comes to Santiago). Your definition of the Cibao and its' people is very unique to you. But you have the right to see the world as you wish.

BTW Lemba an interesting footnote...in my mom's town of origin, Baitoa, there's a section called San Jose Adentro that's composed of people of mostly African ancestry that have nothing to do with Haiti. They descend from slaves that worked a plantation in the area owned by the Espaillats during the colonial era (It was located in what is now Lopez). It was the only plantation of its type in the region and hence an anamoly. For the most part they've lived in isolation but have begun spreading out within the last generation or so. I don't know of any idiosyncracies they might have that are peculiar to them but it might be worth checking out.

Don't be so quick to jump the gun with all of us, buddy, cuz' if anything, I kind of agree with many things you have said, such as the need to preserve the way in which Spanish is spoken in the Cibao, and the need for a macro Cibao identity (covering the entire north) contrary with the narrow triangle Santiago-La Vega-Moca favored by some. More territory means more votes and more political power in our system, which is always a plus, specially if the north is to keep it's economic preponderance vis-a-vis the eastern touristic complex.

I was not going to name the towns because of all of the perros on this site. But you just released the best areas in DR

Play merengue tipico and people automatically relate it to el Cibao... Play palos??? Not many will relate it to el Cibao

I am from Santiago, my grandmother family is from San Jose de las Matas y algunas de las palabras que supuestamente usamos en RD nunca las he oído, ni tengo la menor idea de que significan, como Abanban, Kin, Lembota, Guimbo, Changa, kutuco. The prefix of a word is only meaningful if it doesn’t correspond to any letter of the Spanish alphabet. Many Spanish words come from Arabic ones, but in no way all words with prefix lest say lam are Arab. My questions; are all of them really of African origin? None of them is of Spanish origin, but bastardized by the Africans?

Let’s take the case of El Salvador blacks were present only in very small numbers, how that small number could have so a great influence in the others that some of their words were incorporated in the general language? Is it not the other way; that the small, powerless, assimilated the others words and culture? I think that a light mulato trying to pass for white would not be using African words.

And that claim that some Salvadorians have curly hair? From 1500 up to day, is impossible to keep pure, some mixing had to have taken place, but some curly hair cannot define the mass of the population, especially if it was established that the African were a small number. How prolific could they be than a small number affected the majority of El Salvador population? In any case while in most of the Cibao campos you would no see a Black face before,let's say 20 years ago, now in some places you only hear Creole. Does that mean that Haitians were there forever and have a noticeable impact in our culture and language? On the other hand, come by in a couple of generations and sure the answer would be different and probably some Lemba would show to prove, without doubt, that they were a powerful force since forever.

Like I've said before, I have many friends from SFM, and they look like any other cibaeno. The average SFM is a mulatto, which is what seperates it from Eastern and Southern Provinces where people on average are Griffes.

Most northern people on average are mulattos. If you tell me that SFM and Samana have the same demographics, then you are on something good. In SFM, my friends are white as hell. I know more light franco-macorisanos than dark ones. So this is why I don't buy into what Lemba is trying to say.

Lemba obviously you are showing palos celebration, so it's not surprising that the people are going to look darker on average. Also, show any urban population in DR, I don't care where it is, Santiago, La Vega, Bonao etc and you're going to get a dark group of people. But pictures don't tell the whole story. The only place that crowds would come out looking euro is RURAL Santiago and probably Bani.