| #661 - Posted 28 August 2009, 12:56 AM | |
Location: United States, Del primer Santiago de America....y el mejor!!! Join date: March 2008 Member #: 498 Posts: 750 | RE: Taino Ancestry Among Dominicans cont. HISPANIOLA AS A SEASONING, PROVISIONING AND PROVING GROUND FOR SPAIN'S EXPANSION INTO THE AMERICAS Seasoning of People on Hispaniola There were also thousands of multiethnic criollos among the "Spanish" conquistadors and settlers who left Hispaniola to conquer and settle the other Caribbean islands and mainland regions. Being able to slip fluidly between and among cultures, they were better able to understand, negotiate with, manipulate and control the new peoples and new conditions they encountered than were their pure Spanish counterparts, especially those who came directly from Iberia.(53) When Juan Ponce de León left Hispaniola to settle the island of Puerto Rico in 1512, for example, he took his family members, friends and fellow soldiers with him, as did Miguel Díaz, who replaced him. Their family members, friends and fellow soldiers included ladinoized Africans, Indians and mixed-blood criollos. The conquistadores and settlers who left Hispaniola for other New World colonies also took along some of their commended Indians, and slaves of Indian, African and mixed descent.(54) These peoples were already "seasoned." That is, they were at least somewhat accustomed not only to the climate, diseases and foods of the Americas, but to living with and working for Spaniards, thus they provided not only their labor, but served as models in the new regions. Another benefit of taking seasoned slaves was that the "weakest" among them had already died off. A letter to the Emperor from Governor Cerratos dated July 15, 1546, explained these benefits as he described how "negros bozales" were first brought to Hispaniola, where they were "instructed and then sold" as workers for the colonies of Tierra Firme.(55) Hispaniola's oidores complained in 1528 that the above scenario happened repeatedly. In the settlement of Cuba, for example, they claimed that Diego Velázquez took along with him most of the populace of seven of the island's pueblos.(56) Seasoned peoples of all ethnic backgrounds from Hispaniola also settled New Spain, a region that included much of today's U.S. southwest. They went to Jamaica with Juan de Esquivel. They went on the expeditions of Diego de Nicuesa, Alonso de Ojeda and others to settle Tierra Firme. They went with Gil González and Diego López de Salzado to settle the Capes of Honduras and Higüeras. They went to Nicaragua, to Colombia, to San Miguel de Gualdape in today's South Carolina with Lucas Vásquez de Ayllón and Fray Antonio de Montesinos, and to the pearl island, Cubagua (today's Isla Margarita). And they went to Peru.(57) Hispaniola as Provisioning Grounds Hispaniola was not only a seasoning grounds for the people who settled and built the other New World colonies, it also was a provisioning grounds. Conquistadores leaving Hispaniola for new territories took cassabe with them. They were accustomed to eating it, and it did not go wormy or moldy as did bizcocho (ships' biscuits made from wheat). And they took horses and cattle, pigs and chickens that were initially imported to Hispaniola, but over time had adapted to the local conditions, hence survived better than animals carried directly from Spain--not to mention that they were much cheaper and easier to get because they were less distant. After new regions were conquered, Hispaniola also provided such things as fruit trees, vegetable seeds, and sugar cane stock for the new colonies.(58) Hispaniola as a Proving Ground Needless to say, the conquistadors and settlers of the new Spanish-American colonies also took with them their basic infrastructures: economic, governmental, judiciary, labor and tribute systems, including the systems of encomienda and slavery as they had evolved and been refined on Hispaniola. They took along their concepts of proper social hierarchy, too. Europeans were at the top of the list of the elites, of course. They took along their concept of proper socio-economic goals: get title to lots of land, Indians and slaves, and thus get rich, but do so using favors accrued through kinship and patron-client linkages, and other peoples' labor. Finally, they took along with them their values and concepts of proper cultural traditions, including dress and personal adornment, property and material possessions, the structure and use of time, religious worship, agriculture and foodways, architecture and use of space, art and artisanry, kin and non-kin relationships, reciprocity and social behavior, and work regimes. The infrastructures, patterns, values and beliefs that the Spanish residents of Hispaniola took with them to the new colonies throughout the Caribbean, South America, Central America and North America had their origins in Europe, but they could not be implanted intact in the new lands. Although the Europeans were politically, socially and economically dominant, Indians and Africans outnumbered Europeans from the outset. And very quickly, mixed-blood peoples, too, outnumbered Europeans. All of the imported European infrastructures, patterns, values and beliefs were tempered and modified--in some instances only slightly, in others much more noticeably--by the conquistadores' and colonists' experiences with other peoples, and vice versa. Hispaniola was a vast "proving ground" for the first-ever meeting and blending of Indians, Spaniards and Africans--and of their cultures. HISPANIOLA, MOTHER OF THE OTHER ISLANDS In a very real sense, then, Hispaniola was the birthplace of what would come to be called “Americans” and of “American” culture—a people and a culture that are tripartite: Indo-Afro-European. Although he did not live beyond the initial conquest of the Caribbean, Peter Martyr D'Anghiera's sobriquet for Hispaniola proved to be very accurate. He called Hispaniola "mother of the other islands."(59) |
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| #662 - Posted 28 August 2009, 6:01 AM | |
Location: Dominican Republic, PROUD & Glad to have a Spanish last name and ancestry Join date: November 2008 Member #: 1609 Posts: 1791 | RE: Taino Ancestry Among Dominicans Quote: yumnuk3 previously said: Are Native American Indians fundamentally Asians? Migration of Asian people into the American continent by Eszter Vladar, Stanford University Most theories say Native American Indians migrated to the American continent from Asia across a land bridge around 11,500 years ago. Yes, this would, in fact, make the first Americans Asians. However, the story gets more complex! As I said, for a long time archeologists believed that all Native Americans were descended from people from Siberia who crossed over to Alaska about 11,500 years ago. They traveled on a land bridge under what is now the Bering Strait. These people were called the Clovis People after an archeological site near Clovis, NM. They first colonized the uninhabited lands of North America. Later they migrated to Central and South America. Scientists were able to figure this out from looking at human and other remains found at archeological sites. Also the language spoken by some Native American people closely resembles ancient Asian languages. This was more convincing evidence for the theory that Native Americans came from Siberia. Now there is evidence that people other than the Clovis People arrived to the Americas at different times and from different places. This evidence comes from looking at lots more archeological sites, and studying the DNA of Native Americans. Some years ago archeologists found the remains of an ancient settlement in Chile. They were surprised to find that it was 12,500 years old. This is much more ancient than the Clovis People! Also, the skeletons found in this site resemble more the people of Polynesia than the inhabitants of Siberia. The theory is that these people may have arrived by boat to America from Polynesia. Now we believe that there were separate groups of people who came to America from Asia. Scientists also found that studying Native Americans' DNA—the genetic blueprint that is passed down through generations—can show where they came from. They did this by looking at mitochondrial DNA (mtDNA). MtDNA comes from a small compartment of the cell called the mitochondrion. This is the place where all the energy is made for the cell. MtDNA is different from the DNA found in the nucleus in that it always comes from the mother. DNA in the nucleus is from both mother and father. Looking at mtDNA lets you compare people across many generations on the mother's side. ![]() Migration of Asian people into the American continent Bird's eye view of the Bering Strait todayScientists looked at mtDNA from many Native Americans and many Asians. They were surprised again. Based on their DNA, Native Americans belong to five different groups. Groups 1-4 are closely related to Asian people. The fifth group is most closely related European or Western Asian people! So it seems most Native Americans are originally from Asia and as you said fundamentally Asian. However, it seems there are some whose origins are from Europe! http://www.thetech.org/genetics/ask.php?id=41 Yumnuk great article! I have heard and read similar information before and resist to completely believe it, just like I never believed that the Tainos were extinct. "However, the story gets more complex! As I said, for a long time archeologists believed that all Native Americans were descended from people from Siberia who crossed over to Alaska about 11,500 years ago. They traveled on a land bridge under what is now the Bering Strait. These people were called the Clovis People after an archeological site near Clovis, NM. They first colonized the uninhabited lands of North America. Later they migrated to Central and South America." A question for Baracutei, if the above hypothesis is the case, why would the Mayan, Aztecs, Incas and other Pre-Columbian cultures who supposedly later migrated to Central and South America excelled at edifying colossal Architectural structures that became wonders of the world? If the above hypothesis is the case, wouldn't make sense that all the scientific advances of the Incas like mummification, astronomical observation, and even city building happened in North America first for the first Native American established themselves in North America first? What do you think about this? "PROUD & Glad to have a Spanish last name and ancestry" |
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| #663 - Posted 28 August 2009, 10:01 AM | |
Location: United States, New York/CT Join date: January 2009 Member #: 1982 Posts: 105 | RE: Taino Ancestry Among Dominicans A question for Baracutei, if the above hypothesis is the case, why would the Mayan, Aztecs, Incas and other Pre-Columbian cultures who supposedly later migrated to Central and South America excelled at edifying colossal Architectural structures that became wonders of the world? If the above hypothesis is the case, wouldn't make sense that all the scientific advances of the Incas like mummification, astronomical observation, and even city building happened in North America first for the first Native American established themselves in North America first? What do you think about this? That’s a good question. I think the most logical answer would have to be the regions and valleys where these civilizations arose. When groups of people begin subsisting primarily from farming, villages expand, populations explode. In North American you had groups such as the “Mound Builders” create huge structures and form complex societies as well. The lands of the Inca, Maya and Aztecs were very fertile. When corn was developed these people saw a rise in populations and went from simple villages to city-states. Also I think that natural resources in these regions allowed them creativities that are not easily obtained in other areas. Thank you for the question! Jorge |
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| #664 - Posted 28 August 2009, 11:10 AM | |
Location: United States Join date: June 2009 Member #: 2977 Posts: 2597 | RE: Taino Ancestry Among Dominicans Quote: Baracutei previously said: A question for Baracutei, if the above hypothesis is the case, why would the Mayan, Aztecs, Incas and other Pre-Columbian cultures who supposedly later migrated to Central and South America excelled at edifying colossal Architectural structures that became wonders of the world? If the above hypothesis is the case, wouldn't make sense that all the scientific advances of the Incas like mummification, astronomical observation, and even city building happened in North America first for the first Native American established themselves in North America first? What do you think about this? That’s a good question. I think the most logical answer would have to be the regions and valleys where these civilizations arose. When groups of people begin subsisting primarily from farming, villages expand, populations explode. In North American you had groups such as the “Mound Builders” create huge structures and form complex societies as well. The lands of the Inca, Maya and Aztecs were very fertile. When corn was developed these people saw a rise in populations and went from simple villages to city-states. Also I think that natural resources in these regions allowed them creativities that are not easily obtained in other areas. Thank you for the question! Jorge To reiterate Baracutei's point, agriculture is one of the single biggest steps in building complex societies. Many, but not all, of the North American Amerindians were hunters/gatherers, horticulturalists, or small scale agriculturalists. As opposed to the 3 big Amerindian societies of South America which practiced large scale agriculture and transforming their land. This of course leads to population boom and bigger settlements as as Baracutei already mentioned which allows for "wonder" building and generally impressive cities. But one must note that their are negatives to such a turn in societal life style changes. Edited on 8/28/2009 11:11 AM by ElTorodeCibao. |
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| #665 - Posted 28 August 2009, 4:01 PM | |
Location: Dominican Republic, PROUD & Glad to have a Spanish last name and ancestry Join date: November 2008 Member #: 1609 Posts: 1791 | RE: Taino Ancestry Among Dominicans Quote: Baracutei previously said: A question for Baracutei, if the above hypothesis is the case, why would the Mayan, Aztecs, Incas and other Pre-Columbian cultures who supposedly later migrated to Central and South America excelled at edifying colossal Architectural structures that became wonders of the world? If the above hypothesis is the case, wouldn't make sense that all the scientific advances of the Incas like mummification, astronomical observation, and even city building happened in North America first for the first Native American established themselves in North America first? What do you think about this? That’s a good question. I think the most logical answer would have to be the regions and valleys where these civilizations arose. When groups of people begin subsisting primarily from farming, villages expand, populations explode. In North American you had groups such as the “Mound Builders” create huge structures and form complex societies as well. The lands of the Inca, Maya and Aztecs were very fertile. When corn was developed these people saw a rise in populations and went from simple villages to city-states. Also I think that natural resources in these regions allowed them creativities that are not easily obtained in other areas. Thank you for the question! Jorge Thank you Baracutei. "PROUD & Glad to have a Spanish last name and ancestry" |
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| #666 - Posted 28 August 2009, 4:14 PM | |
Location: Dominican Republic, PROUD & Glad to have a Spanish last name and ancestry Join date: November 2008 Member #: 1609 Posts: 1791 | RE: Taino Ancestry Among Dominicans Quote: ElTorodeCibao previously said: Quote: Baracutei previously said: A question for Baracutei, if the above hypothesis is the case, why would the Mayan, Aztecs, Incas and other Pre-Columbian cultures who supposedly later migrated to Central and South America excelled at edifying colossal Architectural structures that became wonders of the world? If the above hypothesis is the case, wouldn't make sense that all the scientific advances of the Incas like mummification, astronomical observation, and even city building happened in North America first for the first Native American established themselves in North America first? What do you think about this? That’s a good question. I think the most logical answer would have to be the regions and valleys where these civilizations arose. When groups of people begin subsisting primarily from farming, villages expand, populations explode. In North American you had groups such as the “Mound Builders” create huge structures and form complex societies as well. The lands of the Inca, Maya and Aztecs were very fertile. When corn was developed these people saw a rise in populations and went from simple villages to city-states. Also I think that natural resources in these regions allowed them creativities that are not easily obtained in other areas. Thank you for the question! Jorge To reiterate Baracutei's point, agriculture is one of the single biggest steps in building complex societies. Many, but not all, of the North American Amerindians were hunters/gatherers, horticulturalists, or small scale agriculturalists. As opposed to the 3 big Amerindian societies of South America which practiced large scale agriculture and transforming their land. This of course leads to population boom and bigger settlements as as Baracutei already mentioned which allows for "wonder" building and generally impressive cities. But one must note that their are negatives to such a turn in societal life style changes. Yes, indeed. But it takes more of a complex mind and experience to build such cities with rudimentary tools. My point being that, in my humble opinion the 3 big Amerindian societies flourished more than the North American ones in spite of the first ones to be the latest to inhabit the southern part of the Americas, and that is why I wonder about this theory. We can see in Cuzco and Macchu Picchu the precision in which the indian masons cut the huge boulders to build the city walls and temples. The cuts are so precised, clean and the stone blocks immaculately put together that many wonder if they were done by human hands in such height and remote location. "PROUD & Glad to have a Spanish last name and ancestry" |
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| #667 - Posted 2 September 2009, 6:47 PM | |
Location: United States, ø„¸¨°º¤ø„¸¸„ø¤º°¨¸„ø¤º°¨ Join date: June 2008 Member #: 926 Posts: 3319 | RE: Taino Ancestry Among Dominicans Who Sailed the Ocean Blue? The True Story of Columbus and the Three Little Ships By Emily Ruth Brown -- School Library Journal, 9/1/2009 If your library is like mine, then most of the Columbus-related books in your collection are exactly 17 years old. That’s because 1992 was the 500th anniversary of Columbus’s first voyage, and stacks of children’s books were published in honor of the event. Incidentally, 1992 was also the year I was in fourth grade. I am vaguely aware of learning about Columbus’s voyage in elementary school, but the version of the story I remember goes something like this: Columbus was a very daring navigator. His crew thought they were lost. Then someone yelled “Tierra! Tierra!” and they traded with the Native Americans. The end. I had no idea that Columbus had anything to do with the slave trade or the massacre of Native Americans, nor did I know about his later arrest and return to Spain in chains. Obviously, my elementary school version of this story left many things out—not least of which was the other people who were affected by his voyage. What about the Taino and Caribe people who lived on the islands Columbus explored? What about the Spanish sailors who were left behind to start a colony in the Bahamas? What about the Scandinavian and Asian explorers who came before? What about the African slaves who were soon brought to work the colonial soil? When I was in elementary school, there may not have been many children’s books about these people. But historical discoveries in the 1990s have increased our information about these groups and changed our perception of the consequences of Columbus’s voyage. When I started looking at books that told the story of Columbus’s voyage, the first group of people I focused on was the Native Americans. Many of the books I looked at used the same adjective to describe them: naked. Other words that appeared frequently were “generous,” “naive,” and even “primitive.” These descriptions reflect Columbus’s own observations. Fortunately, there are a number of books that tell the story of Columbus’s arrival from the perspective of Native Americans. Ann Rossi’s Cultures Collide (National Geographic, 2004) begins with a description of how the Spanish must have looked to the Taino: “The Taino lived in a hot climate so they did not need much clothing. The Spaniards wore lots of clothing, shoes, and even armor!” In concise, illustrated chapters, Rossi lists the things the Native Americans and European settlers learned from one another. Rather than putting events in chronological order, this book shows how life changed for both Native Americans and Europeans because of the contact between their cultures. Jim Corrigan’s Europeans and Native Americans (Mason Crest, 2002) takes a more traditional approach, focusing on the conflicts between European explorers and Native American kingdoms. However, the author describes the battles from the perspective of Montezuma and Atahualpa rather than Cortes and Pizarro. Corrigan’s book has a slightly higher reading level, appropriate for upper elementary and middle school readers. These two books are helpful because they cover the same historical events from a different perspective. However, there are also some recent books that include new information. Marc Aronson and John W. Glenn’s The World Made New (National Geographic, 2007) summarizes recent research on the number of people in the Americas in the 1400s and covers the biological and culinary consequences of contact between Americans and Europeans. In fact, this ambitious book claims to look at the entire age of exploration “with the widest possible view” in 64 pages. I think it would have taken a few more pages for the authors to answer all the questions they raise in the introduction, and sometimes they fall back on the European perspective. (Check out chapter headings like “Consequences: How the Explorers Changed the World.”) Nevertheless, this book has plenty of information presented in a mix of time lines, concise text, maps, and images. A book that seems to pick up where The World Made New leaves off is Charles C. Mann’s Before Columbus: The Americas of 1491 (Atheneum, 2009). This adaptation of the author’s adult book synthesizes new historical discoveries into a detailed portrait of the early Americas. It also explores the question of why small groups of Europeans were able to defeat huge, complicated societies like the Aztec and the Inca. Older books blame it on guns, armor, and horses. Mann complicates the theory of European military superiority by citing genetics, disease, geography, and internal politics as factors as well. Columbus is only mentioned on two pages, but that’s the point—this book covers many of the things the conventional Columbus story leaves out. Its length and breadth make it appropriate for a high school collection, but it contains unique information that ought to be available to younger audiences, too. Of course, Native Americans aren’t the only group of people who deserve more than a cameo role in the Columbus story. What do we know about Columbus’s crew, apart from the fact that they were frightened and mutinous? Although Columbus was Italian, the men he sailed with were Spanish, and interactions between Spanish and indigenous populations in the Americas are the original source of Latino culture. James Lincoln Collier’s Christopher Columbus: To the New World (Marshall Cavendish, 2007) provides some names and faces for the Spanish sailors. For example, he introduces readers to Pinzon, a Spanish captain who secured and supplied two of the ships for the voyage, convinced the hesitant local sailors to sign on, and pressured Columbus to change course so they made landfall in the Bahamas. If Pinzon hadn’t died before making it to the Spanish court, he might have received as much attention as Columbus. Roger E. Hernández’s Early Explorations: The 1500s (Marshall Cavendish, 2008) points out that American history books often give more credit to English-speaking settlers than Spanish-speaking ones, but the names of many states and geographic features underline the Spanish influence. Hernández does a clever dance between celebrating the Spanish culture of the conquistadors while acknowledging that “even as they brought Western ideas to the areas they explored, they conquered those areas with much bloodshed and abuse of Native Americans.” This book is sure to spark debate in high school classes when contrasted with books that sharply criticize the conquistadors. Another group of people sometimes left out of the Columbus story—and sometimes treated as myths—are the explorers who came before Columbus. Russell Freedman’s Who Was First? Discovering the Americas (Clarion, 2007) covers Chinese and Viking explorers and offers theories about the first humans to populate the Americas. In fact, Freedman works backward, starting with Columbus and concluding with a chapter on archaeological evidence of ancient Americans. His narrative style, and the way he debunks myths and describes ocean voyages, makes for a thrilling read, and the sepia-toned design of the book reminds me of an old leather-bound folio. Coming from a Scandinavian family, I grew up with a “Leif Landed First” magnet on my fridge, so I was thrilled to learn that Leif Erickson was more than a folk hero. It’s just as important for students to learn that, in the early 1400s, Chinese explorers sailed armadas of treasure ships to faraway ports in Africa and the Middle East—maybe even the Americas. Freedman points out that Columbus’s voyage is considered special because it was followed by sustained contact between two continents—not because it was the first of its kind. There’s one more group of people who were immediately affected by Columbus’s voyage: Africans. The slave trade already existed in Europe, but it was Columbus who created a new market for it in the Americas. He started by enslaving Native Americans, and soon the colonists under his governance were importing slaves from Africa. James Haskins and Kathleen Benson’s Bound for America: The Forced Migration of Africans to the New World (HarperCollins, 1999) is the best book I know for connecting slavery to the Columbus story. It begins by comparing Europe in 1492 with Africa in 1492. What’s most startling are the similarities: both continents had about the same population, composed mostly of farmers, ruled by kings, and dotted with major cities. But the slave trade that started in the 1400s has left the two continents in very different situations 500 years later. If you put these books together, you can see that the story of Columbus’s first voyage is a global story that can be told from a number of perspectives. Some of those clashing perspectives are expressed within the borders of my own city. Just this year, the university on the East side of town changed the name of their October recess from “Columbus Day Weekend” to “Fall Break” in response to students’ protest. That same weekend, the Italian neighborhood on the other side of town will again honor Columbus with a three-day festival and parade. Librarians need to be prepared to answer reference questions about why Columbus is such a controversial figure. To do this, we must evaluate our collections and look for parts of the story in a number of places. In my collection, I found related books in the 920s (Biographies), the 970s (History of North America), 380s (Commerce, Communications and Transportation), 910s (Geography and Travel), and 390s (Customs, Etiquette and Folklore). While some parts of our collection are self-service (the books on dinosaurs and crafts are pretty easy to locate), there’s a big role for librarians in helping students research Columbus. That role begins with building a balanced collection. |
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| #668 - Posted 11 September 2009, 12:08 PM | |
Location: United States Join date: June 2009 Member #: 2977 Posts: 2597 | RE: Taino Ancestry Among Dominicans Quote: cibaeño75 previously said: Quote: Manhattanite previously said: Thanks for the article Lautaro. I've been looking at these DNA tests as I'm curious about my family's own history. Most seem to run from $800-$1500 for the entire range of tests along with documentation and consultation with one of their researchers. Has anyone here been curious enough to try it and was it worth the money? I don't know if they're still doing it but National Geographic was doing DNA testing for the Human Genome Project for cheap compared to the prices you cited. A 100 bucks a peice for maternal and paternal results but you might not get the accuracy Lautaro was alluding to. They'll tell you, though, where your genetic markers originated but won't shed to much light on admixture. I was sifting through this thread and found this post by Ciby. I saw a commercial for this and then went to the website about it. While this can be interesting and cheap relatively speaking, once I realized it will not tell you admixture I lost interest I guess. Does anyone know of or can provide a link to admixture testing? |
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| #669 - Posted 11 September 2009, 12:14 PM | |
Location: United States Join date: June 2009 Member #: 2977 Posts: 2597 | RE: Taino Ancestry Among Dominicans post moved to better pastures. Edited on 9/11/2009 12:16 PM by ElTorodeCibao. |
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| #670 - Posted 11 September 2009, 12:30 PM | |
Location: United States, New York/CT Join date: January 2009 Member #: 1982 Posts: 105 | RE: Taino Ancestry Among Dominicans The test that gives you biogeigraphical percentages is an Autosomal Nuclear DNA test. The best company for this is DNAPrint. All the best Baracutei |
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