| #11 - Posted 12 June 2012, 6:12 AM | |
Location: Australia Join date: October 2010 Member #: 6074 Posts: 8629 | RE: On Australia's Aborigines: What's the True Story Quote: Atabey previously said: Quote: tschotschua previously said: Ata, we should never expect Roy-Stone to outer about this I did asked him the same question for so long time ago Roy your are nowhere to be found "In February 2008, Mr Rudd apologised to Aboriginal people for centuries of injustice, including the "stolen generations" of indigenous children taken from their families and placed in foster care with white families or institutions. The apology was widely applauded at the time but Mr Rudd's centre-left government has since been criticised for failing to follow up the gesture by improving the live of Aborigines, Australia's most impoverished community." Not even some of the Whites have been protected: "Former wards of the state have told of how they were forced into "slave labour", sodomised, starved and beaten during the years they spent in government-run institutions. Many of the British children, sent to Australia between 1920 to 1970 to populate the colony with "good white stock", were put on ships without their parents being informed. Many believed they were orphans, but this was often not true." Can you please provide the name of just one genuine "stolen generation" Aborigine? Also the date of when any Dominican president has apologized on behalf of the nation, to the "descendents" of Tainos like tschotschua? "Arguing on the internet is like running in the Special Olympics... Even if you win, you're still retarded." |
Post IP/Country: 203.214.47.3* / AU | |
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| #12 - Posted 12 June 2012, 6:52 AM | |
Location: Australia Join date: October 2010 Member #: 6074 Posts: 8629 | RE: On Australia's Aborigines: What's the True Story Eddie Mabo was not an Australian Aborigine - he was a Torres Strait Islander. They are culturally and genetically linked to Melanesian peoples and those of Papua New Guinea. Although the Torres Strait Islands are part of the Australian state of Queensland, the indigenous people are really Papuan. "Arguing on the internet is like running in the Special Olympics... Even if you win, you're still retarded." |
Post IP/Country: 203.214.47.3* / AU | |
| #13 - Posted 12 June 2012, 7:05 AM | |
Location: Australia Join date: October 2010 Member #: 6074 Posts: 8629 | RE: On Australia's Aborigines: What's the True Story Interesting you should quote the Aboriginal activist, Charles Perkins, who despite his people remaining impoverished, died a very wealthy man. Edited on 6/12/2012 7:05 AM by RoyStone. "Arguing on the internet is like running in the Special Olympics... Even if you win, you're still retarded." |
Post IP/Country: 203.214.47.3* / AU | |
| #14 - Posted 12 June 2012, 7:14 AM | |
Location: Australia Join date: October 2010 Member #: 6074 Posts: 8629 | RE: On Australia's Aborigines: What's the True Story Interesting to see the "Aboriginal Australia" flag posted here. Who designed it, when and what does it mean? It is not what it seems. To balance the views expressed by those benefiting from the Aboriginal "sorry industry", I suggest reading historian Keith Windshuttle, journalist Andrew Bolt, politician Pauline Hanson and businessman Hugh Morgan. Edited on 6/12/2012 7:31 AM by RoyStone. "Arguing on the internet is like running in the Special Olympics... Even if you win, you're still retarded." |
Post IP/Country: 203.214.47.3* / AU | |
| #15 - Posted 12 June 2012, 9:06 AM | |
Location: United States, New York City Join date: February 2008 Member #: 411 Posts: 6479 | RE: On Australia's Aborigines: What's the True Story Quote: RoyStone previously said: Quote: cibaeño75 previously said: Roystone quips: "Your ancestors enslaved then exterminated the Tainos." An ignorant statement at best. A flat out lie at worse. Explain, then, Mr. Stone, why there are individuals such as myself walking around with Amerindian genetic markers if our ancestors "exterminated" the Tainos. The Tainos are among our ancestors and that is fact. "Amerindian genetic markers"? There are also people today (especially amongst Australian Aborigines) with some Neanderthal mitochondrial DNA. Are you saying then that Neanderthals did not die out 20,000 years ago? My distant ancestors were Homo erectus in Africa, despite the fact they became extinct about 1.3 million years ago. Get real! Again, your ignorance knows no bounds..the tainos did not hail from some distant epoch before the last age nor are they the echoes of some ancient migration..they were a cohesive, culturally independent people until the VERY recent past and not only are they our ancestors in the physical sense(there are many Dominicans walking around that, judhing solely from phenotype, are unquestionably of Amerindian ancestry) but in the cultural as well..many of our words, farming techniques, foods, etc. stem from the tainos....but yet you are an expert on things Dominican so you feel that you can dictate to us what is indeed that we are. You get real. Get a clue.Get some knowledge. You are sorely lacking in this department. "To learn who rules over you simply find out who you are not allowed to criticize" - Voltaire |
Post IP/Country: 161.185.158.2* / US | |
| #16 - Posted 12 June 2012, 9:08 AM | |
Location: United States, New York City Join date: February 2008 Member #: 411 Posts: 6479 | RE: On Australia's Aborigines: What's the True Story Quote: RoyStone previously said: Eddie Mabo was not an Australian Aborigine - he was a Torres Strait Islander. They are culturally and genetically linked to Melanesian peoples and those of Papua New Guinea. Although the Torres Strait Islands are part of the Australian state of Queensland, the indigenous people are really Papuan. He is stil an aboriginal in the strictest sense of the word that your government screwed over only to posthumously honor him. Spare us the whitewash. "To learn who rules over you simply find out who you are not allowed to criticize" - Voltaire |
Post IP/Country: 161.185.158.2* / US | |
| #17 - Posted 12 June 2012, 9:10 AM | |
Location: United States, New York City Join date: February 2008 Member #: 411 Posts: 6479 | RE: On Australia's Aborigines: What's the True Story Quote: RoyStone previously said: Quote: Atabey previously said: Quote: tschotschua previously said: Ata, we should never expect Roy-Stone to outer about this I did asked him the same question for so long time ago Roy your are nowhere to be found "In February 2008, Mr Rudd apologised to Aboriginal people for centuries of injustice, including the "stolen generations" of indigenous children taken from their families and placed in foster care with white families or institutions. The apology was widely applauded at the time but Mr Rudd's centre-left government has since been criticised for failing to follow up the gesture by improving the live of Aborigines, Australia's most impoverished community." Not even some of the Whites have been protected: "Former wards of the state have told of how they were forced into "slave labour", sodomised, starved and beaten during the years they spent in government-run institutions. Many of the British children, sent to Australia between 1920 to 1970 to populate the colony with "good white stock", were put on ships without their parents being informed. Many believed they were orphans, but this was often not true." Can you please provide the name of just one genuine "stolen generation" Aborigine? Also the date of when any Dominican president has apologized on behalf of the nation, to the "descendents" of Tainos like tschotschua? Why would the Dominican state apoligize for the near decimation of the Tainos? That's preposterous. That was the work of Iberian Spaniards. Do people think before they post on here? I often wonder... Edited on 6/12/2012 9:10 AM by cibaeño75. "To learn who rules over you simply find out who you are not allowed to criticize" - Voltaire |
Post IP/Country: 161.185.158.2* / US | |
| #18 - Posted 12 June 2012, 9:19 AM | |
Location: Australia Join date: October 2010 Member #: 6074 Posts: 8629 | RE: On Australia's Aborigines: What's the True Story Quote: cibaeño75 previously said: Quote: RoyStone previously said: Quote: cibaeño75 previously said: Roystone quips: "Your ancestors enslaved then exterminated the Tainos." An ignorant statement at best. A flat out lie at worse. Explain, then, Mr. Stone, why there are individuals such as myself walking around with Amerindian genetic markers if our ancestors "exterminated" the Tainos. The Tainos are among our ancestors and that is fact. "Amerindian genetic markers"? There are also people today (especially amongst Australian Aborigines) with some Neanderthal mitochondrial DNA. Are you saying then that Neanderthals did not die out 20,000 years ago? My distant ancestors were Homo erectus in Africa, despite the fact they became extinct about 1.3 million years ago. Get real! Again, your ignorance knows no bounds..the tainos did not hail from some distant epoch before the last age nor are they the echoes of some ancient migration..they were a cohesive, culturally independent people until the VERY recent past and not only are they our ancestors in the physical sense(there are many Dominicans walking around that, judhing solely from phenotype, are unquestionably of Amerindian ancestry) but in the cultural as well..many of our words, farming techniques, foods, etc. stem from the tainos....but yet you are an expert on things Dominican so you feel that you can dictate to us what is indeed that we are. You get real. Get a clue.Get some knowledge. You are sorely lacking in this department. Post a photo of a phenotypically Taino currently "walking around" in the Dominican Republic and I'll eat my hat. Post evidence that Tainos were not decimated by Spanish colonists, enslaved, tortured, forced to pay gold tributes, then subsequently apologized to by the descendents of Spanish colonists, then I'll eat your hat too. "Arguing on the internet is like running in the Special Olympics... Even if you win, you're still retarded." |
Post IP/Country: 203.214.47.3* / AU | |
| #19 - Posted 12 June 2012, 9:28 AM | |
Location: United States, New York City Join date: February 2008 Member #: 411 Posts: 6479 | RE: On Australia's Aborigines: What's the True Story Quote: RoyStone previously said: Quote: cibaeño75 previously said: Quote: RoyStone previously said: Quote: cibaeño75 previously said: Roystone quips: "Your ancestors enslaved then exterminated the Tainos." An ignorant statement at best. A flat out lie at worse. Explain, then, Mr. Stone, why there are individuals such as myself walking around with Amerindian genetic markers if our ancestors "exterminated" the Tainos. The Tainos are among our ancestors and that is fact. "Amerindian genetic markers"? There are also people today (especially amongst Australian Aborigines) with some Neanderthal mitochondrial DNA. Are you saying then that Neanderthals did not die out 20,000 years ago? My distant ancestors were Homo erectus in Africa, despite the fact they became extinct about 1.3 million years ago. Get real! Again, your ignorance knows no bounds..the tainos did not hail from some distant epoch before the last age nor are they the echoes of some ancient migration..they were a cohesive, culturally independent people until the VERY recent past and not only are they our ancestors in the physical sense(there are many Dominicans walking around that, judhing solely from phenotype, are unquestionably of Amerindian ancestry) but in the cultural as well..many of our words, farming techniques, foods, etc. stem from the tainos....but yet you are an expert on things Dominican so you feel that you can dictate to us what is indeed that we are. You get real. Get a clue.Get some knowledge. You are sorely lacking in this department. Post a photo of a phenotypically Taino currently "walking around" in the Dominican Republic and I'll eat my hat. Post evidence that Tainos were not decimated by Spanish colonists, enslaved, tortured, forced to pay gold tributes, then subsequently apologized to by the descendents of Spanish colonists, then I'll eat your hat too. I'm all about eradicating ignorance wherever possible so I thank you for this opportunity and I suggest ketchup with your hat to make it go down easier. http://www.smithsonianmag.com/people-places/What-Became-of-the-Taino.html Read that article and learn. That's the Smithsonian, not some obscure organization located in Sydney. There's a thread here concerning Taino ancestry among the Dominican population. Many members have posted pics of relatives, neighbors, friends and acquaintances with strong Taino features. Go ahead. Use your mouse and click away and enjoy this facet of the Dominican people that experience has denied you. There is something that you fail to grasp. We are indeed the descendants of the Spanish colonists you alluded to. As are we descended from the Africans they brought over..as well as the Tainos that they almost eradicated. We are a blend of all these things, some of us in varying degrees, granted. Edited on 6/12/2012 9:40 AM by cibaeño75. "To learn who rules over you simply find out who you are not allowed to criticize" - Voltaire |
Post IP/Country: 161.185.158.2* / US | |
| #20 - Posted 12 June 2012, 11:08 AM | |
Location: France, London / Paris Join date: January 2010 Member #: 4471 Posts: 735 | RE: On Australia's Aborigines: What's the True Story We should class the first english convicts sent to Australia and the Spanish conquistadores in the same category : killers and Imperialists * English destroyed the Tasmanians and almost succeed with the "Aboriginals" * Spanish almost destroyed the natives of la hispaniola ( Tainos, Ciboneyes, Ciguayos and Macorixes , the Taino language being the link between all groups but they had different languages) and replaced them through a carribbean slave trade even if all the groups were not totally killed by war and disease * Native Indian ancestry in the DR , Cuba or PR is a reality no doubt : but we must be precise about the origins of this native indians ancestry. Were they natives or imported from the others islands or the main continent ? One of the most famous caribbean slave trader (those who tried to replace the native indians of la hispaniola by native indians slaves from venezuela, guyana i.e the original land of the tainos) was Lucas Vasquez de Ayllon. 1. According to Dominicans scholars like : * Hugo Tolentino Dipp : see the full list of these Spanish slave traders who created Joint Ventures to capture Native Indian slaves from the neighbouring island (Bahamas, Curaçao) or the mainland ( Venezuela, Guyana, Florida) in order to re-populate la Hispaniola, Cuba and PR ; in "Raza e Historia en Santo Domingo" * Juan Bosch : "Composicion Social Dominicana" * Juan Bosch : "De Colombo a Castro" , Vol 1 * Carlos Esteban Deive : "Los Guerrilleros Negros" * Carlos Esteban Deive : "Vodu Y Magia en Santo Domingo" 2. Cuban Scholars like : * José Antonio Saco : "Historia de la esclavitud de los indios en el Nuevo Mundo" * Francisco Ortiz : "Hampa Afro Cubana" 3. Mexicans : * Gonzalo Aguirre Beltran : "La poblacion Negra de Mexico" 4. Puerto Ricans : * Jalil Sued Badillo (with A. Lopez Cantos) : "Puerto Rico Negro" , with the example of Anton Mexia a free Afro-spanish encomendero (with native indian slaves or Naborias) in La Hispaniola and first account testimonies of that time, the like of : * Bartholomé Las Casas : Historia de las Indias * Gonzalo Fernandez de Oviedo y Valdés : La Historia general de las Indias The 2 last books can be found in internet archives website : http://archive.org/index.php The native indian ancestry in la Hispaniola , Cuba and PR can be explained MOSTLY by the carribean slave trade organized by the spanish to replace the natives ( i.e 100 % native indians), of these islands; which they ALMOST wiped out out by war, slave labor, disease and bad treatments , EVEN if they did not suceed to kill all of them . So to recap current inhabitants of the DR have Spanish (and others European) ancestry + Native Indians + Africans * Their European ancestors : they were mainly free people , few were slaves, many were convicts (forzados) at the beginning of the colonization process, * Their Native Indians ancestors: most were the slaves kidnapped in the neighbouring islands (Bahamas, Curaçao) and the mainland (Venezuela, Guyana, Florida) to replace the original natives of la Hispaniola, few were the original inhabitants of that island (Tainos, Ciboneyes, Ciguayos and Macorixes ) * Their African ancestors : most of them were slaves from the Senegambian region, and the actual Congo/Angola region (and others), some of them were free blacks (Anton Mexia's example) Not counting the first guanches or aboriginals of the Canaries Islands who arrived as slaves in La Hispaniola in the early 16th century ( See Deive's Index in "Los Guerrilleros Negros" with the first cedula in 1522 against the slave revolts who speaks about Negros, Canarios and Blancos as part of the slave population) , along with White and African slaves, and also North Africans slaves (Berbericos) Edited on 7/23/2012 12:08 PM by Nehesy. Tatico Henriquez es el mejor !!!! |
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