Dominican Today Forum » Living in the DR » General Info » PUERTO RICO: STATEHOOD OR INDEPENDANCE, WHAT WOULD THIS MEAN FOR DR ??
#281 - Posted 16 December 2009, 1:43 PM
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RE: PUERTO RICO: STATEHOOD OR INDEPENDANCE, WHAT WOULD THIS MEAN FOR DR ??
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MedinaNYC previously said:

Right, it is easy for a person to forget a language when there are not obligated to use it every day or use it very little, although I do use it every day. I would like to see more Puerto Ricans make a conscience effort to speak Spanish more and educate their children about the language as well. To that point I think Dominicans do a great job, atleast here in NYC.

Very valid points Medina! And I do believe that there will come a time, that there will also be Dominicans who after a few generations, will no longer be teaching their kids Spanish. Come to think about it, it happens with every Hispanic nationality. The Mexican-Americans, Puerto Rican-Americans, Cuban-Americans, etc. Since we're[Dominicans] like the most recent fast growing group, we will soon fall down the line. I just hope that people also realize that yes we are in America & all. But then again, Americas culture was enriched by immigration with all cultures from everywhere. I just hope that not only for us Dominicans, but for every Latino in the U.S. to continue praising their culture here the same way the Jews, Irish, Italians, etc. do
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#282 - Posted 17 December 2009, 2:32 AM
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RE: PUERTO RICO: STATEHOOD OR INDEPENDANCE, WHAT WOULD THIS MEAN FOR DR ??
Quote:
Glimmertwin previously said:

Quote:
MedinaNYC previously said:

Right, it is easy for a person to forget a language when there are not obligated to use it every day or use it very little, although I do use it every day. I would like to see more Puerto Ricans make a conscience effort to speak Spanish more and educate their children about the language as well. To that point I think Dominicans do a great job, atleast here in NYC.

This just made me ask myself, and sorry to go off tangent here for a second, but did the Haitians always speak Creole? If not, what did they speak ? Was it always so similar to French?


How was Creole formed?
In a way, Creole resulted from African slaves' efforts to speak the French that they heard when they arrived in the colony of Saint-Domingue (now Haiti). Slaves came from all over West Africa and spoke many different languages. On any one plantation, several African languages were spoken. Also at that time, most of the French people in Saint-Domingue spoke French dialects and everyday spoken French. That type of French, called Popular (common people's) French, differed a lot from the French spoken by the ruling classes in France called Standard French. The slaves, seldom able to communicate with fellow slaves in a common African tongue, tried to learn Popular French. Slaves who arrived later, especially field slaves who had little contact with French speakers, tried to learn the approximative variety of Popular French the other slaves spoke rather than Popular French itself. Over time, this approximative form of French became more and more different from the French varieties and came to be recognized as a language in its own right--Creole. It is also interesting that it was picked up by the whites and became the language used by all those born in the colony.
More than 90% of the vocabulary of Creole is of French origin, yet French people can't understand Creole. This is because the grammars of the two languages are very different. Also, Creole has kept the original meaning of Popular French words whereas in France these words were replaced by words from Standard French
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#283 - Posted 17 December 2009, 9:50 AM
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RE: PUERTO RICO: STATEHOOD OR INDEPENDANCE, WHAT WOULD THIS MEAN FOR DR ??
Quote:
MIRABUENO previously said:

Quote:
Glimmertwin previously said:

Quote:
MedinaNYC previously said:

Right, it is easy for a person to forget a language when there are not obligated to use it every day or use it very little, although I do use it every day. I would like to see more Puerto Ricans make a conscience effort to speak Spanish more and educate their children about the language as well. To that point I think Dominicans do a great job, atleast here in NYC.

This just made me ask myself, and sorry to go off tangent here for a second, but did the Haitians always speak Creole? If not, what did they speak ? Was it always so similar to French?


How was Creole formed?
In a way, Creole resulted from African slaves' efforts to speak the French that they heard when they arrived in the colony of Saint-Domingue (now Haiti). Slaves came from all over West Africa and spoke many different languages. On any one plantation, several African languages were spoken. Also at that time, most of the French people in Saint-Domingue spoke French dialects and everyday spoken French. That type of French, called Popular (common people's) French, differed a lot from the French spoken by the ruling classes in France called Standard French. The slaves, seldom able to communicate with fellow slaves in a common African tongue, tried to learn Popular French. Slaves who arrived later, especially field slaves who had little contact with French speakers, tried to learn the approximative variety of Popular French the other slaves spoke rather than Popular French itself. Over time, this approximative form of French became more and more different from the French varieties and came to be recognized as a language in its own right--Creole. It is also interesting that it was picked up by the whites and became the language used by all those born in the colony.
More than 90% of the vocabulary of Creole is of French origin, yet French people can't understand Creole. This is because the grammars of the two languages are very different. Also, Creole has kept the original meaning of Popular French words whereas in France these words were replaced by words from Standard French

Your explanation of Creole is very limited and one dimensional and reflects your lack of knowledge of the world .. ....Come back with a better definition of the origin of Creole after you do some research
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#284 - Posted 19 December 2009, 2:01 PM
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RE: PUERTO RICO: STATEHOOD OR INDEPENDANCE, WHAT WOULD THIS MEAN FOR DR ??
Quote:
Blutarsky previously said:

Your explanation of Creole is very limited and one dimensional and reflects your lack of knowledge of the world .. ....Come back with a better definition of the origin of Creole after you do some research

Thanks Mira...if Goulet had more in depth knowledge , he should of shared.

As for the topic, It has always puzzled me why the PRicans always feared their own independance. Most nations battle blood, sweat and tears to be independant , but there lies a phenomon in PR's case. More so, when the US has been so openly degrading to the PRicans, which can viewed in rosie's documentary (see trailer below).

I have also entertained the hypothetical , that if PR had been a divided island, like our Island, would they maintain the same level of fear of independance? or is it more along the fear of chanigng the status quo?

In any event, I think that independance would most likely be detrimental to DR bcs all subsidies would likely be removed and they would become more competitive.

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#285 - Posted 19 December 2009, 4:15 PM
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RE: PUERTO RICO: STATEHOOD OR INDEPENDANCE, WHAT WOULD THIS MEAN FOR DR ??
wow that video is so true, ive always also wondered why puertoricans more then any other hispanic race ive known are always extremly proud and always looking for an exuse to wave their flag around but considering everything that the video mentioned i would too.

and even with all the wrong the US has done upon this island their people are still willing to live under american rule then be their own independent people ive never understood that.
idk i would rather see puerto rico be their own independent country some time in the future, even if most of the people living there want otherwise.
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#286 - Posted 19 December 2009, 4:19 PM
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RE: PUERTO RICO: STATEHOOD OR INDEPENDANCE, WHAT WOULD THIS MEAN FOR DR ??
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S1CAR1O previously said:

wow that video is so true, ive always also wondered why puertoricans more then any other hispanic race ive known are always extremly proud and always looking for an exuse to wave their flag around but considering everything that the video mentioned i would too.

and even with all the wrong the US has done upon this island their people are still willing to live under american rule then be their own independent people ive never understood that.
idk i would rather see puerto rico be their own independent country some time in the future, even if most of the people living there want otherwise.

That's when you mind your own business. Nobody likes other people sticking their noses on their stuff, And you probably don't either.
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#287 - Posted 19 December 2009, 6:22 PM
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RE: PUERTO RICO: STATEHOOD OR INDEPENDANCE, WHAT WOULD THIS MEAN FOR DR ??
Quote:
S1CAR1O previously said:

wow that video is so true, ive always also wondered why puertoricans more then any other hispanic race ive known are always extremly proud and always looking for an exuse to wave their flag around but considering everything that the video mentioned i would too.

and even with all the wrong the US has done upon this island their people are still willing to live under american rule then be their own independent people ive never understood that.
idk i would rather see puerto rico be their own independent country some time in the future, even if most of the people living there want otherwise.


I think Puertoricans are afraid of their economic conditions and crime worsening by large if they become an independent country. I don't know how true the welfare numbers are for Puerto Rico but their fears are probably justified. However, if Puerto Ricans want to kept their identity and culture in tact for the future...I think independence is the only way. I see Puerto Rico becoming a state in the future just like Hawaii and Alaska did.
Edited on 12/19/2009 6:24 PM by mandouafrika.
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#288 - Posted 20 December 2009, 1:15 AM
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RE: PUERTO RICO: STATEHOOD OR INDEPENDANCE, WHAT WOULD THIS MEAN FOR DR ??
Quote:
mandouafrika previously said:

Quote:
S1CAR1O previously said:

wow that video is so true, ive always also wondered why puertoricans more then any other hispanic race ive known are always extremly proud and always looking for an exuse to wave their flag around but considering everything that the video mentioned i would too.

and even with all the wrong the US has done upon this island their people are still willing to live under american rule then be their own independent people ive never understood that.
idk i would rather see puerto rico be their own independent country some time in the future, even if most of the people living there want otherwise.


I think Puertoricans are afraid of their economic conditions and crime worsening by large if they become an independent country. I don't know how true the welfare numbers are for Puerto Rico but their fears are probably justified. However, if Puerto Ricans want to kept their identity and culture in tact for the future...I think independence is the only way. I see Puerto Rico becoming a state in the future just like Hawaii and Alaska did.


Puerto Ricans have been made to believe that if they become they would be worse off... but that's what the great powers want them to believe... All imperial nations, tell their subjects the same thing... Dominicans believed it too, when some our people thought us incapable from fending off the haitians in the 19th century, and they reattached the DR to the Spain... And today we know better.... Juan Gonzales talks about how puerto rico would benefit by having its freedom.... "Harvest of Empire"

Edited on 12/20/2009 1:16 AM by CarlosFranco.
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#289 - Posted 20 December 2009, 3:13 PM
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RE: PUERTO RICO: STATEHOOD OR INDEPENDANCE, WHAT WOULD THIS MEAN FOR DR ??
Who is this Juan Gonzalez you speak about?
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#290 - Posted 20 December 2009, 10:09 PM
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RE: PUERTO RICO: STATEHOOD OR INDEPENDANCE, WHAT WOULD THIS MEAN FOR DR ??

He's a puerto rican writer and journalist... he host Democracy Now, tv show.... Anyhow i read him in my latin diaspora class and i enjoyed his book alot... His book Harvest of Empire, redefines our position in these lands...


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