We are getting all the bills together so when the spanking new president of the USA swears in and comes to us with his long list of Haitian demands we can always say to him:
Ok all that is fine, why don't you just pay the bill that the DR has spent for the Haitians health for the last 10 years and then we will talk? OK?

Food fight

why not better spend it on your own Dominican people!! ??

Sonia pierre and Edwin paraison) to Dominicans (you are racist and xenophohic), you don't like us, We need some love

The cost of illegal immigration .

13. Deportation: The National Policy Institute, 'estimated that the total cost of mass deportation would be between $206 and $230 billion or an average cost of between $41 and $46 billion annually over a five year period.'
http://www.nationalpolicyinstitute.org/pdf/deportation.pdf

14. Remittances: In 2006 illegal aliens sent home $45 billion in remittances back to their countries of origin.
http://www.rense.com/general75/niht.htm

The total cost is a whopping $ 338.3 BILLION DOLLARS A YEAR



According to this survey the amount spent or lost in wages in the US would be about half of what the bailout plan was.


http://endiana.blogspot.com/2008/02/cost-of-illegal-immigration.html

as the jobs disappear they will be coming home on there own

So the DR shelled about USD $1.6 million .

President elect Obama has a lot more to worry about than Haiti-DR problems for now.

One way to absorb this cost would be to encourage the employers of the ilegal and legal workers to provide basic health insurance.

1-There are 2 million Haitians in DR (> 1.4 millions are illegals).
2-More than 100,000 illegal Haitians are crossing over to DR per year.
3-The illegal Haitians are displacing the native from lands (private/public), from jobs (construction, agriculture, and tourism), and from public subsidies (health care, public cafeterias, primary public schools, and even subsidized housing).
4-The illegals are illegaly planting an erosive and corrosive foreign culture (Creole, Voodoo, Kompas, even soccer, etc.).
5-Approximately 211 Haitians are born in DR every month, the cost absorbed by the DR!

Good point GC ..

Who is this GC who doesn't see the destruction of DR brought by Haiti dumping its misery to DR and treating DR like a backyard where they throw in their garbage?

OndeVert
Or should I just say "greenwave".
So what do you suggest the DR do?
Ethnic cleansing? Napalm? Crucifixions?
Suggest some solutions......

10. Incarceration: $3 million dollars per day are spent to incarcerate illegal aliens. http://transcripts.cnn.com/TRANSCRIPTS/0604/01/ldt.01.html

11. Incarceration: 30% percent of all federal prison inmates are illegal aliens. http://transcripts.cnn.com/TRANSCRIPTS/0604/01/ldt.01.html

12. Border crossing: During the year of 2005 there were 4 to 10 million illegal aliens that crossed our southern border also, as many as 19,500 illegal aliens from terrorist countries. Millions of pounds of drugs, cocaine, meth, heroin and marijuana, crossed into the U. S from the southern
border. Homeland Security Report: http://tinyurl.com/t9sht

GC is wrong! Haitian women are going to DR not because there are jobs, they do it because their children could have a better future than the one the will get in Haiti where they see slavery, prostitution, abuse, abandoment, and despair! The children will continue to come to DR! Lack of jobs is not a sufficient deterring mechanism and for it to work we must include closing the border, deport the illegals, fining the people who hire and/or assist the illegals to violate the 285 and DOminican sovereignty, etc.!

Actually the only thing they can do is tighten up that dam border for now so the problem doesn't keep growing exponentially.

No violence please..

The only time the Haitians stopped crossing illegaly into DR was from 1937 to 1961 during the Trujillo epoch! Meaning the Masacre river event (in other words: Violence) is the only language these animals understand! Human rights and othe international laws are giving the moral impetus for the neighbors to violate Dominican sovereingty and Dominican economic equilibrium! USE VIOLENCE TO STOP ILLEGALITY! IT ALWAYS WORK!

Treating this problem by peacefull means have been tried for 30 years and have not worked!

Well I am posting stuff about the USA if anyone from the DR government is paying attention then those stats alone should be enough to for them to realize how bad it could get if they don't get their border under control.

But soon enough the jobs that are being filled by inexpensive illegals will be sought after by Dominicans. As it will be in the USA, there is no disgrace in picking fruit in fact it is very fullfilling.

Nor should it be a disgrace for a Domincan to put on a tool belt or pick up a broom or a shovel.

This could very well be the future so my advice is to get used to it.

Everybody knows that in 1937, the Haitians learned not to violate Dominican sovereingty! Only the internationals punished DR for doing the correct thing. 1937 delayed the almost irreversible Haitian invasion or reconquest of DR!

Generoso, then answer this: If we let the status quo to continue, would you expect 3 or 4 million Haitians in DR by 2020? Is this a responsible action to be left for the future generation to solve or are we okaying the destruction of the Dominican identity? We must do a Hitler style cleasing now or forget DR, it will not exist!!!!!!!!!!!

This can not be solve by peacefull means. The illegal haitians, if left alone, we'll demand legalization, political power, and they will transform DR into a satellite of Haiti! WE MUST STOP THIS NOW!

Your infatuation and admiration with the cruel and despotic Trujillo regime does not echo in my yard.
The Haitian problem has to be addressed by procuring international aid and investment from many
donor countries so that Haitians need not have to export their poor to the DR.
Violence genders more violence and is an unending draining and negative circle. We must stop the violence and find peaceful solutions. Haitians are human beings too, we may not like them, we may even despise them, but that sentiment does not give us a right to annilliate them like cockroaches.
Live by the sword and you will die by the sword.

G, When the spanking new president of the US comes to you with his Haitian demands, I'm sure he will bring with him the medical health bill for illegal Dominicans in the US. Which bill do you think is higher?

Illegal immigration is a scourge to all nations. It is, however, the height of hypocrisy to expound the detriment of illegal immigration when your very own country has among the highest per capita rates of illegal expatriates in the entire Western Hemisphere (Pew Hispanic Center).

I ask you, are you against illegal immigration or only the illegal immigration that adversely affects your country?

Touche devin ....good point

This message is for JANDER who is trying to excuse one problem with another problem. The problem of the U.S. with its illegals is not an excuse to ignore or forget the problem DR has with the Haitians!

JANDER learn this quickly. With regards to the U.S., according to the U.S. center for immigration, there are ~13 million illegals in the U.S. Of the 13 millions, 6.5 millions are from AFRICA, EUROPE, ASIA, MIDDLE EAST, and PACIFIC! THEY CAME BY PLANE (VISAS OVERSTAYERS). Apply equal attention to the violation of U.S. sovereingty to the State Department who allowed half of the illegal population to come in by AIR!

OndeVert, let me first state that i am an opponent of illegal immigration. that having been said, are you willing to accept Americans using violent means, like strafing and torpedoing yolas, to prevent Dominicans entering US and its territories illegally?

Generoso YOU ARE WRONG! We have 2 (two) million Haitians in DR and it continues to grow! We have tried your peaceful method for 30 years and FAILED! When it comes to DR, I will die for it! I don't care! I will defend DR and I will put DR ahead of any freaking international agreement, human rights (or rigths to violate), religious principles, or etnic kinship, or race, or skin color! If it takes violence (and it does just look at Guayabin how the Haitians left the area), SO BE IT!

If you are not Dominican, go to the Haitian forum and present your allegiances to that nationality! Don't come and sell that crazy idea of benevolence, peace, and human rights to entities that are pure animals and they will bite the hands that feed them! Those animals only understand one thing: VIOLENCE! And by the way, the Haitians commit lots of violence in DR!

I don't need your approval of Trujillo. I need DR clean of Haitians!

OndeVert, can i expect an answer from you regarding the use of violence as a deterrent against illegal Dominican immigration? what is your take on the coast guard saying " they just keep on coming, despite our efforts to stop them. maybe all they understand is violence". then, KABOOM!! how will that sit with you?

Dreadlocks. I don't care what the U.S. does with its illegals! They can go ahead and start shooting anything that crosses their borders (including their airspace). Don't try to impose American solutions or lack of solutions to the DR/Haiti problem. Those two problems are not Homomorphic (they are of different scales, origins, different consequence, etc.)

What I care about is the Dominican problem and it clearly requires violence. Just look at the effect of what happened in Guayubin and Hatillo Palma where the Haitians left (Santiago, Bavaro, and Samana on the other hand are getting filled with Haitians).

By the way INS estimates that of the 0.7 million Dominicans (born in DR, recall that 1.3 million Dominicans live in the U.S.) only 23,000 are estimated to be illegal. PR has 260,000 Dominicans (~17,000 are illegal).

well, you gave me an answer, but i cannot say i believe you. i am sure if american started dropping bombs on yolas bound for PR, you would be on the protest line at the embassy, as should all people of good conscience. and do not contaminate the issue by introducing numbers and scale. illegal immigration is what it is, not because of the numbers, but method of entry.

Dervin, There are ~ 2 million Dominicans living worldwide. The Dominican population is ~ 10 million. Thus, 17 % of the Dominicans emigrated (legally or illegally). Haiti has 4.5 million Haitians living abroad (1+ in the U.S., 1 in France/Canada, ~ 2 in DR, some in Bahamas, Cuba has at least 300,000 Haitians, Turk & Caicos, Jamaica, etc.). Haiti has 9 million people living in Haiti. That is, 33 % of the Haitian population lives abroad.

Like I said, don't excuse one problem with another (one wrong doesn't make another wrong right!). DR has an emigration problem! DR has an inmigration problem. In some cases, one problem feeds the other. Both problems require solutions NOW! DR emigration has led to casualties (it is very dangerous to boat to PR). Still we must stop the Haitian immigration NOW! NO EXCUSES!

Haiti export misery but it does not get illegal immigration from anyone so its political power is not under any threats!

Drealock learn this quickly! The only people protesting at anybody embassy are the proHaitians protesting in front of the Dominican Consulate in NY and also they conduct protest in DR! I am waiting for you to show the evidence of Dominicans protesting the U.S. embassy for deporting Dominicans or for shooting its criminals!!!!!!

I put the numbers so that you learn quickly that the problems are different and you must understand the scale of the problem (we don't want to compare 22 % problem with a 2 % problem). If you are so theorectical and absolute (that is the numbers don't matter), then there are U.S. illegals in other countries that must be addressed! But that is not my fight!

My fight is DR and it's 22 % illegal population growing at a rate of 2,000 illegals per week!!!! We must reverse this NOW NOT MATTER WHAT IT TAKES! BETTER TO BE FREE AND HAVE ENEMIES THAN FACING EXTINCTION!

OndeVert,

I will let you and Dread fight it out he is more eloquent then I am and hewill spit you out like fishbone.

If you are trying to convince any of us on this forum that violence is the answer you may as well go away now. It is socially unacceptable and down right scary to know there are extremists like you out there.

OndeVert, I do not disagree with you about the deleteriousness that illegal immigration causes in the DR. I just don't agree with your resolution of the problem. You stated that you have no concern for international agreements or opinion. What then would be the economic and political fate of the DR after effectuating your solution and exacting world wide condemnation.

And please forgive me for not believing that don't care the fate of your countrymen should they suffer the same response that you advocate for Haitians.

Jander!
This is not a pleasing contest to keep the socialists and the globalist happy. This is to rescue DR from its own extinction! You as well as the others are responsible for allowing more than 2,000 Haitians coming into DR weekly that will lead to the disapperance of DR by probably 2020!

REPEAT! This is not to socially please the globalists and human rights lovers! I am writing for those who don't write but suspect that DR is not on the right path and sees illegal Haitians everywhere! STAY in the U.S. if you want to impose UTOPIA on DR! DR is not an experimental Lab for absolute and ideal Human rights!

DR must remove the illegal presence by force! Peacefull means HAVE FAILED! PRD, PLD, and PRSC have failed to stop the Haitian invasion!!!!

Jander, the more he tries to defend his original position, the more he digs himself into a hole. i am all for rationalising immigration. nobody has the right to enter any country illegally. the problem you face by advocating violence against others is that the same paradigm can be applied against you. besides, if dominican authorities start expunging haitians by violence, i can guarantee you that there will be a severe embargo placed on the island; no doubt!

Devin:

I rather starve than seeing what made me into a person disappear because of somebody else's irresponsibilities! We can't let trade, commerce, and capitalism dictate the course of our fate! Even less use commerce as an excuse to allow illegal immigration to digest DR into extinction.

We must focus inwards, forget outside forces, influence, and consequences, and begin the recovery process! We must depart and/or separate economic survival from illegal immigration. We must remold our capitalists to remodel their investment to exclude illegal foreigners, we must change the attitude of Dominicans that some jobs are not socially prestigious or don't pay enough! All jobs contribute to the wealth of DR and should be respected even garbage pick up!

I don't care if PR and/or U.S. shoot Dominican (or Cuban or Haitian) boats! That is their problem! And whatever they do should not stop us from doing the right thing which is recover DR!

OndeVert, consider this a response to your request of Dominicans protesting deportation in NYC
http://www.dominicantoday.com/dr/....to-stage-anti-deportation-protest

Devin:

Is that the only you can find? I'll give you credit for this one but I got a whole bunch of protests from the prohaitians who protest almost every Monday in front of the DR consulate! Anyway, you did good. By no means, your single evidence is not a trend nor a tendency!

Devin:

I read your article and it sounds like more of a solidarity what the Dominicans did (for other Latinos) than actual ICE raids on illegal Dominicans! ICE is hunting selectively illegal Hispanics (that is, it is not hunting Africans, Middle Eastern, Asians, Europeans, Canadiens, etc. to the same extent as the Hispanics). Giving the impression that all 13 million illegals are Hispanics when they are not!

I still hold my position! Dominicans tolerate U.S. actions to deport illegal Dominicans (including criminals)!

Dreadlocks and Jander:

Not wonder you put the Dollar ahead of the DR! If your living principles are well being, then stay in the U.S.! But the destruction of DR will not be allowed!

Again, to Dread and Jander, Since 1975, has talking to the U.S., Canada, Haiti, France, UNESCO, FAO, OAS, UN, etc. resolved the Haitian immigration to the DR? NO!!!!!!! How many Haitians are there in DR? ANSWER THE FREAKING QUESTION! Your method has failed!!!!!

OndeVert, I sent you what you asked for. If you would like, I can send you many more articles and instances of the same. You are obviously very articulate and quite sage, your love of country is infectious and cannot be questioned. However my brother, your insistence to resolve conflict with ethnic cleansing is reprehensible. It will never be allowed by the global community and will be immediately quelled without any respect to national sovereignty.

(Clears throat uhm, uhm).

ALL Hail to the Mighty HAITIAN Empire.

Ondevert my boy be wise if you'd dare start deporting the Haitians in any more violent and inhumane manner like DR is doing currently I'm afraid that the Dominicans will face an embargo more severe than that of the Cuba communists party. Remember what happened earlier this year in Jan. when the Haitians had embargoed your poultry industry well this one would be one thousand times worst and believe me you Dominicans will beg for Haitians to come to DR after that... Last time I checked the Tourism business is not doing so well this quarter imagine if we Haitians deliberately add an embargo to that.

TO BE or not TO BE
You see my boy Haitians and Dominicans have to work together to solve their issues and ethnic cleansing is definitely not the answer. Therefore I propose now as I always have the unification of the two sides of the island. One nation under the United States of America indivisible with liberty without borders and justice for all while using a single currency called the Dollar aka "Amero". This is the will of the Haitian Empire and it will be so. Unless I die tomorrow which I doubt until then this is the plan and it will be executed according to thy will and you will be faithful this time no more running off and forming your own little country like you did in 1844 for I will be watching your every moves like a Hawk spying on its prey. Oh! Yes I will.

P.S. The Empire shall rise once more. (Like it or not)

I am sure this article was posted just to elicit bad and irrational comments from zenophobic people ..the article says that in a small geographical area less than $2 million dollars have been spent on poor and sick people in need of help ..the fact that they are from haiti ,which has had devestation after devestation this year and immense misery,is quite immaterial in my eyes and I am sure in the eyes of God.

OndeVert, let me see if i get you right; you are all for the USA using violent means to keep Dominicans out. that is all i asked. it is a simple "yes" or "no ". it has nothing to do with putting the dollar above well-being. you answered the question. thank you. now that this is clear, what violent means do you advocate should be deployed against haitians? should similar methods be deployed to expunge north americans and europeans who are here illegally? should they, perhaps, be shot on sight?

Well! we all know that Dominicantoday sometimes makes stuff up just to get an uproar from the crowd.
I take notice every now and then when the site is getting a little quiet some Haitian Vs Dominican news pops up and for some reason DT is the only news site with that information.
LoL it's okay I'm not upset with DT they are simply playing the game therefore I'm compelled to not hate the player but simply the game.

devin11
you posted "I ask you, are you against illegal immigration or only the illegal immigration that adversely affects your country?"
I am not against condoning any desperate illegal move into a new geographic area or another country if desperation and necessity are the cause of it, be it DR to PR or Haitians to DR.
Natural geographical migrations have been going on since the Taino indians were inhabiting the islands, moving on either running from the Caribe Indians or looking for newer and more fertile grounds to settle. It is not the point. The point is that just like all countries including the good old USA control limit their legal or illegal immigration, so should we, I make no self righteous claims or demands.

I am not in the US but was born there, pure I am here and have been for a long time (almost 15 years )

I am a legal resident and live and work right next to Dominicanos Haitianos Italiano's and so on and so forth usaually when I post somthing I just need to look out the window and can see what is going on in realtime.

Most people are really to busy to worry about the situation and rely on their government and law enforcement to keep them safe. Unfortunately that last part isn't going so well.

I am sure the last place a Haitian wants to go is the DR , but if it is that or starve.. what would any of you do

so true jander it is very sad for those of us who grew up wanting for nothing very sad

G, your original post does not ascribe to your current explanation. The US has the absolute high-ground with regard to illegal immigration. It was the US that gave amnesty to the over 6 million illegal aliens during the Ronald Reagan administration of the early 1980's. The US subsidizes illegal aliens healthcare, education and other resources to the tune of BILLIONS and BILLIONS of dollars a year. Of course you don't make "self righteous claims or demands", you don't have to! If illegal Haitians received the treatment afforded to illegal Dominicans in the US, believe me there would never be a single protest by any Haitian. So yes, when the US tells other countries to better treat their illegal populace, it has every right to make such a demand.

Jander, you made the most consummate point in this thread, thank you.

Devin:
First: The problems between the U.S. and its illegals is their problem and not my fight! Many of the subsidies you mentioned are given to the children of illegals (who are citizens) but somehow is counted against the illegals.
Second: DR is a poor country. Your comparison between the U.S. expenditures with its illegals due to its commitment to its constitution and human rights is NOT EQUAL to the expenditures that DR is taking upon (not mandated by law) and certainly is jeopardizing the future as a future debt!
Third:U.S. has the "high ground"? What is that? You mean moral ground? Define

Jarden:
We can not used "starvation" derived from high fertility rate and irresponsible population explosion as an excuse to dump that problem to DR! People must learn to adapt, adjust, reform, and learn to live within their means! Haiti got into its own problems created by themselves and now they are transferring that problem to DR!

Save your breath! Benevolence, human rights, and compassion only aggravates and deepens the problems by transferring it to DR! Eventually, the whole island will be a failure and everyone will have to emigrate!

DR must harden its attitude and start to use the cold hand indiscriminately to resolve this problem! TALKING HAS NOT WORKED FOR 30 YEARS! HOW MUCH LONGER ARE WE GOING TO CONTINUE THIS PATH?

Devin:

The U.S. has no rights to tell others to swallow someone elses problems! That is pure bologne! It is logically pure brute logic to use the failed immigration policies of Reagan (who used it to gain Hispanic votes) as an argument that the rest of the world must take in illegal aliens! You are so wrong that China, Russia, Italy, and even South Africa will tell you "get lost." Do not insult the poster here with that childish logic!

Even Italy and France are telling the EU to get lost with regards to the African problem! You are wasting my time!

Violence cannot and should not be the answer to any problem. If DR politicos are so concerned with illegal Haitian immigration, all they have to do is fine employers that hire them and incarcerate the coyotes that help them cross the border. Regardless of what anyone says, a lot of the recent influx of Haitian immigrants to DR has occurred because people hire them. First in the sugarcane fields (how they got to bateyes in the first place), then in construction in the booming tourism industry (how they made their way to places like Bavaro).
By the way, I disagree that the US has the right to tell DR to treat illegal Haitian immigrants better. Why? Because the US is the one country that in modern times has screwed Haiti over so royally that they now see themselves forced to cross the border into DR. One can only wonder if the fact that they prefer to spend so much time, money, and effort discrediting the DR rather than helping Haitians has an ulterior motive to it.

I don't understand the posters here! The Dominican Diaspora has been contaminated with ideas, attitudes, principles, and thinking process of another country (THE U.S.). Now, the Dominican Diaspora wants to impose the "IDEALS", that even the U.S. does not itself obey, to DR. These ideals are not suitable for DR and only bring damage to the DOminican concept! Forget Socialism, Globalism, Internationalism, Human Rights, Agreements, Brotherhood, Religious principles, etc. STOP USING INTERNATIONAL BINOCULARS TO SEE DR'S PROBLEMS!

Use DOMINICAN BINOCULARS to see Dominican problems! Reclaim your native principles "COUNTRY, GOD, AND LIBERTY" and do something to reclaim DR again! I am not afraid of starvation, embargos, isolation, and enemies! I will live just to make sure that the Dominican concept lives on Hispaniola!

Dominicanchic:

The problem is bigger that Bateyes or Haitian workers (in Agriculture, Tourism, and Construction), many Haitians are women and children crossing over to give birth, to get subsidies, to make a living, etc. More than 260,000 Haitians are born in Haiti every year and Haiti does not have the resources to feed that fertility rate. But the Haitian women continue to give birth to 4, 5 or 6 children as if their plan is to send them to DR (since Haiti rejects the deported children it gets from DR).

I ask How much more Haitians are we going to allow in? How long will it take to start purging DR of Haitians? There are only 49,000 members of the FFAA and there are not enough men to seal the border, capture all the illegals, fine the employers, and then stop the Dominicans from going to PR! Logistically we failed and therefore we have no option but to be HEAVY HANDED and deal forcefully with the foreigners!

*Los haitianos practican esclavitud en Haiti (mas de 265,000 niños/as son esclavizados/as conocidos como RESTAVEK) y en Miami, EEUU. Esta costumbre es tambien traida ha RD donde niños/as haitianos/as son forzados a labores duras y ha la prostitucion!

Impacto de la Invacion Haitiana Sobre RD

*La inyeccion del Creole, Kompas, Voodoo, Ra' Ra', y otras costumbres haitianas amenazan la cultura Dominicana. Con acquisicion del poder politico, los haitianos tranformaran RD en un satelite politico y economico de Haiti. Los haitianos cambian la distribucion racial de RD de mulato hacia Congoloid!

*Los haitianos traen enfermedades (HIV, Hepatitis-C, y Tuberculosis), traen pobreza, traen violencia, traen analfabetismo y poca habilidades de uso util, y traen contrabando (drogas, armas, cafe, aji, cafe, carbon, arroz, madera, etc.)! La dispersion haitiana en RD dificulta las operaciones de deportaciones de migracion y de las FFAA. Los haitianos hacen los barrios peligrosos con sus costumbres de violar las leyes, conducta animalistica, y la destruccion del medio ambiente.

Ejemplos de esta invacion incluye:
1-La presencia de dos millones de Haitianos.
2-La cruzadera de mas 100,000 Haitianos hacia RD al año que incluye 4,800 niños/as haitianos.
3-La oferta de mas de 102,000 visas Dominicanas ha Hatianos al año.
4-Mas de 22,000 niños/as haitianos estudian en la primaria y escuelas secundarias de RD.
5-Mas de 18,000 haitianos estudian en universidades Dominicanas para tomar los trabajos de clase media.
6-Cuatro de cada 10 parturientas en las provincias fronterizas son de Haitianos.

Carga Publica Haitiana:
Roban electricidad y agua potable. Residen ilegalemente en terrenos publicos y privados. Mas del 39 % de los casos en la salas de emergencia en las provincias fronterizas son de origen haitianos (mas 13 % en el Dario Contreras). Qualificaran para el Seguro Social. Ocupan 84 % de los trabajos en agricultura (azucar, tabaco, cafe, etc.), mas del 68 % de los trabajos de construccion, mas de 33 % de los trabajos en turismo, y otros (DESPLAZAN LOS DOMINICANOS DE LOS TRABAJOS BAJANDO LOS SALARIOS). Numerosos niños/as haitianos mendingan las calles de STO DGO, Santiago y la Romana paradon el trafico, pidiendo dinero y cometen robos. Los haitianos cometen numerosos actos de violencias, crimenes y desobediencia civiles en RD. Los Haitianos envian $350 millones de dolares desde RD hacia Haiti (la transferencia de riqueza mas grande que sale de RD!).

Blah, Blah, Blah Ondevert The Haitian Empire has taking over your side of the island GET-OVER-IT.
You are not going to do jack except for whining and crying behind your little 14" Monitor.
You have been weighed, measured and found not wanting on the island of AYITI. Yes I said it the island of AYITI as the Taino once called it the island of AYITI which belongs to AYITIANS ONLY all Dominicans see your way out.

Onedvert,

The subsidies that I wrote of, without inclusion of a single child born to illegal aliens in the US is in the BILLIONS and BILLIONS of dollars.

Ronald Reagan, without the help of hispanic voters except Cuban exiles won two elections in the US by landslide margins. He did not need or seek appeasement of the hispanic voting block by giving illegal aliens permanent resident status. Permanent residents are not allowed to vote and even hispanic US citizens hardly take the time to do so.

You say that all forms of curtailing illegal immigration have failed so ethnic cleansing is the solution. How did that solution work out in Germany, Bosnia and Iraq? The only childish logic being employed here is yours!! You are wasting everyone's time!!

Whatever like dominicanation, dominicantoday is manipulating us. once Haiti is in the title we all run on it like a bunch of starving dogs to post our hates message. I m to smart for that and it s insult to my intelligence. my only message is that 95 % of all of you that s posting bad stuff about the haiian immigrants are immigrants themselves.Maybe you ll have to go back home before you guys talk about the Haitian immigrants,it s hypocrisy.

at least in the pic. it s women that s buying goods, not hookers. I think if the Haitian was taking a pic of the Dominican immigrant it d be so different tahn this one.

Remember, Haitians and Dominicans are in many ways the same people. Haitians COLONIZED the DR for 21 years. Haitians are the only colonizer nation in the AMERICAS. They share a lot of things with the Dominican people.
You! You are so eloquently bad mouthing the Haitian folks, you don't even know which type of blood is scrolling through your veins. Please, STOP THE HATRED AGAINST THE HAITIAN PEOPLE, THEY ARE NOT RESPONSIBLE FOR THE DEMISE OF THEIR GOVERNMENTS. After all, we live on the same piece of land.
I remember back in the 1980s, when the Dominican government was not taking care of its people, a lot Dominicans went for a better life in Haiti.
I also remember, whenever I saw a Dom. man, he always had a knife on him. Most Dom. women were selling their body. So every generation has its own tragedy. Let's not take advantage of the misfortune of the Haitian people to reduce them to nothing. In the 80s, whatever Haitians did, Dominicans copied. But we never treated them less than equ

Oh gc, hot baby hot, like that language

anyways women from haiti come here to find work to support their families since their lazy men don't want to do it, and then their faced with not finding any work because their illegals so they have to settle for prostitution, how degrading that the men of the family would allow even conden this kind of behavior. and so ofcourse we have to foot the bill their here it would look bad on us if we just let them die.

Gatitapequena, I know its not Christmas Eve, but Santa's lap is always ready.

mmmmmm, has to be real strong, and very sturdy.

to hold up this kitten, and her checkies, jajaja

Mira, Se lo digo de una vez!
A todos aquellos (partIcularmente ONDE VERT) que se creen mejores que los Haitianos, el futuro les reserva una grande sorpresa!
Nosotros los Haitianos quando estuvimos haciendo la historia en 1804, a muchos, el estatuto de capataz les iban bien. Cuando estuvimos luchando para la democracia en 1986, la esclavitud moderna, al igual les caian de buena onda.
No somos ninguna carga publica para nadie. Somos libres, aun pobres, pero orgullosos. Nuestro pais esta bajo el cotrol de los tontos y babosos de este siglo. Sin embargo, algun dia los verdaderos hijos legitimos de Jean Jacques Dessalines, Toussaint Louverture, Capois Lamort.. retomaremos el reino de nuestro dominio. Volveremos a ser de nuevo, el punto de referencia como antes fuimos para personas como tu...
Porque odias a los Haitianos?
Fuiste a buscar trabajo en Haiti antes de embarcar para los Estados Unidos y te trataron mal. Talvez tu padre es un Haitiano? Dime ahora!
Eso va para ti "ONDE VERT

Baby girl you got all the right weaponry.

Close the border. Use the Tucanos.

WE_D_R_HAITIANS, if dominicans and haitians are the same people according to you, how come we don't speak the same language (heck, some dominicans don't even know that kreyol exist, thinking of it as another kind of african patois)? sheesh, some people over here can't stop thinking with their arses.

Yummy you pig get away from the pussycat...are you happy to see her or is that a gun in your pocket

It's a young man's world

She thinks I'm cute

She likes the sweet things I say

Don't hate the player hate the game

I don't need Viagra

uuuhhhhh.............hhhhhhhooooooooottttttttt!!!!!!!!!!!

"It's a young man's world"

Did you hear that, GC? According to yumnuk, you're out of the game. LOL

the pussycat will take care of yummy like the praying mantis and her suitors .....it will be curtains for the youthful yummy...nothing but little pieces after the meal

Oh Lautaro!
If speaking different languages makes people different, you must be living on another planet. Stupid!
Language is a form of human communication by systems of written symbols, spoken words, and movements. Haitians and Dominicans are the same because we are part of the human race. Unless you think that Dominicans are part of the ARIAN race! So you be the judge of that, Stupid! If in 2008, some Dominicans don't even know if creole exist, you people must revise your educational curriculum. You suck! In the Haiti that I grew up, English, Spanish, French, and Creole were a must in order to be considered an intellectual. Although I am no intellectual, I do know when I am chatting con un idiota como tu. Un imbecil hors pair, qui se propose de malparler les haitiens. Ti dominikin san nan'm. Do your homework stupid, and you'll find out that creole is not an African whatever. In fact, creole has nothing to do with Africa.
Good News!
Some people are actually doing some thinking!

WE_D_R_HAITIANS,
Why is it that you Haitians can not carry on an intelligent dialogue without all the demeaning insults
and mud slinging?
Your anger is just overpowering and drowns your cries for understanding.
Instead of behaving like wild animals with a case of rabies you must control your blind hate and be less of a loose cannon that shoot at everything including your own kind in total chaos like rabid persons that are possessed by evil spirits.

You must be having crack, WE_D_R_HAITIANS, cuz' last I checked, kreyol was morphologically and phonetically 70% african and 30% french (and this one is derived from the one spoken on the coastal provinces like Nantes, Normandy and Brittany, which differ from the one spoken by the rest of the country by a wide margin), and if you don't believe me, ask Goulet or any other french speaker, which, nothwithstanding their knowledge of french, have to ask for the services of a local translator as any other foreigner when dealing with the local population, which is only kreyol speaking by a 95%. I was talking about the dominican's lack of notice of kreyol in the sense that all they want is to make their trade with the US or the europeans, moron. That's the problem with you elite types, that you easily delude yourselves in believing that the rest of the country lives by your parameters, when reality says otherwise, and what better proof of this than the one afforded by your compatriots (cont.).

Gatitapequena, you're so sweet, you put Hershey's outta business.

Before I came to this site everyone were praising Latutu. as if he was an intellectual god....But I saw the mediocrity in him I exposed him to the world and sad to say he's only gotten worse. Come on as the streets would say "Get your game up son" for you to come out with a statement like the one above it's unbelievable.

Where I come from LAT. most members of my family speaks English, Spanish, French, Creole Flawlessly and on top of that they can read Latin. I'm not the sharpest tool in the shed in my family as a matter of fact I'm a complete retard comparing to the rest of my family but damn it I can hold my own in any of those languages. The average Haitian is trilingual while the Dominicans are stuck with their masters tongue. We Haitians are a true Empire with our Own Religion = Voodoo. Our own Language = Creole and as you can see we don't take no BS from anyone that;s why after 200+ years they are still trying to keep us down but we Haitians are Immortals we will never change.

(cont...) living on the DR, which fills my criteria perfectly. Please, stop living as a recluse on Petionville and Kenscoff and actually go out and do something for your country, believe me, the rest of us would be grateful if you Petionville types would stop living like vampires and actually do something for a change.

I decided to join into this conversation because I think that it time that somebody stands up to your hateful comments on Haitian matters. I am a Haitian, ten times the man many of you on this blog can ever be. And I know many others like me who are hard working, respectful individuals just like some real Dominicans are as well. But you people, I don't know what kinds of Dominicans are you. But you suck!
You overlooked almost every aspect of Haitian reality in order to minimize my people. I think it is time that you gear up for a good/real fight, if bad mouthing Haitians is what you are about.
Let me remind you that I don't have feelings of hate for any body on this blog. But if you hate my comments, and want to engage in a nasty fight, Bring it ON!

LOL. Nonsense!

"The average Haitian is trilingual while the Dominicans are stuck with their masters tongue."

One thing is to speak a language, and another thing is to write it, read it, or understand it perfectly. You can't change reality or as we say over here "tapar el sol con un dedo". The majority of your population is only kreyol speaking (be it a 90% or a 70%, the end result is the same), you can't change the fact that the majority of the haitian nationals on the DR are heavily unfit for the demands that the current world economic trends are imposing, or that the majority of them can only fill the menial tasks that the rest of the dominican populace are not willing to do, because the overabundance of the cheap labour afforded by that inmigration is keeping those salaries down. Keep dreaming on your little world, Petionville vampires, cuz' this one is already tired of dealing with your empty pride, ghostly accomplishments and misplaced sense of entitlement. Sayonara,

Lautoro!
Leave Haitian reality to Haitians.
Like I alluded to in one of my previous posts, when the time is right we will reclaim our rightful inheritance from whomever. Whether it's fake Haitian Bourgeois, fake politicians, fake patriots, and fake neighbors who pretend that they care. We have always been a self sufficient people. One day, our rightful place we will reclaim. And on the pinnacle of the caribbean nations, we will reign once again.

amen!

How, may I ask? Even your compatriot Jean Price Mars in "Ainsi parla l'oncle" saw you elite types for what you really are, that is, a bunch of snivelling, groveling and contemptible cowards that don't possess the testicular fortitude that is neccessary to advance the reforms that your country is sorely needing, being content with only living by sucking the life out of the rest of the populace. As St. Thomas would say "I will only believe it when I see it".

WE_D_R_HAITIANS
You said " I am a Haitian, ten times the man many of you on this blog can ever be"
and want to engage in a nasty fight, Bring it ON!

You are just a braggadocio, again polluting the DT threads with your blind hate.
Why don't you go to Haitian internet newspaper and argue your rubbish comments with
your own kind?
This newspaper is called "Dominican Today" not "Ayiti History" or "Saint Domingue Le Matin".

Laututu are you mad because the Haitian elites are now moving in on the Dominican territory?

Are you now upset due to the fact that the Haitian elites have benefited more in the tourism industry than the Dominican elites if they have any. Last time I checked the so called Dominican Elites were nothing more than Spaniards looking out for the interest of Spain while pretending to be Dominicans just like Pedro Santana. You remember him don't you?

The time of JPM is in the past! what he may or may not have said is irrelevant to this conversation. Haiti is currently ran by a bunch of incompetents. The real deal is yet to come!
Do you honestly believe that 70 to 90% are worthless? WOW! you people really don't get it. Last time a check, there is something called "Haitian Literature". Can somebody say: WEB Du Bois!
Speaking of which, do you have any "Dominican Jean Price Mars" you can quote?

Last time I checked, the "haitian elites" are in their majority american, arab, french or jew, so you have nothing to brag about either.

I have plenty: Bernardo Vega, Frank Moya Pons, Carlos Deive and Franklin Franco, among others. And for your info, what JPM said was very relevant, because he predicted the current migrational issue and the irresponsibility of the elites on a time when Haiti was still a functional country (1953).

I don't know why are you quoting DuBois, cuz' last time I checked, all his fights were on american and african soil. And many of these were empty quarrels with people that were supposed to be on his side (Marcus Garvey et al.)

generoso
I am not here to stay!
I am just letting you know that your comments hurt hardworking Haitians like myself.
I agree that due to Haiti's misfortune, many Haitians venture toward your country. I also understand that it is not fair to your people. But let's not lump all Haitians into one bag. Some Haitians have no choice but to cross your border. Some are hurting inside because they no longer have a place to call home. But let's not blame them for someone else's mistake. As a Haitian, I do not believe in hate!
I think many Haitians feel the same way. When you put us down the way you usually do on this blog, you enrage my soul. Because I know that every single day, I am striving to see a better Haiti.

WE_D_R_HAITIANS
Then fight for your liberties and make a better Haiti, don't export your poor to DR , we are not to blame for your historic predicaments and lousy rulers. Don't live in the past glories that are now only a distant memory and a dream. Live in the present and not in the past. Do not invade the land that is not yours and become an irritant and source of discord among nations. We are not a rich nation either. More than half our population is functionally illiterate and struggling to eat every day one or two meals a day.
The Haitian people love their country but you must look inward for the solution to your problems not outward, the whole world is not to blame for your suffering and disgrace.
And thank you for your civilized answer, I do feel your pain.

Lautaro
Naming them does not do you any good, give me any relevant quote from them. As for my turn, I am not going to engage in such a pity little game with you. You know full well what Haitians are about. Remember, we are in part the reason why you exist today as a nation! If you don't believe me look at your FLAG! For generations, you've been following our footsteps. It's a Fact, little brother! or should I say Hermanitito! o Hermanitica!

generoso
It's funny you should say that. The land is not yours either. Remember, you became a nation after 21 years of Haitian occupation. Maybe you're right, we should stop living in the glory past. But at least we have a glory one. What about you?
ONCE YOU WERE THE SERVANTS of those negritos you call Haitians!
HOW'S THAT FOR A GLORY PAST!

WE_D_R_HAITIANS
And now you Haitians are our slaves and servants, does that make you proud and feel better?
The Taino indians were in DR much before the blacks that were brought in chains by the French from Africa.
Some people agree that the Haitian massacre of 1937 was rightful payback to all the atrocities that were committed by your murderous marauding army against a grossly outnumbered and out weaponized peaceful Dominican nation of 90,000 inhabitants composed of mainly ranchers and farmers.
You love to bring up the past and with some devious delight for people's suffering. Are you proud of the time your cruel Haitian army marched into Moca and slaughtered and burned innocent children in the plaza for all to see? If you are then you are just another sick and perverted angry Haitian and intolerance posts and the spell of bad karma is in your genes will always follow you and you will have pestilence and pain tears come raining on your cursed soul.

oooooooo, lots of dark chocolate in here, (mmmmm, mmmm), i like

someone is trying to melt it, ooooo

Did they just take you out of the oven? Because you’re hot!

yumnuk3
Go beat your chicken somewhere else partner, she is too hot to fall for your empty rhymes and
tuneless poetry.
I will turn you into a coqui frog now.
Agla agla agla agla agla agla,
Aleph, Nun, Vau, Resh, Cheth,Qoph, Daleth,Shin
Recabustira, Cabustira, Bustira, Tira, Ra, A.
Scram, go, aleh, beat it, vayase, shooo, fuera,

" beat your meat" and " choke your chicken " a little literary correctness sil vous plait

"
Written by: Lautaro, 8 Dec 2008 11:07 AM
From: Dominican Republic, Santo Domingo
Last time I checked, the "haitian elites" are in their majority american, arab, french or jew, so you have nothing to brag about either.
"
So true, the truth hurt sometimes, Lat you must be doing something right, you are hated on both side from east to west

Generoso said: Then fight for your liberties and make a better Haiti, don't export your poor to DR , we are not to blame for your historic predicaments and lousy rulers. Don't live in the past glories that are now only a distant memory and a dream. Live in the present and not in the past.

I say don't export your prostitutes to HT, we are not to blame for your historic predicaments and lousy rulers. You see Generoso anything negative you can say about Haiti and Haitians I can easily give you the DR version. Except for Haiti have something that DR can not match or copy. We Haitians have a HISTORY while you Dominicans on the other hand are a whole bunch of bastard children from old, old, colonization notably and most relevant from Haiti. LAT. Please don't try to post your 3rd grade dominican authors here because you know when it comes to literature and art the Haitians owns.

GC I am going to speak creole wtih you only.... you have been warned....

Written by: generoso, 8 Dec 2008 12:00 PM
From: United States
yumnuk3
Go beat your chicken somewhere else partner, she is too hot to fall for your empty rhymes

Player hater.

Dominicanation
You said "Please don't try to post your 3rd grade dominican authors here because you know when it comes to literature and art the Haitians owns"
Fact: Art- Xavier Amiama Dominican from Santiago founded the first art school in Haiti and was regarded by historians as the father of Haitian art.
Fact: Junot Diaz a Dominican born author was awarded the most coveted "Pulitzer prize" recently.
Fact: We have many pubished internationally famous authors, writers and scholars and the list is just too long to mention all here including Juan Bosch, do your homework and read some real history not only your racist Afronazi Haitian supremacist crap.
I am wasting my time with you ignoramus bunch, keep to your Dominican school studies (I know that's what you do here) and stay off making senseless comments to parade your stupidity for all to see and make fun of. BTW: I do know some prominent Haitian scholars and you certainly are not one of them!

This is my last post!
Your analytical skills are so low that i would only lower myself by trying to engage in a real debate with you people.
This is not about Haiti or the Dominican Rep, it's about humanity. If you don't believe that every single human being has a right to exist regardless of country of origin, skin color or what have you, you will soon wake up to different reality.
I am sure that you all nod your heads in agreements when others are saying we should love one another. But contrary to popular belief, there is not one special person on earth who deserve to be loved more than others. No matter who is giving or who is receiving, real love should be indiscriminate.
I love dominicans, I love haitians, and I love people in general. I hope that one day you will open your hearts to real love... Maybe then, God will forgive you for all your hateful comments on Haitians.

Haitians don't get the point that Dominicans don't welcome their presence in our country "PLA
IN and SIMPLE"....................We don't like them and will never like them PERIOD.

tonyj ...how do you say ice scraper in creole ?

I hope that the Dominican and Haitian politicians will understand the anger and fear that have eroded all humanity in some Dominicans hearts . They ned to act quickly to resolve the immigration problem.
I am afraid to witness the mechanical translation of this hate and fear

dominicanation why did you choose dominicanation if yuo are haitian, what are you not proud of your origin
just asking

@ RUBI This is plain and simple "The entire island of Ayiti belongs to the HAITIANS" PLAIN-SIMPLE.

We don't like you and will never like your kind so leave my island now and go back where ever you come from.

This is why the island is called AYITI because it belongs to the AYISYEN. The Last pure Blood Taino that lived in Haiti gave Dessalines full ownership of the entire island all Dessalines had to do is promise the old chief that he will keep the name in honor of its former inhabitants and Dessalines did. SO anyone that is not AYISYEN shouldn't be living on the island of AYITI.

Dominicanation
Dream on now in you cleren infused stupor mixed with dung mushrooms , I will stick your bunda on top of my razor sharp bayonet as soon as you cross the border into God's land, the beautiful and prosperous Republica Dominicana.
DIOS not voodoo....PATRIA not the Minustha foreign armies invading your land and LIBERTAD
not your Ton Ton Macoutes or the freedom that you Haitians never have had and don't know what it is like to enjoy.
To : WE_D_R_HAITIANS,
Enjoy your trip back to dirt cookie land, and don't forget to take all your cousins back with you!

Generoso ... You will accept the voodoo like it or not..

P.S. this time we are coming with MINUSTHA. The unification will take place before 2012 get over it.

One nation under Damballah ---I mean God indivisible with liberty for the few and justice for the elites.

Dominicanation
I guess you have had too many dung harvested mushrooms, they do rot your brain cells quickly.
LOL. AT least you made me laugh.

Hello there..i told you i was coming with back up....lol. anyway I didn t wanna post any comments on this subject 'cause it is posted just to create this kind of conversation. But I can t deny the truth they succeed in their plan ,112 comments so far. like i always say "fight Poverty not people in poverty" illegal immigrants it s a world problem. Haiti also have a lot of problem with illegal Dominicans maybe not as much as the DR do with Haitians,but we do have a lot of dominicans criminals, Hookers,drug dealers...on our soil. But how hypocrit are we to talk about immigrants? while we know we Haitian immigrate in all the countries of the world. How much Dominicans immigrate illegaly to the USA,Puerto-Rico...? do you think they r happy to see you on their soil? I m not an immigrant I ve been in a lot of country i never felt comfortable away of my country. And I hope that many of you Haitians,Dominicans will come back home one day to help their people and their country

"
Written by: gouletcolonial, 8 Dec 2008 1:31 PM
From: Dominican Republic, Zona Colonial Casa Cordon
tonyj ...how do you say ice scraper in creole
"
abracadabra, you are now turned into a little gato.... watch out the mouse out there
heir to the king rubi so it was written so it shall be done

Dominicanation:

Are you ashamed of being Haitian??

dominicanation why is your username dominicanation, all you hiatians undecover you.
come out your closet.

where all those hiatian came from dominicanation, hiatian1084 and antonio what ever man

Brotto The Haitian Empire have their people working all the way in your government. Sleeping cells when the time comes they will do what must be done but too bad I can't say the same for you Dominicans for last time your president set foot on our soil he was welcomed by an array of bullets that made him jump back in his motorcade so quickly that he honestly dropped his sombrero and didn't bother to pick it up.

you say it right man...no more smile to the hypocrits. When the time come what must be done will be done....I d like to see the head of Genoroso that day...and maybe etieenc will claim himself as Haitian. anyway i m counting days I can t wait...my m4 is ready...lol

yeah sleeping cell like pena gomez, give me a break, you hiatians should be glad that you are tie to dr otherwise hiati would have been like vieques nothing but thorn bushes and a lot of mud, hiatian are like mexican in us do the labor of those who would not do it. and live five hundred in a room. you right you time will come to get the f^&k out of my country.

And that 24% population is going Hmmmmm goin down down baby, yo' street in a tap-tap (c'mon)
Street sweeper baby, cocked ready to let it go
Shimmy shimmy cocoa what? Listen to it pound
Light it up and take a puff, pass it to me now

NELLY BEAT

Dominicanation
Haitian1804
We DR hatians

You Guys have been doing The work of three Great men: Larry, Curly and Moe.

Well done! You Guys did a fantastic job, love it!

Dominicanation and OndeVert Can you guys at least quote or provide us a link of the statistics that you have posted above, or is it pure creation of your minds.

Do you think maybe appropriately so your names could be changed to Haitianation and Greenwave to Dominicanation ? just a thought !!

allright tonyj I dont want to ask you again or I am gonna get angry but what is the word for ice scraper in Creole...dont make me come up there and beat it out of you.....spit it out

"
Written by: gouletcolonial, 8 Dec 2008 9:20 PM
From: Dominican Republic, Zona Colonial Casa Cordon
allright tonyj I dont want to ask you again or I am gonna get angry but what is the word for ice scraper in Creole...dont make me come up there and beat it out of you.....spit it out
"
Glout anything easier man... creole is not my forte, je ne sais pas
by the way do you like sugaring (cabane a sucre) les oreilles de chris ? au maple syrup

very much maple candy and maple walnut ice cream...as far as drilling holes in trees never done it ....dont forget to wear your mittens....how about those dolphins

1-Armenia/Turkey worked! Germany, Cambodia, Iraq, Bosnia, Rwanda, and Sudan almost worked if not for the U.S. and European intervention!
2-Haiti did not colonized EL Haiti Espanol, it established a military rule in EL Haiti Espanol!

I promise before I leave this planet I WILL TAKE THOUSANDS OF THOSE LA CHATTE WITH ME AND HAITI WILL NEVER BE THE SAME! As already shown by the 911 team, there is nothing more detemined than a skill person willing to put away another country!

Je m'en branle! Les Haitienes sont tous des pe'de's!

He', merde, ca schlingue ici. Y'a un salaud qui a pe'te'! C'est de'gueulasse, je vais de'gobiller.

OndeVert
Hurray for you....just let me know what building you are going to climb in to in Port Au Prince so if I am around, which I really doubt, I can hide under some cars until the shooting stops.
BTW there are not a lot of tall buildings in PAP.
From all my previous military experience I can advise you three things:
1. Bring a lot of ammo.
2. Bring a lot of water in canteens.
3. Have some amphetamines handy so you won't doze off.
Good luck, and one last thing.....you will die.

OndeVert, Make sure it's the correct medication that your doctor prescribed.

G,

I didn't think you had it in you to make me laugh but as I pick myself up off the floor, I thank you for the
uncontrollable mirth.

""I promise before I leave this planet I WILL TAKE THOUSANDS OF THOSE LA CHATTE WITH ME AND HAITI WILL NEVER BE THE SAME! As already shown by the 911 team, there is nothing more detemined than a skill person willing to put away another country"

This what crack does to your brain ? Greenwave you need to go to the nearest mental hospital, immediately, you are suffering from extreme Haitian fatigue. I am still waiting to hear about the surprise gift you had for the Haitians residing in DR after Leonel's election.

Poor little lonely imbecile from the house of horror, fighting his delusional private war.

devin11
no problema, you are welcome!

"
Written by: yumnuk3, 8 Dec 2008 11:33 PM
From: United States, New York City
OndeVert, Make sure it's the correct medication that your doctor prescribed.
"
That was funny sh... can any one comment is ondevert serious, or is he mentally sick in his cabeza de cacahuate?.

Hey poupou vert you are working on a 9/11 style attack against the Haitian are you suicidal ? who is financing you ?, any ammo ? make sure you take your drug with you.. and have a safe trip to hell.

This must be the greatest loser and surely the weakest link among Dominicans, I guess Haitian1804 and Domincanation have accomplished their goal of driving ondevert to insanity
we should keep ondevert out until he successfully meet the plato of a full Haitian withdrawal

"
Written by: OndeVert, 8 Dec 2008 11:23 PM
From: United States
Je m'en branle! Les Haitienes sont tous des pe'de's!

He', merde, ca schlingue ici. Y'a un salaud qui a pe'te'! C'est de'gueulasse, je vais de'gobiller.
"
Mon beau merde ca pete assez fort, mangeur de queue, ho lala le pede originale Dominicain

OndeVert, It sounds like you're under a lot of stress, I was told that the shock therapy is okay, you'll be put asleep while it is performed.... please Just gave your mind a rest.

OndeVert
Really ...this shoudn't hurt at all...now grab this little wire tight with you left hand, OK, fine.....
Now let me put this muzzle in your mouth so you wouldn't bite your tongue.
Now grab this other wire with your left hand.....ready?
srrrrsssrrrrrrrrrrrrsrrrrrrsssssssssssssrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrsrrrrrrrrrrrrr
Feel better now?

yumnuk, OndeVert is just plumb worn out. a week of bed rest, and he will be as good as new. he just overheated his brain, that is all.

when greenwave goes postal you guys are all gonna be investigated....dont be surprised

quote greenwave
I guarantee the destruction of Haiti is eminent! It will be quick and effective! Every Haitian will perish! You forgot one little detail piece of merde, the Dominican Diaspora has capabilities of wiping out your latrine hole any moment! Keep dreaming and we are definitely going to wake up the pe'de' in you!

We will ensure the destruction of every Haitian vaginal hole in the island to ensure your kind never come back again to the island!!!
unquote

quote greenwave
Twice we invited Spain to rule us (1809 and 1860)! WE INVITED THEM! We didn't invite you! You never rescue us or were told to since we never call you! You invaded to own, colonize, and displace! You imperialistic pigs! We didn't have a slavery problem (population in 1801: 16,000 slaves, 85,000 free colored people, and 30,000 Spanish decendents) but you did (800,000 slaves in Saint Domingue!).
unquote

Save the skunks....

Dread, With His case you'd better make it two weeks... just to play it safe.

5 centimeter of white stuff,thanks for the heads up GC
Go leaf

the really big one is coming soon tonyj...you wont get out of your house for days...stock up on canned goods....and DVDs......and always remember there is a coconut down here with your name on it...Go Leafs.....Iam so old I remember Tim Horton when he played and before he made donuts

You are very sleepy,very sleepy. your eyes are heavy and all you want to do now is sleep.sleep.sleep.sleep.Can you hear my voice ?
Ok since I have hypnotyzed you ,can you say the words bovine waste ??
What is bovine waste?
Well I am going to count to three and you will wake up,then read the above posts look for the word" bovine waste"

Now you guys have terrorist on you rank, Bravo generos***t. is this your troop that you r training to send kill the Haitians.I can t laugh it s not even funny...Did you know what christophe said to the french when they ask him to give up Cap-Haitien: " I'll burn it to ash and it's on this ash I ll fight you instead of give it up to you, and he set fire on his own house first." you may have seen a lot of Haitian but maybe you don t know that inside all of us there s a Dessalines,Capois La mort, Toussait louverture, sleeping that might wake up at any wrong gesture. so beware Terrorist,self claiming Modern colons...one day you might wake up and see the blue (black) and red flag on top of your national palace and the Dessalinienne(Haiti hymn) is playing in your ears...Death to Terrorism.

"Save the bovine waste"
What is bovine waste ???
Read the above posts !

what s the difference between etiennc01 and etiennc?...who cares?!?!... FIRE AT WILL

haitian1804
FIRE AT WILL With what?
You 300 year old French black powder musquet is all rusted up and useless...
I will be waiting for you with the Super Tucano's or "Haitian Eaters" as we call them and my sharp bayonet to thrust into your stinky bunda!

Genero what you are failing to understand is this. We Haitians still have our Voodoo my friend.

Generoso instead of us fighting all day why don't we reunite for the betterment of our country and our children all this talk about who's going to invade who is nonsense. We need to work together so we can create a better future. We all know that the Dominicans are not going to attack Haiti well if they do then that would be the end of DR as a country but think about my offer before you committ to something as silly as provoking war with a nation that is not afraid to die. Like Haitian1804 said the bloods of Dessalinnes and Capois Lamort and Henri C flows through our veins and last time I checked we can still kick DR's butt without a formal Army.

Damn ! I love myself I knew Haitians and Dominicans had something in common Ha Ha Ha ha ha Ha Ha Ha Ha !!!

Dominicanation
I have to say that your "delusions of grandeur" make me laugh a lot. I really feel sorry for you and all the voo doo worshipers like you. If your voo doo is so great how come it has not help the Haitian people achieved prosperity and rise out of their miserable existence? You said: "last time I checked we can still kick DR's butt without a formal Army" with what you can achieve that? with Voo Doo?
Come on, friend, the small American paratrooper contingent invaded your land recently and instead of fighting them back like we Dominicans did in 1965 , against a vastly superior force, you "brave" Haitians with all your voo doo powders and magic ran like children and dressed like women to hide, instead of fighting like men and make them respect you. Your big bad Ton Ton macoute army, used to beating and torturing defenseless civilians all of the sudden
put on dresses and wigs to beg for the mercy of the American army. That's how brave you are.

Dominicanation
Also what makes you think we want to invade Haiti? To gain what?
Not even Fidel Castro with the biggest and most powerful army other than the USA and in close proximity to Haiti (You can see Cuba from Haiti on a clear day) exported his revolution to farway places but not to Haiti. Why not? He was smarter than to get in that messy situation.
All Haitians want is somebody to feed them and bring them back from their zombie existence and it will take at least one generation (25 years) for any real improvement.
Haiti is a sewage hole and a big mess, and you Haitians with all your false pride and deliriums of grandeur are what's causing it to sink deeper in the hole.
Your "fuzzy" thinking has gotten you in trouble before with the rosary of bad and corrupt rulers that
made "baby doc" look like a genius and a prominent statesman.
Get on your knees and ask the DR to forgive you Haitians for all your trespasses against us and maybe, your terrible luck might change.

"
Written by: etiennc, 9 Dec 2008 6:45 PM
From: United States
Damn ! I love myself I knew Haitians and Dominicans had something in common Ha Ha Ha ha ha Ha Ha Ha Ha !!!
"
LoL, I can see you are stirring the pot here, god you know, how to get Rubi attention

Antonioj Rubi 's hate for Haitians is pathological, It stems from a sad personal experience.

I need to hypnotyze him and take him back to the years that he had this sad experience and help him deal with the demons that are tormenting him and help him close this chapeter in his life


This forum was not intended for Haitians and Dominicans to spit insults at each other . It was intended for civil dialogues, discussions and debates.

"
Written by: etiennc, 9 Dec 2008 10:30 PM
From: United States
Antonioj Rubi 's hate for Haitians is pathological, It stems from a sad personal experience.
"
LOL, Let just hope Rubi does not lose his marbles, just like poor Greenwave did . (fue un fracasson fuerte)

AntonioJ I gave up
I thought this forum was intended for frank ,honest, civil ,discussions ,debates and dialogues.
I was wrong This is where people who have severe depression and had had bad experiences with Haitians come here to spit their anger.
" Save the melancholics"

ASStonioJ

Va te faire foutre! Va te faire le pompier! Va te faire enculer! Slae petit pe'de'!

I come in peace, Haiti! What I bring to you is not a chain reaction but something that helped the european conquer the indians! You will suffer beyond imagination! I BRING DESPAIR!

"Save the Cymbalta"
A drug that affects moods
Por las personas que son deprimadas.

"
Written by: etiennc, 9 Dec 2008 11:42 PM
From: United States
"Save the Cymbalta"
A drug that affects moods
Por las personas que son deprimadas
"
Etiennc, I think greenwave his having a nightmare, he was told to keep taking his medicines
while being totally irrational and incoherant, he will mimble some jargons, then he will regurgitate and fall down again.

"Written by: OndeVert, 9 Dec 2008 11:24 PM
From: United States
ASStonioJ

Va te faire foutre! Va te faire le pompier! Va te faire enculer! Slae petit pe'de'!

I come in peace, Haiti! What I bring to you is not a chain reaction but something that helped the european conquer the indians! You will suffer beyond imagination! I BRING DESPAIR!
"
The man have just completely went "bobo" such a good thing to finally dispose of a wasted dirty miniscule mind, GREENWAVE welcome to the kingdom of the "loco's"

This forum has been monopolized by the chemerical,the nostalgic,and the romantic die hard disciples of Trujillo
No healthy debates and intelligent discussions are possible.
Those who are not trained to trade insults can no be comfortable
"Save the butterflies"

"Save the butterflies"

who unleashed those ignorants on this website...etienncdo something good for once. kick them out. it s borring here,with them.

haitian1804
hello boss......
are you on your knees yet?
Get down or will will sprinkle the green Haitian voo doo powder on you......and turn you into a zombie!
Oh Oh I forgot.......you are a zombie already......so sorry boss!

ASStonioJ

No-one will debate liers and fake artist like yourself (always critizicing and never put data in). You know nothing! Your job is to defecate and that's all! You are stuck in the MERDE dimension! Life has at least 11 dimensions and you only got one MERDE!

It doesn't matter what you guys do! The future of latrine Haiti is already written! Destruction awaits and it is eminent! You will suffer the same fate the earth experienced 60 million years ago!

so I don't have a salvation card left?

"
Written by: OndeVert, 10 Dec 2008 10:45 PM
From: United States
It doesn't matter what you guys do! The future of latrine Haiti is already written! Destruction awaits and it is eminent! You will suffer the same fate the earth experienced 60 million years ago!
"
He's back GOD SAVE THE QUEEN

Ondeverte
Rubi
Akatype

3 negatives
67 positives
7 neutrals

What is the true meaning of Christmas??
This question for three mean persons whose who should remain nameless
Please , No insults !1

So many Haitians frustations heading to a dead end...................

My opinion Arky and Ondevert are the same character two in one, if you have time to waste just go and have a conversation with them, and welcome to a perfect storm in other words keep hitting your head to the wall. They are both in dire need of mental evaluation, and should do a great service to the forum by sticking to their medicine as prescribed by their psychiatrist .

I will be off for the next 5 days.Will be back Monday night.
Take care of each other and remember the old negro spiritual Amazing Grace.
For those of you who play piano , this song plays on the black notes

MI LA MI SI 7
Amazing grace , how sweet the sound That saved a wreth like me
MI La MI Mi7 Si
Once I was lost but now am found Was blind but now I see

etiennc, there was a cult running around here looking for a lost brother, did you escape from their wrath, they said the colt belonged to the estranged, lunny binies

how about TULIPS on an ORGAN .......ja ja ja

Antonioj I am going to New York for 5 days Please watch the unit, Keep the doors locked and have the keys in your pockets. Make sure every one takes their medication, have them open their mouth to make surr they don't hide the pills under their tongues to later spit them out.
Also ,and this is very important :have three I repeat three straight jackets in the staff room at hand al all times.
If you need to increase the dosage use your common sense
They are very tired , very calm now and not too talkative

little pussycat I. you have been very nice . What got to you now ?
A change in your medication ??
Or you the RUBIARKYONDE fever ?

the blackness of the piano illuminating the vibrant red of the roses. (sigh) breath taking!!!!!

I much prefer the tulips on my organ...how ever to each his own

"
Written by: gouletcolonial, 11 Dec 2008 12:48 AM
From: Dominican Republic, Zona Colonial Casa Cordon
I much prefer the tulips on my organ...how ever to each his own
"
Glout, I hope there is no figure speech here and you are acutally prefer the tulips mama mia you will be censored some of the posters are not 19 years old. I need my ice scraper

tonyj you will certainly need your ice scraper soon ....I see freezing rain in your future...not to worry only six more months of it and then a new season called ?........Mud.....yes Winter then Mud then short Summer then Winter again.....it used to be only two seasons Winter then Getting Ready for Winter but now you have Mud in between....go Leafs

GC
Hi early bird old man...what are you doing?
PS My babe is back for a visit.LOL.

She took mercy on your miserable old @ss ...but take it anyway you can get it..good morning

GC
she is leaving tomorrow to stay with her man in Sweden of all places.
I give her 3 months before she returns running with ice on her butt. LOL.

GC
Cap cana loan was extended again and they are back running.
went by 4 seasons in Casa and is ghost town, it was the Fanjul's project, makes me wonder what happened.

a nice new shiny red Volvo with a good heater can do wonders for a ladies attitude....dont worry after Sven and Olie and the rest finish drinking Tuborg and Aquavit with her she will think she was born there...Cheer up

waiting for the dust to settle ....all we need is stability and they will start again ....the Fanjuls and the Four Seasons have extremely deep pockets ....it will happen I know it will ...if not you will have to loan me one of your guns

GC
I know them real well they only like downhill sure things with lot's of margin.
I don't loan my guns.....Hey I don't have any... haven't you heard there is a prohibition? LOL.

very disturbing look at a coward dominican do to a poor haitian

http://www.ireport.com/docs/doc-161346

do something about it,

Could you give another route? cuz' the site appears be no longer available, antonio. Or at least, can you give us a summary of what the case is about?

a dominican cutting both hands of an haitian with a manchete

http://www.dominicantoday.com/dr/....596/Dominican-torturing-a-Haitian

Lat, I am able to access the site

I've seen it. The guy's accent doesn't sound dominican to me, and trust me, I know all the nuances of the regional dialects spoken on this country (be it sureño, cibaeño, samanan and pedromacorisano cocolo and even the creoñol spoken by the haitian inmigrants and their descendants).

I cannot bear to watch it ...I hope you are correct lautaro...I hope it is a setup with special effects or some other planet...even showing it at all is sensationalist hate mongering regardless if it authentic or not

Don't you find it strange the fact that the guy wasn't bleeding profusely after being amputated twice? Or the fact that he was still standing, when it's known that the pain and shock produced by such an act is maddening at best, if not outright fatal at worst?

Lat , no doubt I found it strange it end up on a video, one wonder what is the purpose of it.... create hate among the two people, can you imagine if this video go viral, less tourists less job and more hatred.

It is just a site spreading more hate to disgust the international community against Dominicans and their supposed "racism and abuse of Haitians".
We should also show the recreation of the Haitian invasion and the torturing and dismemberment of women and children in public plazas. It is all terrible and inhumane and should have never happened.
Hate and violence just breeds more hate and violence. If that cruel event in the video did happen then the perpetrator should be arrested, tried and prosecuted. But I suspect the video is doctored
and edited for the creators own selfish motives to breed hate and disgust against Dominicans.

The chief of police Guzman declared that the investigation prompted by the Haitian embassy revealed that the accent of the person speaking in the video was studied by language experts and was concluded to come from that of a Venezuelan or Colombian national and the video was a set up and a fabrication.

“Ellos le indicaron que el video es un montaje y que el acento de los individuos revela que podrían ser originarios de Colombia o Venezuela”, confirmó Nicolas, al advertir que “nosotros continuaremos la investigación para arrojar luz sobre esas imágenes horribles”.

yeah yeah yeah...whatever

don't be haten, haitian!!!!!!!!!

"
generoso, 11 Dec 2008 2:34 PM
From: United States
The chief of police Guzman declared that the investigation prompted by the Haitian embassy revealed that the accent of the person speaking in the video was studied by language experts and was concluded to come from that of a Venezuelan or Colombian national and the video was a set up and a fabrication.

“Ellos le indicaron que el video es un montaje y que el acento de los individuos revela que podrían ser originarios de Colombia o Venezuela”, confirmó Nicolas, al advertir que “nosotros continuaremos la investigación para arrojar luz sobre esas imágenes horribles
"
Thanks for the update generoso, do you have the url link of that information ?

antonioJ
sure I do here it is:

http://www.clavedigital.com/App_P....s/Noticias.aspx?Id_Articulo=22725

Generoso We all know that you and Laturo made that video. Generoso you cut the hand and Laturo was recording it. The Question is Where was Rubi in all of this?

Dominicanation
Had I made the video you would have been the star in it and your head would have rolled not your hand. Have your wondered why the actor portraying the Haitian was nude?
The video is a scam and a forgery by you Haitians and the trail is hot so if I was you I would pack my bags and go back home.
You are going to miss your school final exams though.
By the way I heard there is a new Pro Haitian Ambassador coming to you Mr. Ruben Sillié.
BTW over 200 posts and still going strong!

So just because they guy doesn't sound Dominican he's off the hook OMFG you people have some nerves. Well you can say what you want but I know my Haitian and this guy looks like a Haitian to me. So there now let the FIGHTING began. You say the perpetrator doesn't sound Dominican and I say the victim looks like a Haitian. LET'S FIGHT.

Dominicanation
You only fight with your big mouth Haitian, try to borrow some guevos and glue them with crazy glue
for a bit. You only insult through an alias over the internet.
Name a time and place kaka and I will be there alone and unarmed to wipe your bunda in the ground.

LOL generoso Even IF in your dream you found yourself beating my a$$ or any other sort of insolence when you wake up from your dream you better come apologize to me.

P.S. You know where to find me. I'm in DR all the time matter of fact that's where I am now.

Dominicanation
Well that's very brave of you .....you brave one. You don't speak so tough any more!
I tell you what let's meet and I will let you hit me first OK?.......
Then I will let you GET UP and hit me again.
If you don't have any pants I can let you wear one of mine.

Last time I hit someone I was still in 3rd grade. Right now I've made it so far up in the world I have other people doing my fighting for me besides I wouldn't hit a girl so you don't have to worry. Trust me child I have enough money to hire Kimbo Slice to fight you if I really wanted to.

Dominicanation
Well "this girl" would be easy to defeat then won't it?
Just what I thought and you have now reconfirmed it....no balls, you don't walk your talk.
You said: "I have other people doing my fighting"...
I would really be ashamed if I was you, you are nothing but a big sissy.
Well I tell you what bring your hired Haitian Ton Ton macoutes and all your other goons and black
magic powder and machetes and all. I will just take my Sammy Sosa little league aluminum bat to
use your ugly heads like baseballs and bat home runs with them you chicken shit slimy MTFH.
PS Kimbo Slice would not last one round with me before he would be vomiting and drowning in his own blood.

Generoso shouldn't you be out there filming another assault on the Haitians living in the bateyes?

Generoso shouldn't you be out there on the streets of NY dressing up as a drag queen.

"
Written by: Dominicanation, 11 Dec 2008 6:25 PM
From: Dominican Republic
Generoso We all know that you and Laturo made that video. Generoso you cut the hand and Laturo was recording it. The Question is Where was Rubi in all of this?
"
You are a beast !!! no one find it funny man, now you are showing your true ignorant color, now you wonder why Haiti is in that mess ?

antonio the way I see it is this you people did it in 1937 and wasn't sorry about it and your people continued to do it still and here you are antonio from Canada you have not done anything about it during your lifetime so what do you want me to do man. You are in a better position of fixing the problem but YOU WON'T. The way I see it is this you can pretend to be sorry all you want that's all BS until YOU antonio do something to better the situation I'm not impress. When I see things like this happening to my people I don't get mad, I laugh because it's funny, it's funny this Haitian man will find justice in the eyes of the only person that matters most "God" That Dominican man may have the best of the Haitian man this time on earth but in the final judgment I know that God will favor the Haitian man and that's why I laugh because all I saw in that video was a victory for that Haitian man in front of God.

antonioj
Latest news: Video was posted in a Colombian site in February 2008 and was a Colombian paramilitary not a Haitian.

http://www.clavedigital.com/App_P....-machetazo-no-corresponde-al-pais

"
Written by: generoso, 11 Dec 2008 9:22 PM
From: United States
antonioj
Latest news: Video was posted in a Colombian site in February 2008 and was a Colombian paramilitary not a Haitian.

http://www.clavedigital.com/App_P....-machetazo-no-corresponde-al-pais
"
Thanks for the update man, hey Dominicanation now you should have hold your fire and not be so condescending, do you seriously think Lautaro, Carlos ect.. will do such thing ? the answer is obviously no, however I did not appreciate you jokingly accusing them. Level up man.

Oh! Well I don't know man these guys are hardcore Haitian haters who knows. I know they had nothing to do with the video but that's not an impossible thing neither so.

Now tell me again where does the video come from?

antonioJ
This a..hole is just a immature and no cojones transvestite with a skirt loose cannon that throws the stone and then runs and hides.

rom1804 said: "Oh! Well I don't know man these guys are hardcore Haitian haters who knows"

The only thing that I have a hardcore hatred for is your incurable stupidity and rabble rousing, because, as a kmnupe said, you're just a nuisance (and a terribly persistent one at that). Don't you ever tire of making a fool of yourself in front of so many people reading this site? Do you honestly think that my diplomatic attitude would have enabled me to endure your constant rants and insults against my country? (and no, I don't celebrate arka's and rubi's extremism either). If you think that being a supporter of peace between both countries implies enduring morons like you defaming my country time and again then you're sadly mistaken, fool.

Lautaro I'm still waiting for your proof as to where the Kennedy family is in part responsible for the Dominicans' ill image around the world.

And yes Lautaro you do fit the description of someone that would do such a thing. You Arky and Rubi roll in the same bang wagon hey if it walks like a duck, quacks like a duck well mostly likely it is a duck and you buddy are sure in the same boat as the other two mentioned above. You claim that you want peace but you oppose to my resolution of unity how can you have peace if we don't reunite? Tell me the way I see it is this if you are against the unification of the two sides then you are against peace as well because with unity comes peace and I will do everything within my power for the reunification of Ayiti.

?, How come you all always wake up grumpy, there's always so much hating in here, I'm beggining to think that maybe you all are really old men with nothing better to do then bash each other, get over yourselves, life does not revolve around you all, ok, pardon the expression.

Look for the 2006 Robert F. Kennedy "Human Rights" award, it's hard to miss. Do you want proof enough? And yes, I'm against it because the same variable that made that union fail, that is, intolerance from both sides to respect the culture of the other, is still in place.

Blame LAT and his minions, also knowns as Arky , Rubi and Moe I mean Lau.

These 3 stooges are always causing chaos on this site. It's not their fault they are just students proud students of Trujilloism.

"These 3 stooges are always causing chaos on this site. It's not their fault they are just students proud students of Trujilloism. "

Better that than to be a pathetic student of noirism (or afronazism more like it). Tell me, which of the two ideologies have brought more material progress on the island?

gatitapequena
You are so right pussycat for the term is "grumpy old men". They take it out on the world the fact
that the testosterone builds up with no outlet other than "beating their chicken" and they become loose cannons just firing away at everybody like the visiting illegal Haitians always trespassing
uninvited and causing havoc just like they do outside the thread.
When God made DR so beautiful and perfect then He made Haiti next door to remind Dominicans
that there is a hell and a dark side to be careful not to fall into by being naughty and mean.

haitian your sick, how can you say that, chill out

Keep in mind I would rather go hunting with Dick Cheney than for a drive with Teddy Kennedy

The thing with that, Smitty, is that this project of yours would spell disaster for the island because of two reasons: 1- As much influence as the haitian diaspora might exert with Obama, there's no way that he would be able to convince the american taxpayer to finance any project as big as that relating to Haiti, specially after they have seen so many funds dedicated to that country disappear as a whiff of smoke because of the insatiable greed of your politicians. Without any financial backing whatsoever there's no way for a project of that magnitude to sustain itself., and 2- The absolute negative of the islanders (dominicans and haitians alike) to support that project, specially when you're asking one of the parts (the dominican one) the lunacy of renouncing its language and culture, which would entail its cutting its ties with rest of the spanish speaking America. So my friend, what you're asking for is chimerical at best, if not nightmarish at worst.

Dear Lautaro,

You know very well Dominicans have a Love-Hate relation with Haitians. Dominicans have a problem with poor Haitians.

I am not saying that Dominicans should abandon their culture. I would like to see a total fusion of both cultures , which has already started. My objective is achievable. I strongly believe Obama would welcome the idea.

I thought I was the only one riding on the crazy train. Smitty you need help! I've already started the Reunification project and I will get even more money to fund my pet project once MR. O, The big O takes office in 2009. Wait and see.

Dream on, haitianation. Mr. O has his hands tied to his back right now, specially with the looming recession and its likely consequences, i. e. the biggest unemployment wave since the crisis of 1930. Heck, no one knows if his popularity will be able to survive the economic crisis intact. He may have to spend all the political capital that he earned on this elections just by begging the american people to have patience while he looks for a way out of this mess. So if I were you I would not expect any help (at least financially speaking) on that quarter.