Dear France:

Why don't you become responsible of the mess that you left next to us that you want to get rid being irresponsible putting the burden on Dominicans when we never ask to be part of this haitian mess
that french left behind.

Help the haitians that are your chidren that you never want to acknowledge maybe because they are blacks or maybe because you want to teach them a lesson after killing so many french during their
african revolt.

Last but not least remember France that Dominicans and haitians are no like and we have 2 different cultures, languages on the other side of the token We Dominicans don't want to be part of the haitian chaos that international community, ONU, Canada, US and french want to dump on the Dominican republic.

"Peace but respect first to the Dominican constitution, our flag and Duarte, Sanchez and Mella"

Thanks God some people are leaders ,the are called to solve conflicts. Some others are just plain racist and ignorant .They just flap their lips and post stupidities and do not solve nothing.
Thanks God Leonel lives in the Dominican Republic and understand what is going .Some others are useless .They just sit comfortably in in their apartments in Long Island devouring rice and grandules and fried chicken and hablando mierdas.
Two different cultures and two different cultrures ?
One speaks Spanish and is Catholic
The other is African, speaks Creole and practices Voodoo.
After 500 years of intebreeding we get the rich mixture of influences that make up the NEW DOMINICAN REPUBLIC.
Wake up nostalgia and smell the coffee !
Wake up perejil boy and see the new Dominican Republic !

go to a skin head rally or a ku klux klan rally and then tell me about your culture and your race.
sleep little boy . it is only a dream!

joseano you should be LF number one supporter, his keeping your compatriots alive and safe, if it was Trujillo.... oh boy!

Joseano, don't forget to buy me ingles sin barrera for xmas.
If you don't have enough money, please try harder with those kids.

the western civilizations are responsible for bringing these unfortunate people but France is most responsible for this mess But they have disasters on their hands in Martinique and Guadalupe and they are France proper.......A bottomless welfare pit

Etiennc;
LF is the worst thing to happen to this country since Mejia. But wait until you see how Vargas screws things up.

Budget for 2010....347Billion
Government projection of income for 2010....47Billion less than the budget

From whom are we going to borrow this money?
How are we going to improve our horrific education?
How are we going to solve the immigration crisis, if we have no money to spend on border security?

How many people are sneaking into the European countries as illegals? Not to many and they have common borders. They have money to spend on their border security.

this is the black ignorant rhttp://www.elnacional.com.do/naci....-hacen-pocima-contra-dolenciasace in africa.

Aren't haitians ashame of how many countries debate over whos responsible for the sorry azz state they call haiti, everybody in the mother f**ing planet is traying to help haiti, aren't you people tired of been the step child everybody is helping but nobody wants in their house.

Only when Haitians learn how to help themselves will haiti recover the status of NATION.

right now haiti is a protectorate of the united nations and always will be, sorry if i offended you, but the truth hurts sometimes, you, the afro-lambon need to look in the mirror and ask yourself, where is the pride, where is my patriotism, why i rather argue with dominicans when i have my own country, why cry and demand rights on a foreign land when i have my country?

I tell you why you cry so much

You cry so much to get what you want because your kind doesn't have the ballz to fight and get it.

You have no pride and patriotism because you're too much a puss to have a patria

Etiennc,

As a proud nationalist Dominican, I consider Haitian culture completely foreign to my own. i acknowledge that there have been prominent Dominicans of Haitian descent throughout our history as there have been prominent Dominicans with diverse backgrounds from all over the world. However, I am a little disturbed by your comment that my modern Dominican cultural identity is a result of "500 years of interbreeding that gives a rich mixture of influences".

I understand that our influences are European, Native American and African, but in my mind I never attributed the African part to Haiti, since the DR (like almost every other Latin American country) always had an "Afro-Latin" population in the mix.

Perhaps, I lack facts on this one. Could someone please give me examples of cultural components that exist today as a result of Haitian cultural influence.

blu "the western civilizations are responsible for bringing these unfortunate people but France is most responsible for this mess "

Agree in the biggest context the blame should go to the French and not the poor victim Haitian They didn't know better. How in hell they brought 600,000 African Slaves in 60 years. Think about this Spanish population in the east was no more than 70,000 at the end of 1800's.

Then If we go by a biggest context the blame should be go to the Spanish Crown for threatening their creoles in the Española with death if they don't move to the eastern side of the island. Leaving behind a great opportunity to the French to seize the rich land full of livestock.

These stupid hatians have their own land but yet they wanna come to ours and destroy everything we build and wanan be a part of DR. They call us racist because they dont wanna hear others tell them that they should work out their issues in their own god dam country just like we are doing. But no instead they come to destroy and talk shit.

Yet instead of talking shit about us why dont they fight with their leaders instead of joining dominican post discussions thats not even theirs and instead go talk to your leaders about your problems. we have enought with ours and also have to deal with theirs but all they can come up with is that we are racist this is allways what blacks do its their best card to justify their actions so people will agree with them.

Dont barter dominican nationality Mr. Fernandez ( Let the french take care of haiti)

Pu them in french guyana (plenty of trees to burn there) JAJJAJAJAJJA

bankai,
there are no trees on their side

Afro-pato.

Reading this blog the irony of all this, the Porto Rican feels exactly the same way towards the Dominican.

"LF is the worst thing to happen to this country since Mejia. But wait until you see how Vargas screws things up."

So tell me, on whose watch did DR's economy got up and did so well? Oh yeah, that is on Leonel Fernandez when it was reported that DR's economy drastically improved in 2004 as its economy has halves that of Haiti. Define ungatefulness!

You all can be pleased that there is a metro in DR as well as all these developements which have kept many tourists busily investing into our Country all that took place on Leonel's watch. Otherwise, not one of your extremist radical asses would have done sh!t for DR; but the minute there is talk for Dominican-Haitian relations, without even know what bilateralism means you all start crying xenophobic wolves and rivers.

Most of you neo-conservative protectionist Dominicans are only good to spew hate from the comfort of your homes in the USA or Dominican elite neighborhoods yet want to use us the mass poor populace to carry out your ill divisive deeds.

Why don't you all extremist-radical-conservatives Dominicans take the streets of DR or head toward the frontier/borders and build that darn wall you are rambling all the time about yourselves with your very own money?

All many of you know is that you were born to hate Haitians because of all the resentful hatred nonsenses your racist parents have raised you up with which have made you all to think you are all better than other human beings.

pat diamond you are obviously not from the Spanish Antilles and know nothing of Puerto Rico you are probably Caricom/ BWI cocolo trash

Well, the Puerto Ricans should have a field day with this! Because they too feel more than less the same way about Dominicans, as some of you do about Haitians. When you all want to spew your garbage of hate to incite violence, just know that not all of us Dominicans share your views which aim to keep the island divided in terms of better relations fro a greater island in whole. Many of you ill-educated do not know what the word "Relations" is much less would I expect you would know "Bilateralism." The words "Relations or Bilateralism" do not mean "Unification or One governance" you bunch of idiots.

There are several things that it falls under or that it caters to in terms of improving the conditons or the situation on the ground in the island as a whole. So please stop using and spreading your tactic of fears to gain support for your malice intents of your negative resentful agendas.

"Agree in the biggest context the blame should go to the French and not the poor victim Haitian They didn't know better. How in hell they brought 600,000 African Slaves in 60 years. Think about this Spanish population in the east was no more than 70,000 at the end of 1800's.

Then If we go by a biggest context the blame should be go to the Spanish Crown for threatening their creoles in the Española with death if they don't move to the eastern side of the island. Leaving behind a great opportunity to the French to seize the rich land full of livestock."

THERE YOU GO! THIS IS THE FIRST TIME SOMETHING WORTHY TO READ HAS BEEN SAID ON THIS SITE IN WHOLE. THOSE ARE YOUR CULPRITS TO BLAME FOR MUCH OF THE ILLS MOST OF THOSE FORMER COLONIZED NATIONS ARE FACING TODAY (THE CARIBBEAN - CENTRAL - LATIN AMERICAS). SPAIN, FRANCE & PORTUGAL ARE THE ONES WHO STARTED THEIR MESSES, THEY SURE AS HELL MUST BE HELD ACCOUNTABLE FOR THE DIVISIVE MENTALITIES THEY HAVE LEFT FOR US TO DEAL WITH.

France should make Haiti an overseas department, like Guadeloupe and Martinique, etc etc. so that it is easier for Haitians to enter mainland France instead of crossing over to our country.

Tanfea Mami ,how could people who were only one step ahead of the cave man form anything worthwhile?

The comment about the French "Mistake" was to bring more savages than they could control and since these savages became "independent " a long time ago the root of their backwardness (and ours to some extent ) is not the fault of France,Spain or Portugal but to the cultural backwardness of the people who were brought over.

You cannot make a gentleman out of a savage in one generation ,and it was worse in Haiti because the few people who knew how to run a country ,its economy and infrastructure were either killed or chased away leaving the patients in charge of the asylum.

So you can continue the idiocy of blaming others or you can start to improve yourself and unfortunately in many countries in Ibero America blaming others is the favourite sport because if they really want to fix their problems they would have to look in the mirror and see the reason for the backwardness!

By the way Tan Fea Mami Criollos and Creoles do not have the same implication the Criollos were Spaniards born in the overseas territories while creole has an implied racial mix aspect to it.

Also Criollo has a strong ethnic association with Spain unlike creole which has no direct ties to any nation just a mix.

So please toss out the Afrocentrist bible in your hand and open some history books from real authors.

haiti should just be another united states commonwealth thats only solution for a failed country like theres

@Pepe32

My dear friend I feel your pain, it must be hard to live in a country where your manhood is being challenged daily. Somebody got to take the blame for all your shortfalls. One of the greatest discovery for me in my studies of American history is the fact that those that took on wearing that infamous white hood over their heads were no much better economicaly, socialy,and so on then the blacks that they had so much hatred for. Keep typing away my friend you are coming thru loud and clear.

PS. Have you ever wonder why the skinhead movement started in poor working class areas in Liverpool ?

Patdiamond, we too feel your pain. Should be terrible being born in a country that is only shortfalls, crying babies, unable to take responsibility for those shortfalls and do something meaningful about it and beggars, always with their hands extended for alms, being forced to export their surplus population toward places that don't want them and scramble to find suitable excuses, like racism, to explain it all.

Wow

There you go! This below is the first time something worthy to read has been said on this site in whole. those are your culprits to blame for much of the ills most of those former colonized nations are facing today (the caribbean - central - latin americas). spain, france & portugal are the ones who started their messes, they sure as hell must be held accountable for the divisive mentalities they have left for us to deal with.

""Agree in the biggest context the blame should go to the French and not the poor victim Haitian They didn't know better. How in hell they brought 600,000 African Slaves in 60 years. Think about this Spanish population in the east was no more than 70,000 at the end of 1800's. ."

Then If we go by a biggest context the blame should be go to the Spanish Crown for threatening their creoles in the Española with death if they don't move to the eastern side of the island. Leaving behind a great opportunity to the French to seize the rich land full of livestock

WHY HAVE I NOT SEE MORE COMMENTS LIKE THIS PLACING THE BLAME WHERE IT BELONGS. THEY ARE THE ONES WHO WRONGED PLACES AROUND THE WORLD. SPAIN, FRANCE & PORTUGAL AMONG OTHERS.

They killed, invaded, innahalated and more worse...

Micaele

The wounds of history are still fresh in your mind huh? Would you like to have it rewritten. It's kind of hard when you have to take a look @ the man in the mirror is it not?

Yes, to my mind the answer to the Haiti crisis lies with the international community. Restoration of agriculture ,immediate food and housing needs of Haiti have been largely ignored.
http://news.bbc.co.uk/2/hi/in_pictures/8381276.stm
Haiti needs aid to become self sufficient in food - this also provides work restoring terraces, irrigation, forests etc. If this were done then the problems of immigration in the DR would be much reduced. The cost of such a program might be a billion dollars a year for five years - not so large compared with defense budgets etc. Perhaps a tax on tourism throughout the Caribbean could contribute - 50 dollar air ticket tax for example.
S.

"The few people who knew how to run a country ,its economy and infrastructure were either killed or chased away leaving the patients in charge of the asylum."

You see, that is a good analysis. However, but your vulgar emotionally charged tone took so much credit from it and defeat its effectiveness. This is something I have been telling people. Often we have good observation and analysis, but we tarnish them with ill charged remarks thinking that it will resonate better with people or that it will drive you points home quicker. No, in fact when one allows these subjective emotionally charged statements, remarks prevail you prove nothing and your points get met with animosity instead of objective understanding. The above evaluation however was valid nevertheless.

Abc200,

These are some things my boyfriend wrote which might be in the line of what you are trying to say ---> http://www.everythinghaitian.com/....gDetail.aspx?BID=613&PID=1513 After that link, check this one ---> http://www.everythinghaitian.com/....gDetail.aspx?BID=613&PID=1522 Also this one ----> http://www.everythinghaitian.com/....gDetail.aspx?BID=613&PID=1517 So let me know also if this one is good as well ----> http://www.everythinghaitian.com/....gDetail.aspx?BID=613&PID=1523

Yes Bankai... as you say :
All these stupid people who have their own land and yet want to go to another land / country... and be part of it!
And to others...:
Nobody could rewrite history; nobody could heal the deep wounds and injustice of colonialism. It was a time in history and many, too many parts of the world were wrongly divided, and suffer, at some level, since then. You were ONE culture who shared ONE island until the Spanish came..., then the French..., then the Africans...
Political occurances also change the course of development of a country.
It is a VERY difficult, delicate and frustrating situation for all instances who have been involved to improve the situation and of course, mostly for a "neighbour country".
However, the answer cannot be in blind hatred, revenge and racism (racist comments anyways).

All these stupid people who have their own land and yet want to go to another land / country and be part of it!


So is that the same case for Dominicans heading to Puerto Rico, Netherlands and USA? Okay much the same can be said for those too, right... Or I am sure you will justify it less with your excusable rationalization in number differentials to claim it is not the same act of migration.

Migrations happen the difference being we are not walking aimlessly on the streets or begging people for money or destroying other peoples forested areas. Instead of looking at what others are doing why dont you look at the things your NOT doing like helping your own haitians and stop leaving YOUR problems for someone else to fix.

First of all tanfeamami when you make an idiotic and incendiary comment like this;

"THERE YOU GO! THIS IS THE FIRST TIME SOMETHING WORTHY TO READ HAS BEEN SAID ON THIS SITE IN WHOLE."

you cannot expect a graceful response.When the madame likes a comment it is deemed WORTHY and the only comment she liked was the Evil colonialists are responsible for everything and the poor darkie "victims" have nothing to do in their own demise. In other words the Afrocentrist discourse and the denial of reality.

.

Bottom line

1.We cannot support all those Haitians (We are poor)
2.We cannot trust the Haitians (History proves that)
3.DR will only become more backwards with all the Haitian immigration

Haiti needs a 'land army' to restart agriculture, forestry in many areas. Able bodied people should be recruited for contracts. Schools can be shut for longer holidays to enable children over 14 to help. An amazing amount of yams and other nutritious food could be grown and distributed.
http://www.bbc.co.uk/dna/h2g2/A2072756
A priority should be given to train teachers and others with capability simple horticulture and agriculture and established 'peoples farms' next to schools, factories etc. Schools of couse should keep bees, raise chickens, rabbits and goats. I actually enjoyed helping manage the beehive at school.
Agricultural colleges as in the UK and China with attached farms should be a government priority:
http://www.geo.ed.ac.uk/scotgaz/features/featurefirst7721.html
Vedrine is far better qualified than I and his article makes interesting reading:
http://www.potomitan.info/vedrine/agriculture.pdf

pepe32

tanfeamami

is a DUDE

the so called afrolatino, another shameless man with identity problems and this time he choose to be a girl, don't waste your time debating with this transgender.

oldschool

Te lo dije. Esa es otra de la tantas alias de Afro-latino. Sabia que tambien se hace pasar por Dominicana. :ROLL:

I don't think we the Haitians need that kind of attention, where our "friend" the Dominican republic is asking investment for itself and welfare assistance for us. It is another to tell the world : you see we the Dominicans are superior to the Haitians, so treat us like a white latino country like Brazil and give us the money forget those Haitians niggers.
With friends like youm, we don't need enemies..

To Oupala07,

"you see we the Dominicans are superior to the Haitians, so treat us like a white latino country like Brazil and give us the money forget those Haitians niggers."

A"white latino country like Brazil..." What a nonsensical statement. First, Brazil is not a white latino country. Check your facts. Again, go after your own incompetent overlords and chop some sense into them. It's only when Haitians finally agree to do what's right for their own, that the situation in Haiti will reverse its tragic course from the abyss.

What is it, Patdiamon? Your mind betrayed you? Yes, the wounds of history are still fresh in your mind and I am sure you would like very much to have your history rewritten, so would not be so hard to have to take a look at yourself in the mirror. In your rewritten history, your country would not be the poorest in America and one of the poorest in the world, maybe that place would be reserved for DR, right?

Yes Micaela
I finally understand, your nationality is all you have to claim in this world,rock on. It's only fair to say that makes you feel superior only to the poor illigal Haitian migrant in DR.
As I have stated before the irony in all this is the Porto Rican feel about you exactly the same way you feel about the Haitian.

PS Im very proud of my history First and only successful slave revolt in history. It is the story of the triumph of the will of man. Do you care to elaborate on yours?Specially that 22 years period.

the last to post by oupala and patdiamond show the amount of frustration hidden within the haitian diaspora

1st oupala said:

"you see we the Dominicans are superior to the Haitians, so treat us like a white latino country like Brazil and give us the money forget those Haitians niggers."

this tell you they are ashame of the color of their skin and feel descriminated by everyone specially the evil white dominicans.

2nd patdiamond said:

" finally understand, your nationality is all you have to claim in this world,rock on. It's only fair to say that makes you feel superior only to the poor illigal Haitian migrant in DR."

this comment highlight the inferiory complex many haitian are born with.

there is your asnwer as to why Haiti will always be a failed state with no hope of ever developing into a respectable nation, we need to build that wall along the border or the whole island will dry up and die just like haiti.

Is there any reason why I should not claim my nationality? You said it make me feel superior only to the poor illegal Haitian migrants in DR; it may be, now superior to whom do you feel? I am only Dominican, what Puerto Ricans, Haitians and Russians feel is their problem. And go ahead, feel proud of your history, is ok; although I would call it the triumph of a millionaire compensation over the will of man, but whatever.

For 22 years an army of bloodthirsty, savages, uneducated and greedy bunch of Haitians soiled my country, under the assumption that they have a superior, trained, and better equipped army only to be beaten in all fields by our heroic men and women. We defeated you and later the Spanish, twice faced valiantly the army of USA and today are in a better shape that you ever have been. Need any more elaboration Patdiamon?

Thank you Vacanos for attempting to have an intellectual debate and discuss the real issues that have plagued Haiti since they claimed independence.

Micaela

PS. I'm not sure if you know this,but this stuff is offered as an elective @ Universities in the US and beyond?

@Old school -jack- ass

I happen to be a Haitian with a Centurion Card,trust me my skin color is never an issue for me.

Well done micaela, but please don't waste your time trying to prove something you don't need to prove; you have to ignore these haitian brothers, they think they have more knowledge than anybody. They have this notion in their mind, about something that happened 200 year ago, instead of focussing their mind on how they can better their people.
Then again patdemon is way too intellectual for this forum, right Pat?....and oupala think haitians are the only brave people in this continent.
We stood up to the mighty USA in 1965 to the point that Lindon Johnson had to send a negociator to end the war. We beat the Spanish army twice, the only one we've lost was againt the hatians because we did not ethnic cleansing them. Hope to hear from you soon.

What's new? When a Haitian has nothing to say, plays the race card. We were talking about claiming my nationality, of how you feel proud of your history and of course of my history. Where skin color or race was mentioned for you to come with it now. If you have a Centurion Card, good for you. Congratulations! I could care less.

How much time must past before people are held responsible for there actions and the state of their own country, 100 YR’S 200 YR’S EVER? Okay so the French the Spanish the Europeans started thing’s and left things a mess committed crimes trafficked in humans all of that is horrible. Isn’t this true about most of the countries in the world yet none of these countries are even half way as failed as Haiti.

When is the mess that’s happening in Haiti ever be the fault or responsibility of the Haitians? Every one seems to be responsible for fixing Haiti but the Haitians.

There are people in this site who seem to want a world with no borders and when people state the obvious, they call it hate. How can DR unite with Haiti if DR can’t even help itself, how can this truth be taken as anything other than reality. The border between DR and Haiti must be militarized; the Haitian’s must be forced to deal wit

The DR military must do anything possible to control the mass exodus of Haitians into DR.
It will never be completely eliminated but for the sake of DR’s existents it must be met by any means necessary.

If wanting DR to exist the way it barely exist now makes me an extremist-radical-conservative Dominican then so be it.

Many drug dealers have centurion cards but the reality is that like most pitis patdemon is probably just a BS artist like many that come into this forum stating that they went to this university and then proving with their writings that they barely finished high school if that.
Why would a self described rich person spend so much time in this forum that is not even about his backwards tribe? This guy is probably just another piti living in a roach infested basement in Spring Valley fantasizing about Haitian "greatness" and believing his own BS so I wouldn't give him too much importance.

Ahi tienen los que querian PLD, el pendejo ahora va a dejar que unifiquen la isla. Ya si se va a joder el pais, mas de los que esta.

@Pixeles
http://MiBahia.net

Pixeles,lo hace el PLD y Leonela y peor aun el los Robolucionarios,el único que defendía la soberanía era Balaguer .

Pepe32
FIY I made my F$&ck U money with MANFinancial,currently call MFGlobal on the mechantile exchange and the FOOTSE 100. I keep telling you running the block is not a legitimate enterprise outside of your culture.

Keep typing away son, like I said in my previous post you are coming thru loud and clear.

MSJersey I see yo have been taking your meds, finally you are putting some coherent thoughts togheter,again congrats.

Mecaela I truly feel you pain, next time I check in at Xaragua we should get together are you ready to do what your guys do best overthere. Are you ready to suck some you know what and sip champagne?

Hey pepe32

will your mom be around or is she putting down work at one of those $21 spot in Jackson heights queens?

Hey Pepe

I run a trading desk I seat in front of a bloomberg Terminal all day. This site is my form of entertainment.I might be rich to your standard but I have not reach my full potential yet.
Keep on typing ,I keep telling you the world is not laughing with you guys ,but laughing at you. There is a difference alright Professor.

White Latino country like Brazil,lol lol lol

Oupala, le pays avec le plus de gens d'origine africaine en dehors du continent africain (AU MONDE) C'est bien le Bresil, Ils ne sont pas des blancs latinos, comme tu le dis.

Que fantasia tiene el piti este...

Ahora dizque trabaja en la bolsa de valores !!!

Lo mas seguro es que limpia los inodoros en Wall Street y se cree accionista!@#$$

Yo soy el Rey de Inglaterra y vengo a este foro a entretenerme con las bestias piti como el patdemonio.

Dear PatDemon EVERYONE laughs at Haitians because you are the most backwards and ridiculous people on the face of the earth.Haitians are the butt of jokes everywhere and though you should be pitied your attitude makes you detestable because though you have created the biggest latrine in this hemisphere you go around strutting with your chests out .You are truly a pitiful lot and no hope can be found for idiots that cannot see how terrible the mess they have created is .
Please keep in mind Mr. Fantasy piti millionare (LOL) that nobody knows anybody in this forum and that it is only the Haitians that come in making extravagant claims of richness or education when we can see in the writings you post a simple m

minded cretin.

But lets humour you mr rich bonobo..assuming you are so rich and are womanizing like all careless animals while your people are literally eating dirt to live .Why don't you dedicate your millions in monopoly money on your people and use your"power" and money to help your "great" people?

You know fantasies are OK but once in a while people have to come to reality and while you spend your time in this forum you could have spent it more usefully in Haiti or in Haitian forums attacking the root of the problem ,now I know that with the piti-card you have and from your Spring Valley basement all you can do is come into Dominican forums to somehow feel useful and since you cannot clean up your cesspool somehow trashing DR makes you feel better .Thank God we don't care what Haitians say in their forums nor do we infest your forums like you do with ours because our main concern is DR and the many problems we have of which the main one is your people flooding the border.

Why do all the Haitians and Proto-Haitians have to lie about who they are?

Because they have no arguments and they thinks that somehow saying I am rich and I went to so and so university will win their argument ...Unfortunately their writing indicates their real stature and their insecurities are exposed every time they write .

If Haitians were so great they would not be in the disaster they are in now but they prefer to blame EVERYONE else except for their own ignorance and backwardness.

Why do such a "great" people eat dirt in peace time?
Why can such a "great" people not form a stable government ?
Why have such a "great"people destroyed their ecosystem?
Why did such a "great" warrior people have to pay the French indemnization?
Why can this "gift" to the world not take care of its own?
Why are such "great" people mainly illiterate?
Why do such a "great" people have demon worship as an official religion?
Why do these "great" people need assistance from the whol

Hi everybody, i am an Haitian living in Florida.

hey guys i am glad to be part of this conversation this is something that i've been thinking of getting done long time ago because my Haitians ancesters fourth to liberate the island from the great empire and right now we share the island with the Dominican people and they get two third of the island, if i could be the President of Haiti that's would be my first initiative to unite the island because we deserve more, we are the one who fight to give the freedom that the Dominican people are enjoying now they did not help us kicked their ass out on the island we did it in our own and we are the only one who did it that way.After the independence we committed a big mistake not to unify the island in one even though President Boyer tried it over 20 some years but he failed to maintain it.

I hope you understand that guys...

Why does the "victor" pay reparations,because they really didn't win
Why does Makaby want unification when they have created a cesspool?
Why does this bonobo think they can beat us when we destroyed their piti armies over and over?
Why does he want to emulate the demon boyer?
Will ,we be eating dirt cakes too? mmmmm they must be delicious !
Will you destroy our forests too?
Will you teach us your great advanced civilization ?
Will you teach us how to rip a chickens head off with our teeth?
Will we be as successful as Haiti in the world?

Please makeby make my day ,all we need is a little action on our side and we will send every last piti packing and even some undesirables from our side (very Haitian like).
You will finally give us a perfect reason to end this BS once and for all ,then we can place mines along the border and create a buffer zone .You can then face millions of starving "great" people burning down Puerco Principe and killing each other as usual.

But don't c

cry afterwards when reality slaps you in the face and you realize that all your ideas of greatness were nothing but mental diarrhea .

Hey Pepe

I truly understand man,like I said to you and old -school it must be hard to live in a country that supposed to be full of opportunities and finding your self kicking a can down the street everyday while your wife is doing what she got to do in the back seat of her boss New Prado so the kids can have some chicken back for dinner. That does not make you feel like a man does it. somebody got to feel the warth of that anger huh. But I sure selling that ass come natural to her.

A Dominican calling black people darkies and so one. Nigga please is not fact your number one export is whores?

Poor Patdiamon. I was not a Frenchwoman slaves owner, exploiting your grandady. I was not one of the Trinitarios that beat the hell out of you and sent you scurrying to your side, I am not Haitian elite, therefore, no responsible for stealing the begged resources and the mess that you have made of your country. But keep at it if that make you happy. Being Haitian I know that few things may be sweet for you. By the way I don't have the slightly idea where is Xaragua, but I imagine is the place where your wife, daughters and sisters work, because you are all rich and educated and certainly sip champagne, so don't worry about me and keep enjoying it. Have as much as you can and maybe tonight you may sleep dreaming that you are not Haitian and be happy. Sweet dreams, Patty.

Haitians would not want the world laughing at you. Not that is unacceptable, you are happy only if the world cries for you, is disgusted with you, pity you even if they are fed up with your poor black, abused victim me game, but laughing at you, not at all. Laughing would mean that they know that you are the biggest joke, that in your present situation, instead of working to overcome it, you entertain yourselves with ridiculous past greatness delirious

Finally Patty you are showing you true colors. Our women sell their asses for money, yours so desperately want to eat something different that dirt cookies, that they do it only for food. But I bet that that make Haitian men feel like real men and happy on top, because they can have some table scraps. Our number one export is whores? what is yours? Pitiful beggars, smelly, hungry, illiterate, sick, people, that you insist in exporting, but nobody wants and do their best to return them to you; so what is your number one export?

.

It is almost hilarious to have a Haitian talking about chicken dinners .I guess his family is having mud cakes and eating mud pies so I guess eating chicken is a big deal for this bonobo.

Don't worry patdemon ,you Haitians are so deluded you try to tell everyone those mud cakes are actually GOOD and NUTRITIONAL and your women are so ugly,soooooooooo ugly that men wouldn't
want them for free. You would have to be pretty drunk to do a Haitian woman and have no sense of smell because the stench will overpower any desire,that is why Haitian men go crazy when they meet Dominican women.

Sorry you came from such an ugly crevice but that is not my fault .I'm sorry your mom dropped you from the tree and you have delusions of grandeur in your roach infested basement paid for by your high end Haitian profession (Maintenance Engineer)

Haitian women even know they are ugly,stating "we are ugly but we are here" so poor pat looks at himself and dreams of having money to buy some pretty non

piti women

Lol "MUD COOKIES" are you jokers for real? I mean really!!! Do you guys believe that anybody can survive of dirt? I don't care how strong a man stomach might be, you absolutely cannot digest something like that at least not on a daily basis.

I don't wanna be an hypocrite but growing up in Haiti i did see "CERTAIN" people eating these so call mud cookies. They were eating it not outta hunger but a CRAVE really especially pregnant woman. I TRIED it, it doesn't really have a bad taste to it. And last but not least you can only eat as much as a US DOLLAR coin sized cuz after that the crave vanish and most likely you wont be interested to eat more......

Hey Pepe

seriously how much does your old lady charge. It's going to be about 10 of us Mandingos.

Proof that Haitians are in DENIAL!

Of course the poster (probably the same trolls ,this one created Dec 1) feels mud cakes are some sort of delicacy "doesn't really have a bad taste to it".

Mass delusion of greatness,riches and education in a backwards, abysmally poor and mostly illiterate population.

They will never get out of this hole unless they become realists!

PatDiamond,

Guess who I am?

I just spent a full week in the Dominican Republic visiting the cities of Santiago and Santo Domingo as well as the towns and the villages in between. The experience was as pleasant as my trip to Trinidad and Tobago during Carnival time. Compared to Haiti, which is still living in the stone age, the Dominican Republic is moving at full speed into modernity and towards development.

To start with the activities at the borders, you will notice a convoy of 10 to 12 long haul trucks filled with merchandise going towards Haiti while, on the other side, Haiti has only the hordes of the poor and the destitute to offer to the Dominican Republic. Its army is camped at the entrance of each town to check on the visitors. I have counted 19 military-security posts before entering Santo Domingo.

Micaela

Don't hate the messenger, it is what it is. Forget the bubly, I did not know you would rather go straight to business. Sorry for trying to make it romantic. What is your rate again?

Hey Pepe
get back at me man, I need to know her rate?

Hey pepe32,

You sure are an idiot, why would anyone think mud is a delicacy? Just because something doesn't taste bad does not make it a delicacy. Are you saying just because let say oatmeal doesn't have a bad taste to it does not mean it's a delicacy,
you moron

Attabey

what's the deal son, you used to be a pragmatic type of fellow early on. What happened you was not getting any love from your tribe. Had to pull a FOX effect. You are not looking to do a Glen Beck soon too are you. Be truth to your self young Turk.

PS. Glad to see you are learning a thing or two in PolySI. However that theme in your head, while you may like to repeated it because it has a nice ring to it.,needs a little more depht.

Cont
Here is a good book you might want to pick up Note From the Last Testament / the struggle for Haiti
by Micheal Deibert. Keep burning that midnight oil young man

After leading his country to bankruptcy, the « great » Lionel Fernandez has gone in Europe begging for crumbs, but he had to trash our country in front of his “Good Samaritans”. How lower can someone down himself in the eyes of the international community when he is panhandling. This year, Haiti, with Bolivia was among the sole two countries in the Latin America world which saw a growth (3 % for Haiti) in their economy. We even did better than Bolivia; meanwhile the Dominican economy shrank by more than 2%.

It is not by spreading those kinds of lies, and by beating a negative drum on our back that will save the Dominican Republic from going under. I know the “great and democratic” DominicanToday will be quick to censored these comments of mine, but never mind I haven’t posted them only here. They are being posted every where in the World in order to show to the whole planet what an hypocrite panhandler is, and how low he can get in order to backstab a friend.

Look what we Haitians have done to your city of Dajabon. If she is thriving and burstling now of commercial activity, it is because we have the sense of trade and business even if we are poor and illiterate. And for this dick head to go and insult us in Europe, it is way out of line.

I understand that the poorest Haitians, so hungry, can only concern themselves with food to stay alive and could not spare a thought to the betterment of their country. But a supposedly wealthy, educated man, instead of something positive for his country can only think about whoring, especially how much they charge? Poor country; with that quality of citizens now we know what would be its permanent fate and better understand why most are ashamed to be Haitians.

According to this article in MiBahia.net (http://mibahia.net/?p=6372) Leonel rechazó la fusión de RD y Haití...

Traducción: No le han ofrecido la cantidad correcta para él. Tampronto le den su chelito, hasta el nombre del país lo cambiará. Conozcan la Hermana Republica Haitinicana en la isla de la Haitianiola.

Es Pa'lante Que Vamos!

@Pixeles
http://MiBahia.net

Pat Diamond,

I have not changed, and I am glad to see your posts on the subject. As I've stated before the gentleman who wrote the paragraphs in my previous post is Jean H Charles MSW, JD is Executive Director of AINDOH Inc a non profit organization dedicated to building a kinder and gentle Caribbean zone for all. He can be reached at: jeanhcharles@aol.

He took a look at the situation in DR and his complete article can be read at Caribbean Net News. The man is no spokesperson for any right-wing neo-trujillo group or concern. He went to DR and came away rather impressed with developments. As for the situation with Haitians living in DR, he had a positive summation. He talked to various Haitians living in DR and I doubt any of them pulled their punches in telling him what they believed about their conditions in DR. And his comments on the lack of Haitian leadership in addressing the enormous needs of their people is completely in step with my posts. He pulls no punches

and castigates the ignoble and derelict Haitian elite and leadership for their lack of commitment and abject failure to produce a rational and humane model to address the comatose State and Nation of Haiti.

My issue is that far too many people use the stupid acts-some of course are deadly and vicious- of individuals or small groups of Dominicans, poor or rich, to justify some kind of moral equivalence between the abysmal and Nation and State destruction via the dereliction of duty and honor of the Haitian elite and leadership with the stupid and sometimes criminal acts of some Dominicans. To me its crystal clear: While the Haitian elite and leadership slowly chew their way through the body and soul of the Haitian Nation and State, over 50,000 Haitian students, according to Mr. Charles, are enrolled in colleges and schools of higher education in DR. "500,000 Haitians professionals, doctors, engineers, construction workers, hotel attendants, are enjoying the bliss of a peaceful

PatDemon ,nobody I know is into bestiality and would not be with a stinking sewer smelling Haitian for any amount of money .I think even a hooker has to be very low class to get that close to an animal like you .Today was nice ,I hope you got out of your basement ..

Mr. Atabey what you have written about Haitian accomplishment has nothing to do with what is at issue. First of all whether you would like to admit it or not accomplishments by Haitians are out weighted heavily by the enormous burden that they apply to DR at every level.

Once again what’s at issue is that none of these accomplishments can be achieved in Haiti and the only country that seems to be expected to change such a completely devastated country is DR. This site is about DR and the postings you will find are going to point to the fact that Haiti is an anchor around the neck of DR that is going to sink it

and enjoyable middle class status. Another half a million are soon joining the rank of well to do families happy to work, raise their children and enjoy the good life of a country that values modernity and constant growth."

What kind of Nation and people are these Dominicans? A land of racists and xenophobic people

looking to castigate and humiliate Haitians? Or is the reality quite different and more nuanced?

Any nation facing enormous migrant flows from a neighbor would have serious issues to deal

with; and the host people would have differences and problems adjusting to the waves of

migrants. Mr. Charles, in fact, states rather prudently this point: "I find it hard for the Haitian people

(with their culture of exclusion) to absorb, without an uproar, more than a million Dominicans into

their territory, with a majority of them, with no basic education, no grooming and requesting

essential services such as health care, housing and social services."

PatDiamond, Oupala07, et al:

So you see, when viewed objectively the situation of Haitians in DR is far closer to our (Dominican) views than to those of the opposition. Just some food for thought.



---------- --------------- ---------------- --------------------------------
OGNYC,

What are you referring to??

Atabey , I get it now you want to ignore the real issue. You want to insult Dominicans by saying that its easier for them to accept Haitian’s so they should accept the devastating price of Haitian immigration and you want to put it as simple immigration from one country t the next.

I will remind you for the last time that DR is not a country that can deal with its own so how can it be expected to accept immigration form any other country. On top of the immigration its expected to take with out any protest, it is also expected to fixed a failed devastated country. I question your intelligence if you can’t look at even the simplest numbers about DR and come to this conclusion. But then again your worry is Haitian’s my worry is Dominican’s and Dominican Republic.

OCNYC, Pepe32

All these rotten words of yours can't hide the truth and the reality my friend, your government is closing its eyes on the illegal immigrants invasion, because it suits its business. Why don't you the Dominicans go work in the sugar cane fields for peanut? Why don't you go to work in your hard labour construction industry for peanut? Why dont you go to work in the cash crops fields for peanut? Your government and your industrialists are happy to replace you with that cheap labour, and now you are accusing them of invading you. Believe me my friend, if it was your government desire to stop the flow of illegal immigrants in his country, there'd have been a long time since that would have been taken care of.
your government are obliged to take care of those poor people, because it's your president who willfully let them in your country, because you know that your economy would collapse withtout them. Therefore, stop complaining and face reality.

OGNYC,

Again, I don't understand where you get the idea that I want to flood DR with Haitians. Where have I stated such notions?

Micaela ,he like most piti´s (and certain Dominicans)is prone to extreme exaggerations and outright BS.He probably has some dead end job and knows behind the pseudonym he can say he is the king of the Congo ,but you are right his writing shows what kind of human garbage he really is .

If he cared so much about Haiti ,he should spend his "millions" in Haiti instead of writing garbage in a Dominican forum but that mindset is only one of the reasons Haiti is so screwed up and unless they change their idiotic mentality ,they will NEVER get out of the hole they are in.

somewhere else

OGNY,Atabey did not post anything like that ..you should read in detail before responding.

He brought an unbiased third party that would normally be prone to support the Haitian side and this man came to some of the very conclusions we have come to in DR.

The Haitians and pitiphiles in the forum cannot accept anything that is not their intransigent position whereas Haitians are only heroes and victims ,never responsible for their state and only outsiders are responsible for their fiasco.On the other hand they still don't accept that they should erect a monument to the mighty mosquito that destroyed the French armies but of course they want all the credit for their luck. So if it's bad ,it's someone else's fault and anything good that happens even if one Haitian happened to be cleaning the sty's or they sent a couple of guns ...they are the main reason for the others success .

I see no hope for Haiti unless you remove most of the Haitians and replace them with people from some

You can keep vomiting your stomach on Haiti, we have no time to waste with you the Dominicans, as we are too busy now rebuilding our country and economy. The little thing that you never noticed, and which will make the whole difference between your sold out society and ours, is that our deverloppment will be done by domestic investment and not all by foreign corporations.
In other words, when our country will finally start looking like yours, everything will still belong to Haitian interests and not for corporations which will show us "No trespassing" signs.
Take a look down below at that link, and follow it to the related article and you'll have a hint of what I mean.

HOTELIERS LEADING INVESTMENT CHARGE IN "HAITI OF TOMORROW".

Led by hoteliers, Haiti's private sector is fueling a wave of investment in a country long saddled with a bad rap for business.

http://www.miamiherald.com/news/americas/haiti/story/1368010.html

"You can keep vomiting your stomach on Haiti, we have no time to waste with you the Dominicans"

What an idiot,he is always in a Dominican site ranting and raving and he is still fantasizing about development without foreign investments ...

Perhaps the mud cookie export market will create such a boom that it will employ all the Haitians

Perhaps all the creyol language schools will be inundated with foreigners coming to learn that sophisticated language.

Perhaps they will open voodoo schools and create a worldwide voodoo franchise ,selling voodoo shirts and paraphernalia.

Perhaps Haiti can have reverse eco tourism ,showing people what the future of the world holds if nothing is done to control greenhouse emissions.

Perhaps Haitians can demonstrate "how not to run a country" or "How to destroy a country in 10 easy steps"

As long as most Haitians are so deluded to think people would invest and leave Haitians in control ,their is no hope for Haiti.

http://www.miamiherald.com/news/americas/haiti/story/1368010.html

Instead of empty rethoric coming from empty brains, why don't you take a look where this hyperlink will lead you. You'll have the opportunity to read the confirmation of what I just told you. We Haitians do not need bravado like you, because we have already been where you're at now, even if it was more than half a century ago. So, we've already known what it means to be developped. That is the reason why we will have an easier time to catch you : we already have the trail, we just have to follow it, and right now that's what our elite from the Diaspora and the motherland is doing. You will swallow your insult pretty soon believe me, I can taste it.

Ocupala07:

What about the "Top 6" in West Palm beach in Florida ?

Pepe32,

Thanks for clearing up OGNY's confusion. And I see that OUPALA07 has yet to respond to Jean H. Charles' letters. As they say, the truth hurts sometimes.

"You can keep vomiting your stomach on Haiti, we have no time to waste with you the Dominicans, "

He is still here somehow "wasting his time" instead of going to pitilandia
Piti Oupala ,the only time Haiti was high was when you former masters had you in chains ,once you took over it has been downhill into the abyss.

You somehow think you can bring millions from a semi-savage state to a normal state?
Do you think you can reforest the Haitian desert in short order?

All we have to do is deport you compatriots and you would be thrown into the stone age...

So be nice Mr Piti because we have you by the tail..

What don't you finally acknwoledge that you the Dominicans have no country. The island belongs to us Haitians because we populated it. Your ancestors have abandoned you for the other colonies of the main continents, You were a tiny group of lost settlers raising their livestock in the huge meadow of the Neiba.
When we were a fully developped colony, you were a simple abandoned outpost. That was why your King had not hesitated to ceding the whole island to the French kingdom. You have no country and you should be grateful we Haitians have left you with one.
We are more numerous than you are in the whole island with regard to population, for you can scratch any black Dominican and you'll find a Haitian under his/her skin.
And if our people living among you were not coward our scared of reprisal, they would have had you shut your stinking mouth a long time ago.
Now I know that won't please the DomininanToday as it doesn't lap your face and lick your behind, but I don't care.

Besides being a dreamer you are a moron..

First of all the island belonged to the Tainos
Secondly Spain conquered the whole island
Thirdly the western third was ceded to France by the treaty of Ryswick
The Spanish Colony existed long before the French ever came over
After the French came they brought your ancestors from their HOMELAND in West Africa
Your ancestors did not own anything ,they were the property of the French
You and Malaria killed your masters beginning the progressive downward spiral
You invaded our lands with your bloodthirsty hordes and won through sheer numerical advantage
We kicked you out of our lands
You attempted over and over to invade us and we destroyed you baboon armies again and again
Your people are currently flooding into my country because your parasitic destructive people have destroyed your own nation.

Haitians are not Tainos ,if you want to claim land go to West Africa and if you are really so tough field an army and meet us in a battlefield so we can put your tails between your legs again.
Haitians are not French so you actually have no claim to the land you are standing on.

Your people in DR are not as stupid as you are ,they know that if the situation got really bad they would be the first to drop while a-holes like you talking crap are safe in some ghetto in the US or Canada.

They know that we have destroyed Haitian armies over and over and today the Dominican populace is armed and all it would take is a spark to send all the Haitians flooding back to your fantasy paradise.
They know that Haiti is a lost cause and they place all their hopes on DR.

So Oupala stop talking crap and grab an M-16 and go to the Artibonito ,attack DR and let your hatred out but I would recommend you write your will and make peace because you will be destroyed ....of course you won't! go..

So, you finally acknowledge that if they'd dare voice an opinion contrary to yours, you'd slaughter them. I think you do not deserve a reply neither to keep having you as an interlocutor. In fact, you are insane, and you better go see a psychiatrist.

No you animal,you wrote that the Haitians in DR should rise against us and take over and it is obvious that would mean killing many Dominicans so if they rise against us and attack us should we be like lambs to the slaughter?

You do your people honour ,you are such an animal that you propose Haitians killing us and taking our land and yet you cry like a woman when I respond that we would fight for our country and that if your countrymen in DR tried to kill us they would feel our rage.

You are an animal and as such are not worthy to talk to people ,you need a national psychiatrist to cure your nation of the malaise it has ,although I believe an exorcist would be best for such a cursed nation.

It's funny how your bravado turns to fear when faced with reality piti.Do not mess with us because we crushed your savage armies in the past and we can do it again!

Only pea soup primitive who loves physical and graphic slaugther scenes would have thought that defending their rights meant armed revolt. We are too smart to give you the easiest opportunity you'd have ever dreamt of to slaughter us, even though it wouldn't have been easy, if they would have really wanted to fight you.
They can defend their right with a lot of other tools nature has put at their disposal. If you were not a bigot and Cro magnon, you would have understood that they could have petitionned their government, we're in a democracy after all, unless civil rights are for a certain type of citizens and not for all of them, as it is right now in your social apartheid.
Because, I am pretty sure if they'd start killing Dominicans in Canada and in the United States, your tiny community would have been quick to take to the streets and to start screaming genocide, and if they'd deny them birth certificate you'd be keen to yel and sob racism. But in your land it is normal, Bigot!

You are more of an idiot than I thought,and that is saying alot..

You wrote about taking are land and I suppose we would just hand it over

"And if our people living among you were not coward our scared of reprisal, they would have had you shut your stinking mouth a long time ago."

Now mister beast (you don't qualify as Cro-Magnon or even Australopithecus you think you can throw the rocks and then proceed to hide your hands...
Your writings are a clear and violent threat yet when I mention a Dominican response you begin to cry like a woman.You write threat after threat aimed at my people but when your compatriots are threatened you pull the race card,the human rights card and the woe is me card...

So please spare me your womanly responses because the only way you dare face us is from behind because otherwise you shake and put your tail between your legs.Someday perhaps with the UN you may join civilization, but meanwhile we will guard against the beast men from the west.

Pepe32,

There is no use. One must first understand logic before engaging in argument. Oupala07 has no sense that logic exist.

True Atabey...I must admit such a mentality frustrates me ,unfortunately many of our compatriots have a similar lack of logic though Oupala's is one of the most serious cases I have run into.

The one thing that is good is his sincerity which gives many doubting Dominicans a window into Haitian thought and what a Haitian majority or even a super minority would imply for our future and that of our children.

Pepe32,

I found an excellent paper on DR economic performance during the last 30 years. Check it out at
http://www.allacademic.com//meta/....0/7/3/8/pages107387/p107387-1.php

It's about 20 pages long but the main augment is interesting, and I think worthwhile.

Thanks Atabey,I will read it .

Are the entrepreneurs who take advantage of market reform drawn from the ranks of the Third World’s traditionally regnant import-competing industrial elites? Or do their roots lie in the long encumbered agricultural, informal, migratory, and middle sectors?

The Political Economy of Trade Reform in the D R

The mainstream political economy of policy reform assumes that trade liberalization and nontraditional export growth are complementary. An initial dose of liberalization calls forth an export supply response. The exporters in question defend and exploit the reform. And a cycle of export growth and further liberalization takes hold. Thus, Anne Krueger suggests that outward oriented reform will draw producers into world markets, fortify the neoliberal coalition, and thereby engender a “virtuous” circle of public sector reform and private sector response.

Question is why has this not happened in DR? He thinks it has to do with traditional regional antagonisms.

WOW! I can't believe the negativity I am reading from you Dominicans. Hell you're all black. I know some Dominicans who are darker than me. If they didn't tell me they were Dominicans I would just think they were African Americans. I can't believe how some of you call the Haitians savages. You're pretty much all the same people. LOL! I can't believe how some people will go to any lengths to elevate themselves. Do you people not know your own history and the history of Haiti. There is a reason why Haiti is so poor and it is not because the people are lazy and don't fight for their rights. We learn more about your history here in the US than you do and you share the same island. Most of the the Dominicans who have posted here are very ignorant. God bless the Haitian people and God open the eyes of the Dominicans.