The exoducs began in Santiago. Photo elnuevodiario.com.do
SAN JUAN, Dominican Republic. - Hundreds of Haitians were repatriated to their country Wednesday after a group of people yielding guns, clubs and knives and other objects in the town Pedro Corto detained them helped by soldiers, and blamed them of bringing cholera to Dominican territory.
The detentions prompted other Haitians to leave urban and rural zones in the western province, fearing reprisal and deportation.
San Juan Livestock Association president Victor Matos Perez warned that if the authorities don’t intervene quickly, Dominicans may cause the violent deaths of hundreds of Haitians, given the aggressive and violent manner the evacuation was conducted in Pedro Corto.
The reprisal against the foreigners comes two days after three people tested positive for cholera in Pedro Corto, whose townspeople blame the Haitians, who allegedly defecate in schoolyards, clinics, gardens and fields and bathe wherever water is found.
Matos demanded that the authorities act soon since the incidents may degenerate in tragedy and thousands of acres of beans and other crops could be lost since 90 percent of the farm workers are undocumented Haitians, many of whom he affirms have been living in the province over five years.
In Santiago
A similar situation has been taking place in the in the country’s industrial region centered in Santiago, here the Haitians have begun to flee poor barrios on fear of repatriation and attacks by local groups who blame them for similar behavior as those of San Juan, but also many of the crimes there.
Written by: Atabey, 30 Dec 2010 2:18 PM
From: United States
As some of us have been warning on this site, the issue of illegals in DR, specifically the massive wave of poverty stricken Haitians, is causing severe problems and the government of LF and his international partners had better get that Haitian revitalization program MOVING!! Haiti needs to generate jobs, and massive quantities, even if they happen to be low wage work. There are plenty of opportunities in basic infrastructure needs to keep vast numbers of workers in place for many years, but for lack of investments and organization.
DR can not answer the question: What is Haiti? Only Haitians can answer that question.
With the fear and anger that is being generated by the spread of Cholera, more instances of Dominicans taking it to Haitians will increase. This is not abnormal and the authorities need to recognize and finally deal with the great fear and terror that lies underneath both sets of concern.
Written by: Atabey, 30 Dec 2010 2:19 PM
From: United States
Haitians did not bring this Cholera into their nation, it's very likely that troops from Asia did, but the conditions under which Haitians live their daily existence has encouraged and driven this malady to epic proportions in Haiti. I read somewhere that over 90% of Haitians have no real means of human waste facilities! Dear God, what exactly was going on there pre-earthquake?? The earthquake just exposed the great discombobulation that was the Haitian State+Nation.
God help us if in this coming year another malady should befall the poor of Haiti. Then what?
And if you think this is not possible, please think again. It can GET WORSE! We have yet to reach the high point or apex of cholera in Haiti. It's still growing and is likely to spread because the conditions that allow it to fester remains: lack of sanitary conditions and potable water access. Until these two are solved, the Cholera will remain. As simple as that. Getting it doesn't immunize you! :(((
Written by: Pepe32, 30 Dec 2010 2:30 PM
From: Dominican Republic
Leonel is going to let this blow up in his face and allow a difficult yet manageable situation to become a downward spiral of violence that once it erupts not even the government will be able to stop!
Some people delude themselves into believing that the friction will magically disappear.This forum between those on both sides who are more willing to discuss problems has only proven to me that the more violent and less literate segments of both populations will not sit down to "discuss" differences instead simmering until an explosion occurs.
Written by: Atabey, 30 Dec 2010 2:42 PM
From: United States
Get real legal documentation and workers' permits going. Yes there will be deportations. But NOT ALL HAITIANS need fear them. Those who are legally in the DR have no reason to fear deportation. Make legality formal. All farmers and companies utilizing Haitian laborers need to establish CLEAR AND TRANSPARENCY in their dealings. Only such a course of action will institutionalize humane treatment of all concerned. Time to wake up and finally address this unmitigated disaster!
Written by: Pepe32, 30 Dec 2010 2:43 PM
From: Dominican Republic
Ignorance,what you don't understand is that if most Dominicans were given a choice between an externally richer country (mostly the elites benefit) full of Haitians and a poorer nation without Haitians most would choose the later.
What use is it for my government to build Metros and overpasses and to modernise when your countrymen will eventually outnumber us on our own side !! I would rather go back in time than allow Haitians to become even close to a majority for reasons that have been explained ad nauseum in this forum.
What Atabey states is correct as far as a cause but the flip side of the coin is that Dominican Republic cannot and should not be the one carrying this burden .
From: United States, New York City
"Ignorance,what you don't understand is that if most Dominicans were given a choice between an externally richer country (mostly the elites benefit) full of Haitians and a poorer nation without Haitians most would choose the later."
With all honesty that would be the consensus of most Dominicans save those with vested monetary interests...but unfortunately for the Republic's future the latter group is running the show.
Written by: ny4life, 30 Dec 2010 2:50 PM
From: United States, New York, NY
Pepe 32,
I totally agree with your statements.
Written by: ElFactor, 30 Dec 2010 2:52 PM
From: United States
LOL, The world is watching "GOOD." Just because the Haitian state is a failed entity, it don't mean D.R. has to carry the weight, misery and ineptitude of the aforementioned nation.
Written by: ny4life, 30 Dec 2010 2:55 PM
From: United States, New York, NY
Cibaeno75,
We can't allow them to soley run the show. Dominican society will manifest itself against them like they should. The future of our nation should not only encompass the monetary interests of a few but also focus on improving the conditions of the majority of Dominicans while protecting the soverignty of our nation which is seriously threaten by the lack of development pre-earthquake and aggravated post-earthquake haiti.
Written by: xfactor, 30 Dec 2010 2:57 PM
From: United States
Llego PEPE!! Very true statements Pepe. Keep them coming. :)
From: United States, New York City
" Dominican society will manifest itself against them like they should."
It looks like it might just be happening now. Let's see how and if the governement can defuse the situation. But in order to protect lives the Dominican government has to have a concise immigration policy regarding Haitian immigration...the person on the street is obviously fed up with the waves of undocumented foreigners without end and the situation is reaching a critical mass.
Written by: ny4life, 30 Dec 2010 3:11 PM
From: United States, New York, NY
Cibaeno75,
It's time to get our immigration policy in order without bowing to the monetary interests as the norm.
From: Dominican Republic, NEVER FORGOTTEN, NEVER FORSAKEN!
I hope have of D.R. get cholera.
We shouldn't go after the Haitians, we should go after L.F. and the rich that take advantage of this people, and kill a few of them.
Written by: Pepe32, 30 Dec 2010 3:48 PM
From: Dominican Republic
We should send the Haitians to the national palace and let them build a shantytown around Leonel!
Written by: curlando, 30 Dec 2010 3:49 PM
From: United States, Bronx
Grab your touches and pitch forks. There is an old fashion beat down a coming.
Written by: kennyB, 30 Dec 2010 5:52 PM
From: United States
Many Dominicans along with non-Dominicans have been predicting this unfortunate tragic outcome. I hope all the stupid Haitian apologist finally get the message.
From: United States
Haiti is not a country, nor failed state, it just "IDEA" so NGO's make money off it.
Written by: telemeco, 30 Dec 2010 7:06 PM
From: Dominican Republic, Monte Plata
Star gathering you thing folk, you all going out for a ride.....please dont write, we wont miss you
From: United States
despiertadominicana
From: United States
Despiertadominican!!!!!!!
From: United States
howdoes it feell..where we're to respond or to answer....what happing in D.R..with are fellows common man...despiertadomininca...
From: Botswana, La reconnaissance est une lachete'
@ Pepe 32
I Have to agree with your post glad to see you fully understand your country's path to development (whose interest it is geared toward). Maybe your government unwillingness to spend at lease 4% of GDP on education was your Eureka moment.
Atabey- While the majority of Haitians may not have a proper toilet in their house I'm sure its the same in DR the latrine has been quiet effective for centuries, still in use in places like west Va in America, some villages in Italy, and some part of eastern europe, better than what the majority of Indians are used to, that scene in Slum dog millionaire was not dramatization.
Written by: Atabey, 31 Dec 2010 12:04 AM
From: United States
Pat,
Haiti had NOT EVEN ONE Municipal sewage system before the quake!!
"The human waste problem was daunting even before the earthquake. Lacking a municipal sewage system, many families here employ a socially scorned class of nocturnal latrine cleaners known in Creole as the “bayakou.” They descend into latrines to clean excrement with their hands, before transporting it in carts to improvised disposal sites."
"Haiti, a nation of 10 million, does not have a single sewage treatment plant. Trucks often simply take the waste to the Troutier trash dump near the slums of Cité Soleil on this city’s edge.
The trucks empty into pits filled with medical waste like intravenous bags and garbage. Smoke billows from burning piles of trash. .., Sanco, with its motto “Fighting for a Clean Environment” emblazoned on its side, did not bother to go to a pit, dumping its cargo of human waste on the open ground."
NYT, Feb.19, 2010
http://www.nytimes.com/2010/02/20/world/americas/20haiti.Written by: Atabey, 31 Dec 2010 12:06 AM
From: United States
"Robert Redfield, a co-founder of the Institute of Human Virology at the University of Maryland, cited the example of a 1994 outbreak of cholera in refugee camps in Congo among the hundreds of thousands who fled Rwanda at the time.
“The real culprit right now is the flies, which become vectors by taking fecal waste from one place to another,” said Dr. Redfield, who got sick himself with salmonella typhi while working in Haiti this month. “This means you can control what you eat and still get something,” he said. “The arrival of the rains could make malaria and dengue more problematic as well.”
Some families seeking shelter have nowhere else to turn. “This is my life now, my family’s life,” said Sindia Michel, 33, who moved to the Troutier trash dump after her shack collapsed in the earthquake. She scavenged for firewood with one of her five children near the pits of excrement."
Parts of DR have serious problems, but in general, the DR and Haiti are different, Pat.
Written by: ElFactor, 31 Dec 2010 1:10 AM
From: United States
Written by: ny4life, 31 Dec 2010 1:17 AM
From: United States, New York, NY
Pelegrin Castillo - 2012
He will act and defend the Dominican Republic.
In the meantime force Leonel, PLD, and Business elite to act for the greater good of the Dominican population. Let's keep our integrity and do what's right for the Dominican Republic and not for isolated interests.
From: United States, new jersey
This situation as always been here . I don't know why people are so surprised it has gotten worsed, well the illegal migration of Haitians has always been there , is just the only difference now is there carrying a disease call cholera , and has always are imigration police are of non existence. I think the time of ignoring the problem has finnally pass , is time to put up or shut up Leo. The only last option for Haiti is become united states commonwealth or let the earth swallow you.
Written by: Pepe32, 31 Dec 2010 11:39 AM
From: Dominican Republic
"Remember the world is watching. Those billions invested are expected to show a certain ROI."
Sure dude ,the world cares so much about Haitians they will risk those billions in investments because of them....you need to take a reality pill and stumble out of your Haitian delusion...the world does not really care and if you all don't get your act together it will be one disaster after another while the people move on and the Hollywood stars remove their Haiti lapels and move to the next "feel good" cause.
The sad thing is that instead of doing for yourselves you are waiting for others to bail you out and then have the nerve to speak of PRIDE!!
From: Dominican Republic, Puerto Plata
Of all the laws this government has applied, the most outstanding is the law of inertia.
One can hardly believe it's just plain stupid inertia. It has to do more with a way of covering up situations of the "I´ll let your engineering firms come in if you let some of my people enter" type.
Big interests are at stake all over in this mess. The immobilism is not an accident.
Written by: Atabey, 1 Jan 2011 12:01 PM
From: United States
An early indication of potential success of the Haitian Project for 2011 will be the coming elections this month. Hopefully this second round of elections will bring forth a stable political foundation for the investments to come. If, however, the political situation remains muddy and continues like in the past, much more suffering and destitution awaits Haiti in this year. I hope not. The DR stands to benefit as the number two recipient of a better Haiti, after the Haitians themselves! A stable and prosperous Haiti IS GOOD FOR ALL. But as I've stated before, Haitians need to get on with the modernization process. They need to answer basic, fundamental questions regarding their State and Nation. What is Haiti? Who governs Haiti and for who's interests? How will the caste like existence of the social-economic classes be changed? All these and other questions will need elite consensus and broad societal agreement, if Haiti is to move forward. Will 2011 be the year?
From: United States
The problems are not Haitians and Cholera and Immigration issues. The problems are Hate, Discrimination, Lack of Sympathy for Fellow Man, and a Politically engendered Racial Identity crisis. All this vigilante justice will only cause more problems. The 'elite' in Dominican society allow and facilitate the entering of Haitians into the country to get cheap labor and then turn a blind eye when communities start to take matters into their own hands. I feel especially sorry to Dominican-Haitians who are virtually 'stuck' and have no home in Haiti nor one in the Dominican Republic because they cannot get proof of their identity and documentation. If as much effort was put into working together for mutual gain as the current 'fuera con lo' haitiano'' movement, things would be so much better. But the mind of so many is poisoned, and it actually seems better to live in dire straits as separates, than it does to live together in prosperity as Brothers and Sisters of the same Mother.
From: United States
Bernard Jean Pierre-
What specific efforts do you suppose we should put forth and
what exactly is the alternative that you suggest? And why do you say "the mind is poisoned."?
And finally, can you give me just some examples of "hate, Discrimination, Lack of Sympathy" ?
Don't you think that maybe you might be confusing one thing for another?
From: United States
What specific efforts do I suppose should be put forth?? As I stated before (in another post) its a very complicated, multi-layered issue. There is no quick fix. But the 'effort' made toward violence and discrimination do not help. That is certain. The Dominican Government has unintentionally encouraged the problem through its wastes on CESFRONT. Haitians are being smuggled INTO the Country by other Haitians AND Dominicans. Haitians are found all over the Dominican Republic, and it not simply because they 'walked' to get there. Alternative?? There is no one alternative, but communities rising up and forcefully trying to relocate Haitians is NOT going to work. People themselves say that they must do it because the Government will not do anything......there it is right there. The Government take advantage of the situation but then does NOT take accountability for it.
From: United States
I say the mind is poisoned because, it is a twisted mindset that is deeply entrenched and saturated with the earmarks of old opportunistic political agendas. Haitians are viewed by many (many meaning 'many people in the World') as backwards, barbaric, savage, inferior etc. This type of mentality is prevalent in the Dominican Republic as well. This is not to imply that each and every Dominican feels similarly as many do not. However the identity of many Dominicans is based on the principle of NOT being Haitian because being Haitian is viewed as something negative. The fact that expressions such as 'pelo malo', 'mejor la raza' exist, indicate that sentiment. Logically, there is no difference in capacity of intelligence or worth as a human being. That is why I say it is in the mind. Its a mentality. On this very website in the forums, you will see Haitians described as 'savages', so i need not go far to show you examples of hate or discrimination.
From: United States
BernardJeanPierre- I am an animal lover just as much as I love my fellow man. What ever I can do to help either one of them, I will not hesitate to do my fair share. However don't expect me to let every person in need move into and camp out in front of my house or take in all abandon animals, stray dog/cat from the streets and then accuse me of "hate, insensitivity "Discrimination and Lack of Sympathy" if I do otherwise. That is called manipulation and playing with peoples emotions.
Do you really think Dominicans don't want to truely help the Haitian people. It is to our benefit and best interests to see a prosperous Haiti. But what you and people like yourself want are unreasonable demands to forceably impose yourself upon us. We have done our part and will continue to help Haiti as much as we possibly can, but do not expect anymore then what we have already done and can deliver. You need to understand there is only one Jesus Christ and few Mother Teresa, but enough is enough.
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DR can not answer the question: What is Haiti? Only Haitians can answer that question.
With the fear and anger that is being generated by the spread of Cholera, more instances of Dominicans taking it to Haitians will increase. This is not abnormal and the authorities need to recognize and finally deal with the great fear and terror that lies underneath both sets of concern.
God help us if in this coming year another malady should befall the poor of Haiti. Then what?
And if you think this is not possible, please think again. It can GET WORSE! We have yet to reach the high point or apex of cholera in Haiti. It's still growing and is likely to spread because the conditions that allow it to fester remains: lack of sanitary conditions and potable water access. Until these two are solved, the Cholera will remain. As simple as that. Getting it doesn't immunize you! :(((
Some people delude themselves into believing that the friction will magically disappear.This forum between those on both sides who are more willing to discuss problems has only proven to me that the more violent and less literate segments of both populations will not sit down to "discuss" differences instead simmering until an explosion occurs.
What use is it for my government to build Metros and overpasses and to modernise when your countrymen will eventually outnumber us on our own side !! I would rather go back in time than allow Haitians to become even close to a majority for reasons that have been explained ad nauseum in this forum.
What Atabey states is correct as far as a cause but the flip side of the coin is that Dominican Republic cannot and should not be the one carrying this burden .
With all honesty that would be the consensus of most Dominicans save those with vested monetary interests...but unfortunately for the Republic's future the latter group is running the show.
I totally agree with your statements.
We can't allow them to soley run the show. Dominican society will manifest itself against them like they should. The future of our nation should not only encompass the monetary interests of a few but also focus on improving the conditions of the majority of Dominicans while protecting the soverignty of our nation which is seriously threaten by the lack of development pre-earthquake and aggravated post-earthquake haiti.
It looks like it might just be happening now. Let's see how and if the governement can defuse the situation. But in order to protect lives the Dominican government has to have a concise immigration policy regarding Haitian immigration...the person on the street is obviously fed up with the waves of undocumented foreigners without end and the situation is reaching a critical mass.
It's time to get our immigration policy in order without bowing to the monetary interests as the norm.
We shouldn't go after the Haitians, we should go after L.F. and the rich that take advantage of this people, and kill a few of them.
Many Dominicans along with non-Dominicans have been predicting this unfortunate tragic outcome. I hope all the stupid Haitian apologist finally get the message.
I Have to agree with your post glad to see you fully understand your country's path to development (whose interest it is geared toward). Maybe your government unwillingness to spend at lease 4% of GDP on education was your Eureka moment.
Atabey- While the majority of Haitians may not have a proper toilet in their house I'm sure its the same in DR the latrine has been quiet effective for centuries, still in use in places like west Va in America, some villages in Italy, and some part of eastern europe, better than what the majority of Indians are used to, that scene in Slum dog millionaire was not dramatization.
Haiti had NOT EVEN ONE Municipal sewage system before the quake!!
"The human waste problem was daunting even before the earthquake. Lacking a municipal sewage system, many families here employ a socially scorned class of nocturnal latrine cleaners known in Creole as the “bayakou.” They descend into latrines to clean excrement with their hands, before transporting it in carts to improvised disposal sites."
"Haiti, a nation of 10 million, does not have a single sewage treatment plant. Trucks often simply take the waste to the Troutier trash dump near the slums of Cité Soleil on this city’s edge.
The trucks empty into pits filled with medical waste like intravenous bags and garbage. Smoke billows from burning piles of trash. .., Sanco, with its motto “Fighting for a Clean Environment” emblazoned on its side, did not bother to go to a pit, dumping its cargo of human waste on the open ground."
NYT, Feb.19, 2010
http://www.nytimes.com/2010/02/20/world/americas/20haiti.
“The real culprit right now is the flies, which become vectors by taking fecal waste from one place to another,” said Dr. Redfield, who got sick himself with salmonella typhi while working in Haiti this month. “This means you can control what you eat and still get something,” he said. “The arrival of the rains could make malaria and dengue more problematic as well.”
Some families seeking shelter have nowhere else to turn. “This is my life now, my family’s life,” said Sindia Michel, 33, who moved to the Troutier trash dump after her shack collapsed in the earthquake. She scavenged for firewood with one of her five children near the pits of excrement."
Parts of DR have serious problems, but in general, the DR and Haiti are different, Pat.
He will act and defend the Dominican Republic.
In the meantime force Leonel, PLD, and Business elite to act for the greater good of the Dominican population. Let's keep our integrity and do what's right for the Dominican Republic and not for isolated interests.
Sure dude ,the world cares so much about Haitians they will risk those billions in investments because of them....you need to take a reality pill and stumble out of your Haitian delusion...the world does not really care and if you all don't get your act together it will be one disaster after another while the people move on and the Hollywood stars remove their Haiti lapels and move to the next "feel good" cause.
The sad thing is that instead of doing for yourselves you are waiting for others to bail you out and then have the nerve to speak of PRIDE!!
One can hardly believe it's just plain stupid inertia. It has to do more with a way of covering up situations of the "I´ll let your engineering firms come in if you let some of my people enter" type.
Big interests are at stake all over in this mess. The immobilism is not an accident.
What specific efforts do you suppose we should put forth and
what exactly is the alternative that you suggest? And why do you say "the mind is poisoned."?
And finally, can you give me just some examples of "hate, Discrimination, Lack of Sympathy" ?
Don't you think that maybe you might be confusing one thing for another?
Do you really think Dominicans don't want to truely help the Haitian people. It is to our benefit and best interests to see a prosperous Haiti. But what you and people like yourself want are unreasonable demands to forceably impose yourself upon us. We have done our part and will continue to help Haiti as much as we possibly can, but do not expect anymore then what we have already done and can deliver. You need to understand there is only one Jesus Christ and few Mother Teresa, but enough is enough.