Written by: Atabey, 25 Jun 2012 8:14 AM
From: United States, NYC
Even the religious guys are seeing the problem now. When will the political leadership take on this massive problem?
DR can and should continue to help Haiti BUT NOT at the expense of creating the same conditions that are driving massive numbers away from Haiti to gain a foothold in DR! Where and how will DR house feed and provide education and health to so many illegals? DR can't even manage that for its own people!
The international Community has to be made to understand that this massive unchecked flow of poverty dumping from Haiti into DR will only create conditions for BOTH sides of the island to align in both poverty and massive negative dislocations. The quality of life in DR does not improve by having massive numbers of poorer humanity swarming the already meager offerings that DR provides for its own poorest.
Adding huge numbers of desperately poorer humanity into the domestic mix isn't wise nor prudent policy for DR.
Why is that so hard for DR to explain?
From: United States, FREEPORT, Long Island.... ((You're blind to the fact that you're blind))
This is dangerous....I see an ethnic cleansing in the making if nothing gets done.
Written by: NYGuy35, 25 Jun 2012 8:31 AM
From: United States
The Dominican Republic should take the policy of the US. Start printing forms in Creole. Allow the illegal Haitians to have government assistance. Allow illegal Haitians to enroll in school. Give the illegal Haitians a path to citizenship.
Dominicans should have SSL (Spanish as Second Language) classes for the Hatians in school.
Whats that? Dominicans should not have to learn Creole? You mean you don't want your tax dollars subsidizing illegal children in school? In hospital payments?
I guess it's ok when illegal Dominicans do the same in the US.
Written by: Atabey, 25 Jun 2012 8:46 AM
From: United States, NYC
I don't think it will get to that violent point, but we could have isolated cases stemming from rapes, disorder, stealing, etc. And these could trigger boarder acts of rejection from folks in DR. No one wants nor likes to see their public spaces overtaken with poverty and disorder. Desperate people do desperate things to survive. The international community does a disservice to DR if it continues to insist on her taking on such a massive posture given both her limited resources and domestic situation,
Let's not create a second Haiti on the eastern side of the island. One is more than enough. Haitians need VISAS to first world lands as these visas hold the greatest and fastest turnaround for a people to gain a firm and prosperous future for themselves and their future generations. Also, these foreign lands provide the means to extend opportunities from financial help and investments from aboard via transfers.
International Community: step up to the plate!
Written by: zooma, 25 Jun 2012 8:57 AM
From: United States
Yes, there is a problem of unregulated crossings and it should be placed upon the shoulders of the government to stem the flow.
The flip side of this crisis there are many undocumented people of Haitian heritage, born and raised in the DR, who have contributed to its society are now in crisis fearing to be "repatriated" to a country they do not know. The gov't does not give a heck about them, they are just a number to be reported. The moral solution is for these people is to remain to continue to contribute.
Now, there are going to be some posters who out of their own xenophobic beliefs will blame the Haitians for all bad doings under the tropical sun and as such, they, meaning the Haitians, should return back to the foul earth of Haiti. I lament for people who suffer these beliefs. I have seen those who suffer misfortune. I too may have suffered a similar fate, but for God's roll of the dice it is otherwise.......
Written by: Atabey, 25 Jun 2012 8:57 AM
From: United States, NYC
Some people are very confused. Some people THINK that DR is as rich and powerful as the USA! LOL
Leaves those dreams to puffin' sections with your creative blunt concoctions. LOL
DR did not create the conditions in Haiti. Thus, DR has NO responsibility, other than as another member of the international community interested in helping Haiti. The burden of Haiti needs to be shared BY THE INTERNATIONAL COMMUNITY.
Unless you want an island wide "Haitianization" with all the negative attributes that implies, we should be talking about how best the INTERNATIONAL COMMUNITY OF NATIONS can help turn the table on this long festering problem. The Haitian Question needs an international solution.
Written by: generoso, 25 Jun 2012 9:39 AM
From: Dominican Republic, United States
Repeat after me:
The Dominican Republic is NOT the solution to Haiti's problems.
The Dominican Republic is NOT the solution to Haiti's problems.
The Dominican Republic is NOT the solution to Haiti's problems.
The Dominican Republic is NOT the solution to Haiti's problems.
The Dominican Republic is NOT the solution to Haiti's problems.
The Dominican Republic is NOT the solution to Haiti's problems.
The Dominican Republic is NOT the solution to Haiti's problems.
The Dominican Republic is NOT the solution to Haiti's problems.
The Dominican Republic is NOT the solution to Haiti's problems.
The Dominican Republic is NOT the solution to Haiti's problems.
The Dominican Republic is NOT the solution to Haiti's problems.
The Dominican Republic is NOT the solution to Haiti's problems.
The Dominican Republic is NOT the solution to Haiti's problems.
Written by: Atabey, 25 Jun 2012 9:42 AM
From: United States, NYC
21 June 2012 Last updated at 05:19 ET
EU should 'undermine national homogeneity' says UN migration chief
By Brian Wheeler
Political reporter, BBC News
Peter Sutherland's global migration forum brings together 160 nations to discuss policy."
How about providing some help to our Haitian brothers and sisters in need Europe?
Haitians will surely help de-homogenize the societies in Europe.
From: Iceland, Haitians out of DR.
DR's gov't is a puppet managed by all the crooks in the UN!, we need to unite and force our national government to start doing something about this big big issue!
pronto!
From: United States
Haiti, dominican republic: one single country.
Written by: Yucahu, 25 Jun 2012 11:28 AM
From: United States, Miami
Ricardo Taveras is our only hope, he's the hardliner we need.
Written by: benjamin, 25 Jun 2012 11:30 AM
From: Dominican Republic
its funny how, the dominican go to the usa and do the same shit. its just people looking for a better life. i agree they should be some form of control bc to much of anything is never a good thing, but remember as children of god we have to help the one that cant help themself.
Written by: Pepe32, 25 Jun 2012 12:07 PM
From: Dominican Republic
Benjamin,first of all God is capitalized when a believer writes not capitalized when bleeding hearts confuse God with social services..
Second of all ,how many Haitians will you take in your home?
Thirdly most Dominicans are in the US LEGALLY and those that aren't are subject to deportation as it is the US's SOVEREIGN right to maintain its territorial integrity and to determine who enters or doesn't enter .Haitians should be assisted in Haiti but they have absolutely no RIGHT to enter as they wish and the DR being a poor nation has every right to deport them .That is called JUSTICE and rule of law not the chaos that will ensue if the Haitians continue unimpeded in their stampede across the border.
DR has very little time to act ,because the situation is getting to a point that their will be a social explosion and of course DR will be blamed by the hypocrites who appeased the invaders.
Written by: benjamin, 25 Jun 2012 12:14 PM
From: Dominican Republic
@pepe dominicans enter in haiti as tell please and they dont need any visa. second do you know how many dominican republica work in haiti. please follow your own rule. when you start buying visa to go to haiti then haiti will
Written by: Adamo123, 25 Jun 2012 12:14 PM
From: United States
I betcha if DR is providing free Spanish classes to the Haitians migrants there that they will rush to take the SSL courses as indicated, though I wish that their counterpart immigrants in the US or elsewhere from the island of Hispaniola could follow suit by start taking free ESL classes too or learning the native language of their new adopted country. Sometimes, it seems that some or most of them are waiting on the US or the other countries to change their national language to Spanish. Aren't the Dominicans fleeing in mass to other parts of the world in search of better opportunity? If true, what would be our advice to the immigration office of these countries hosting the flow of our illegal/legal Dominicans. Don't be self centered while the immigration issues that DR face are somewhat similar to what other nations are dealing with the Dominican migrants. DR has the a legal rights to protect its turf and borders so do the other host nations. Should it be a one way street.
Written by: Adamo123, 25 Jun 2012 12:30 PM
From: United States
Do you have the stats to backup this claim "Thirdly most Dominicans are in the US LEGALLY". jajaja In Puerto Rico alone there is over 200000 illegal Dominicans not to count the Triboro . (QBM +B). You must be kidding. Have you been in the Bronx and Manhattan? I know you've been. Do not hide your first impression, it is always the right one.
Written by: airgordo, 25 Jun 2012 1:11 PM
From: Dominican Republic
Written by: NYGuy35, 25 Jun 2012 8:31 AM
From: United States
The Dominican Republic should take the policy of the US. Start printing forms in Creole. Allow the illegal Haitians to have government assistance. Allow illegal Haitians to enroll in school. Give the illegal Haitians a path to citizenship.
Dominicans should have SSL (Spanish as Second Language) classes for the Hatians in school.
Whats that? Dominicans should not have to learn Creole? You mean you don't want your tax dollars subsidizing illegal children in school? In hospital payments?
I guess it's ok when illegal Dominicans do the same in the US.
====
and EXACTLY how many ILLEGAL Dominicas do you think are on US??? please explain here exactly HOW an illegal Domincan reach the US because they don't go there SWIMMING do they? and even MORE, HOW is it a PATH to citiznship offered on US?? i will wait on your response before categorizing you as an Ignorant on what you post...
From: Dominican Republic, NEVER FORGOTTEN, NEVER FORSAKEN!
and EXACTLY how many ILLEGAL Dominicas do you think are on US??? please explain here exactly HOW an illegal Domincan reach the US because they don't go there SWIMMING do they? and even MORE, HOW is it a PATH to citiznship offered on US?? i will wait on your response before categorizing you as an Ignorant on what you post...
Good question Airgordo. I know people in the USA living without the proper documaents for more than 15 years, and they're still looking for " the path to citizenship".
From: United Kingdom
In my last commnt over this concern I said: If our governments don't try and put a stop to this matter then, it would be too late. I sew it mysellf several times when I visited Haiti 23 years ago by land. I had some arguments with some border officials and soldiers at Jimani border ( Mal Passe) over letting entire families enter the DR just for a few dollars and even dirty Haitians Goudes and,. please do not forget, this was 23 years ago. just imagine before and after all those years how many thousands or even millions of haitians have enter Dominicana since? Just think how dificult is for ordinary Dominicans to get visas to travel abroad so the country is already Packed with Haitians whom are putiing pressure on all social activities like Housing , Hospitals and businesses though in this point, business and work, I understand that my Dominican Paisanos don't like'' Bajar el lomo'' and Haitians are very good at both, business and work. sorry to say so but it is the reality. Ok, S
Written by: airgordo, 25 Jun 2012 1:24 PM
From: Dominican Republic
Written by: Adamo123, 25 Jun 2012 12:30 PM
From: United States
Do you have the stats to backup this claim "Thirdly most Dominicans are in the US LEGALLY". jajaja In Puerto Rico alone there is over 200000 illegal Dominicans not to count the Triboro . (QBM +B). You must be kidding. Have you been in the Bronx and Manhattan? I know you've been. Do not hide your first impression, it is always the right one.
===
Don't they get DEPORTED?? Answer Please...do you see any dominican on this site or on the press complaining about deportation of ILLEGALS??? Answer Please...IT is a FACT that the VAST majority of Dominicans are In fact on LEGAL status, WHY?
Because This is a FREAKING ISLAND!! NOT MEXICO! we HAVE to have documentation to get OUT, EVEN if you make to Puerto Rico by Boat, Puerto Rico is ALSO A FREAKING ISLAND!! and they check ALL from you when you try to get to US mainland!! so please don't write stupidities where people that actually know how this goes can read it...
From: Dominican Republic, NEVER FORGOTTEN, NEVER FORSAKEN!
Don't forget P.R. is not mainland USA, P.R. is just BRIDGE.
Written by: Adamo123, 25 Jun 2012 2:43 PM
From: United States
P.R is a bridge to the US for the dominican... like the haitians take the boat to Miami, the Dominicans take the boat to P.R then bridge it to the mainland. Somebody here, is not well informed, to sum it up, not all illegals face deportation. Out of the million of illegals in the US just a tiny fraction has to deal with a deportation hearing or get deported. Don't think that those who got deported are the only ones living illegally there. When you enter a country with a valid visa and let it expire while still living there before acquiring residency or the privileges not the rights to live there permanently you become an illegal, period. The same International treaties or conventions that protect the illegal dominicans living abroad, shall protect all other nations that sign or join those treaties too. DR is benefiting of those treaties elsewhere so you should give back in return. You signed a treaty you should respect it, though you are within your rights to control your borders.
Written by: Atabey, 25 Jun 2012 2:56 PM
From: United States, NYC
Written by: Adamo123,
From: United States
Do you have the stats to backup this claim "Thirdly most Dominicans are in the US LEGALLY". jajaja In Puerto Rico alone there is over 200000 illegal Dominicans not to count the Triboro ."
Perhaps you haven't paid too much attention but Puerto Ricans and Dominicans share a common language, culture and I've yet to witness in PR massive numbers of Dominican children being used as street beggars. In fact, I'v never actually witnessed any Dominican child doing so, and I've been travaling to PR for more than 30 years.
Perhaps we should send the word-has it already been addressed by the recent boat full of Haitians across the Mona Passage?-that unlike Bad DR, PR is open to Haitians seeking opportunities.
How'd like that idea?
Written by: Vivacuba, 25 Jun 2012 2:59 PM
From: Dominican Republic
so is the U S department of homeland security and nobody is complaining
Written by: Adamo123, 25 Jun 2012 3:01 PM
From: United States
No one has asked DR to sign those treaties in the past. Usually, small nations looking for acceptance and recognition from their peers sign stupid treaties not weighing the ramifications. Believe me DR never saw this coming for they never expected this influx of illegal visitors of their neighbor. Years ago, those two countries were competing head to head to lead in the Caribbean and at the end the other rival collapses and can't keep up with the evolution pace of the other. Though, that does not mean that DR should pursue policies that undermine the international treaties that they agreed to. You make your bed you lie on it. All you can do now is to come up with a better formula to protect and control your borders as long as you abide by those international conventions.
Written by: Atabey, 25 Jun 2012 3:03 PM
From: United States, NYC
Written by: benjamin, 25 Jun 2012 12:14 PM
From: Dominican Republic
@pepe dominicans enter in haiti as tell please and they dont need any visa. second do you know how many dominican republica work in haiti. please follow your own rule. when you start buying visa to go to haiti then haiti will"
You are confusing yourself. It does not matter that Dominicans work in Haiti or go to Haiti.
What matters is WHAT DOMINICANS DO IN HAITI.
Are Dominicans sending to Haiti poverty stricken people that put enormous pressure on the Haitian government to provide Health, housing, educational and other services?
Are Dominicans that go to Haiti causing Haiti's population of poor people to explode?
Are Dominicans going to Haiti trying to deny they are Dominicans in order to try and pass as Haitians and engage in Identification theft?
Are Dominicans sending loads of pregnant women into Haiti to be born in Haiti?
????
Written by: Pedrin, 25 Jun 2012 3:06 PM
From: United States
Even though we share a common language, I bet the vast majority of Puerto Ricans don't like the idea of 250k Dominicans on their island, legal or not.
Written by: Atabey, 25 Jun 2012 3:15 PM
From: United States, NYC
It's more than a common language Pedrin. Balaguer was born in PR and Bosch too has Puerto rican connections. Ever heard of Betances, El Antillano? One of the most illustrious Puertoricans of the 19th century? Trained in France and a Great Caribbean Statesman of his era. His dad or grandfather hailed from DR.
Written by: , 25 Jun 2012 3:06 PM
From: United States
Even though we share a common language, I bet the vast majority of Puerto Ricans don't like the idea of 250k Dominicans on their island, legal or not."
And what would they say to having say another 250,000 Haitians?
Why is it NOT resonable for Europeans and other wealthy areas to help out by providing VISAS for Haitians to uplift themselves?
If the United Nations thinks Europeans have to become LESS HOMOGENIOUS, then why not add some Haitian into the pot?
Haiti was and is their creation after all.
Written by: Adamo123, 25 Jun 2012 3:17 PM
From: United States
Dear Atabey,
We need a balance in the world, every one can't be a doctor, a nurse, or a lawyer. It is a vocational choice, understand. So people choose from a multitude of options available to them and I am not condoning those choices. Guess what....the haitians choose to beg but the dominican women turn into prostitution in DR and elsewhere instead of begging. Depending of one moral's ethics you will determine which one is the best option. To me both are degrading. By the way, back in 2008/07 you were awarded number 4 in te world sex market, it is a plus. It seems that you are not keeping up with the Dominican Today, just last month a Dominican boat capsized or were apprehended along the shores of Puerto Rico too. Is 'Sailing' becoming the hobby or the favorite sport of the Dominicans now. e e e e. One is a known beggar the other is known for providing high class 'Puta' prostitution. How about that?
Written by: Atabey, 25 Jun 2012 3:28 PM
From: United States, NYC
Adamo123
The sex trade has a long tradition and Puerto Rican women have also provided rich terrain for horny men to engage their desires. Since you live in the USA and live in NYC remember Down These Mean Streets by Piri Thomas. That classic of inner city life should ring a bell or two in yea.
What we Dominicans seek is a JUST BALANCING of responsibity from the International Community. That's all. Haiti's problems and troubles WERE NOT CREATED IN DR. The shi*hole it has unfortunatedly become was due to foreign, ie., European and American refusal to trade and do business with her, French reparations that consumed a vast amount of her annual earnings and her own ineptitude in providing for a viable NATION-STATE.
If Haitians are people just like any other in the world, why should the RICH world NOT take in more of her looooooooooong suffering people? I mean, even the UN agrees that Europe has to become less homogeneous. LOL
Written by: Adamo123, 25 Jun 2012 3:28 PM
From: United States
Dear Atabey :
Most or the majority of Dominicans living in Hait are working for the entertainment insdustry there. They are not smart like you in order to help out in "Health, housing, educational and other services" . Name a few that you know are working in any of those fields in Haiti. But I can pinpoint you where you can find at least 200 of dominicans at least. Believe me when they return back home they do get a homecoming due or similar to a war heroe or serviceman
Written by: Atabey, 25 Jun 2012 3:35 PM
From: United States, NYC
Let's trade. We take back ALL the Dominican prostitutes in Haiti and Haiti can take back all the destitutes and poverty stricken people its dumping on DR.
------------
Both nations BENEFIT from having an exchange of goods and services-labor being one important aspect of the exchange. BUT what we find enormously troublesome is this continuing flow that has the feel of a mass povetty dump into our land. Can you imagine what Puerto Ricans, I not sure if you are, would say if Dominicans were swarming into small towns and setting up camp along riverbanks and sending forth their children to beg, steal or whatever to make a buck? And then have organizations and people defend their right to live in PR? Puerto Ricans would be up in arms and the political leadership would have to answer for the mess.
From: United States, Bay Area, CA - (Dei sitio)
Adamo,
Just point at a single country in the Western Hemisphere that does not have prostitution?...Show me a single nationality?
What is the percentage of Haitians that engage into prostitution in the DR?...Prostitution is as old as the bible. Look in the web how many of the prostitutes that you see are Dominican?...What nationalities are they?
Show me sources to support your claim that DR has higher percentage of prostitutes per capita?
Opiniones sin fundamento.
Written by: Pepe32, 25 Jun 2012 3:48 PM
From: Dominican Republic
Somehow according to Adamo and others we just have to accept the massive "pacific" invasion of our territory and not do anything about it just because the Haitians say so..
I have been saying for the longest that we will never come to an agreement with Haitians and that we should do what is in OUR best interests and F the Haitians because if we allow them they will destroy our country just like the latrine they have created in the west. Atabay you are too nice in putting all the blame on others for Haiti's problems because the main problem in Haiti and on this island is the Haitians themselves yet they prefer to spit on us like adamo and then expect that we will receive them with open arms.
!!Que se vayan al mismo infierno o que se queden en Haiti que es peor!!!
Written by: Adamo123, 25 Jun 2012 4:02 PM
From: United States
Dear Perludom,
Check this out ,
Read the Dominican Today and you will find it :
Article date : April 24, 2008 .....
Title : Dominican women rank 4th in world sex market
dominicantoday.com/dr/local/2008/4/24/27752/Dominican-women-rank-4th-in-world-sex-market
I removed the 3w's and the http to allow sending
Written by: Adamo123, 25 Jun 2012 4:11 PM
From: United States
Dear Pepe32,
You can't help Adamo, and your arms aren't big enough to help others. When you say we, do you count yourself in. Don't you need help yourself.
Talking of "latrine", by reading your post I can smell one.
Written by: Pedrin, 25 Jun 2012 4:36 PM
From: United States
Atabey- Yes, I've heard of Betances, And I was aware of Bosch's and Balaguer's background. But do you seriously believe that Puerto Ricans care about that. Unfortunately, what they see is their small island been "overrun by Dominicans". Just as Dominicans see their/our side of the island "being overrun by Haitians". And of course skin color comes into play. I've heard the same here in the US. It all sounds very familiar. By the way I had the pleasure of meeting Piri Tomas in 68/69. Do you remember the part in the book of his experience with an unknown woman on the subway. I was never that lucky. Maybe one of these days. )
Written by: Atabey, 25 Jun 2012 5:04 PM
From: United States, NYC
Well I've been so lucky on the Subway but was left drained from the experienced. In fact, it happened to me a few times while riding up and down the "A" and number 1 trains.One time it happened on the "LL" train. Yes, it was called LL back in the days. Now it's simply called the "L" train.
But Piri's days were way tougher than any I experienced in NYC growing up.
I too met Thomas back 8 or so years ago.
But in all honesty Pedrin, I beg to differ that it's the same. While it's true that PR has something like 200-250 K Dominicans, the numbers in DR from Haiti are staggering and continue afoot with no discernable easing. And there is a GREAT DIFFERANCE in people moving about your country with extreme poverty and all that entails for your homeland. I've yet to see Dominican children in groups roaming the streets of the towns and cities of PR begging for a few coins. Think having boatloads of pregnant Dominican women wouldn't raise alarm bells in PR?
Written by: Atabey, 25 Jun 2012 5:18 PM
From: United States, NYC
Illegal Immigrant Deportations by the Numbers
By Paul Bedard
September 6, 2011
For all the grief President Obama has taken over his immigration policy—Republicans say he's a wimp, Democrats say he's not compassionate enough—one fact has emerged during his term so far. He's deported about 18 percent more illegal immigrants than former President George W. Bush did in his last two years in office. And he's on par to have given the boot to nearly 1.5 million immigrants by the time this term is done."
So Obama term in office might very well see his Administration deport nearly 1.5 million people! More than George Bush did IN TWO TERMS IN OFFICE!
And there's is BIG differance with someone gaining VISA into a nation and those that simply walk across the border. The first ones are in the nation illegally from overstaying their VISAS, the second group willfully gained entry into the country and are thus violators of the first order: they never had permission to enter.
Written by: NYGuy35, 25 Jun 2012 5:47 PM
From: United States
Haiti liberated the entire island however a minority of Europeans and mulattoes, who owned slaves, begged the Spanish to come back, remove the free African slaves, and restore their right to own people. When the Africans were pushed back to modern day Haiti, the Dominicans then decided they didn't want to be ruled by the Spanish. Many Dominicans with light skin believe they descend from these same Europeans. Truth is, all Dominicans and Haitians share the same blood and descend from the same people but thanks to racism and the perception that light is right, Haitians and Dominicans fight.
So long as you are busy fighting each other, the Europeans, savy Dominicans and my fellow Americans will continue to steal everything from DR and manipulate resources until all is exhausted.
From: Dominican Republic, NEVER FORGOTTEN, NEVER FORSAKEN!
NYGuy is pulling race card when we're talking about the Haitian crossing the border in the hundreds of thousands as if our country belong to them.
...and who says we have the same blood, are we 100% African? NO. You know something, this color thing doesn't matter, as much as you wanna pull the race card you are WRONG.
Dominicans with light skin believe they descend from these same Europeans. Truth is, all Dominicans and Haitians share the same blood and descend from the same people
Nothing can be further from the truth, if someone is light skin, with straight hair, how can that person be 100% African, ARE YOU DUMB OR SOMETHING, not every Dominican looks like a Baseball player son, both my parents are 3rd generation Spaniard.
Written by: Atabey, 25 Jun 2012 7:11 PM
From: United States, NYC
"Truth is, all Dominicans and Haitians share the same blood and descend from the same people..."
Au Contraire,
While many have similar background, due in great part to the invasions from the west, many Dominicans have significant differances from their average counterpart in Haiti. Many in Haiti have never gotten over their nations inability to control the entire island after invading the Spanish speaking part in 1821.Even small nations driven by revolutionary fevor can and do practice imperialism. The Haitians used the pretext of eliminating slavery and possible European invasions from the east to extend their land grab of the Spanish speaking part of Hispaniola. The Spanish part of the island had developed a very racially tolerant society by the standards of the day.
This poverty dumping by Haiti is the issue. All sensible people understand that both countries have a lot to gain from mutually supporting policies that increase their prosperity.
Written by: NYGuy35, 25 Jun 2012 7:11 PM
From: United States
@airgordo - Dominicans come to the US illegally a variety of ways however these three are the most common: 1) boat to P.R then a forged birth certificate. Finally plane ticket to NYC and application for passport.
2) Sneak on US bound cruise ship in cargo hold using known smugglers.
3)K -1/3 visa fraud. They find a sucker get married, stay around until the conditional residency is final then file for divorce or separate.
These scams and methods occur every day. To recognize the game is not being ignorant. Dominicans thinking they are better than Haitians is ignorant because the only reason The Dominican Republic has more is due to the fact Europeans and American were able to exploit your beaches and natural resources via foreign ownership. Foreign ownership,is something the Haitian constitution forbids.
Written by: Atabey, 25 Jun 2012 7:14 PM
From: United States, NYC
But the scale and breath of the current waves are enormous and given the privailing substandard conditions in DR (housing, health care, jobs, education, etc) the added weight of a massive increase in extreme poverty from Haiti has caused a downturn in the quality of life for Dominicans. If you can't see that, then you're blind. But of course, you have another agenda.
From: Dominican Republic, NEVER FORGOTTEN, NEVER FORSAKEN!
" Foreign ownership,is something the Haitian constitution forbids."
At the expence of the Haitians hungry stomach?
Wao, that's one of the dumbest things I ever heard.
China is buying trillions of Dollars of US debt, how do you explain that one Einstein.
Written by: NYGuy35, 25 Jun 2012 7:21 PM
From: United States
@Silent: light skin is just a factor of the persons melanin count. There are Africans with low counts and this trait has persisted with them for thousands of years. Light is not right Silent so you may be a Spanish but if I recall the Moors ran the southern parts of Spain until 1492. Africa has many countries and the people in Tunisia don't always look like the people in Nigeria but they have one thing in common. They are African. you should look in your family closed Silent. You just might find one of Lucy's descendants bones there :-)
Written by: Atabey, 25 Jun 2012 7:26 PM
From: United States, NYC
"Foreign ownership,is something the Haitian constitution forbids."
If the NEW Constitution is any guide, this law has been amended and EVEN Haitians born elsewhere can now participate more boardly in the political, commercial and business spheres.
Correct Don't Be Silent, THIS IS NOT about Race!
Quality of life and poverty dumping are the REAL issues.
Written by: NYGuy35, 25 Jun 2012 7:27 PM
From: United States
@Silent - it is unfortunate you have not been exposed to economics or history. Owning sovereign debt is not the same as owning the land and controlling stake in a business in a foreign country.
The library is free you should use it.
Now to your point if it is a good policy that I would agree however you you read the history of Haiti in the early years you will see why. The sugar industry owned DR and Cuba. In fact the only reason DR has major roads and railways, exempt the Metro, is because of the sugar industry.
Haiti does not want to be owned by foreigners hence the language in the constitution.
Written by: NYGuy35, 25 Jun 2012 7:29 PM
From: United States
@Atabey you must be Haitian to own 51% stake in a Hatian business.
Written by: Atabey, 25 Jun 2012 7:29 PM
From: United States, NYC
"Haiti does not want to be owned by foreigners hence the language in the constitution."
LOL!
I guess that's why it CAN FEED ITSELF and DOESN'T NEED MASSIVE HELP!
Talk about needing history and economic lessons!!
From: Dominican Republic, NEVER FORGOTTEN, NEVER FORSAKEN!
Like I told you before, to me that does not matter, there is only one human race on this planet, not two or three. If you are advocating for Haitian immigration disorder, which it is actually the fact here, then you are WRONG.
Written by: NYGuy35, 25 Jun 2012 7:33 PM
From: United States
@atabey - Haiti cannot feed itself because of poor land management, poor soil back when slave crops were grown and western nations locking out the country from markets. This just didn't happen 10 years ago. This has been a system in place since the 1800s
Written by: Adamo123, 25 Jun 2012 7:39 PM
From: United States
Here it comes 3rd generation Spaniard.... is the end result a White or a mulatto. What is the percentage of mulatto versus White and black Dominicans. Dig out the Dominican Today archive you will for sure find the breakdown.Then what is the genetic make up of a mulatto. Check it out, and think about your roots. Better not to play the racecard here though. Hence the same blood or half blood, whatever you want to call it Just a reminder, that part of the island was ran by the Haitians once, they just let go off it. Obama himself had seen his uncle or aunt being deported or faced deportation too. That is the law of the land and it must be followed with no exceptions. As I always said, DR has the right to protect its land but do it the riight way without human rights violations. By the way, the Dominicans fleeing DR aren't they doing so for misery or poverty also. It doesn't look like the way some of you portray it. 1.5 millions is far from the sum
of all the immigrants in the US.
Written by: NYGuy35, 25 Jun 2012 7:44 PM
From: United States
@Silent - Haitians should not flood the streets and cause a humanitarian crisis on the streets. However Dominicans need Haitians. They pick up the trash with the wood boards. They sell you your orange and Clark cards at intersections. They perform domestic service.
They work off the tax rolls. Without these illegals companies would have to hire Dominicans and as we all know, Dominicans don't want to work unless it is for the government where they have a license to steal.
Written by: Adamo123, 25 Jun 2012 7:46 PM
From: United States
Dear Atabey :
There is no difference for the two ended up being illegals at some point in their life and illegal has only one spelling 'ILLEGAL' . Does the ended up being illegal who enters lawfully receives a better treatment than the other illegal while facing a deportation judge.
In your world, it seems that one is written with capital letters and the other with small ones.
Written by: NYGuy35, 25 Jun 2012 7:52 PM
From: United States
@atabey - it's is always about race when it comes to Dominicans and Haitians. You can thank Trujillo for that. Thank El Corte for that. If Toussaint Louverture didn't lead a rebellion DR would be Cuba.
Written by: Atabey, 25 Jun 2012 8:09 PM
From: United States, NYC
Written by: Adamo123, 25 Jun 2012 7:46 PM
From: United States
Dear Atabey :
There is no difference for the two ended up being illegals at some point in their life and illegal has only one spelling 'ILLEGAL' . Does the ended up being illegal who enters lawfully receives a better treatment than the other illegal while facing a deportation judge.
In your world, it seems that one is written with capital letters and the other with small ones."
Not so. And you should take a legal course or two before saying they are the same.
As for the REAL ISSUES. Quality of life and Poverty dumping are the main ones. Both put enormous pressures on the DR. The international Community needs to step in and offer these poor haitians options besides defending their movement eastward on the island.
--------------------
BTW, NYGuy35 , long BEFORE any Dictator Trujillo ruled the DR, Haitian military people were doing their own Cortes. LOL Just ask some CibaeNos in Santiago and Moca.
Written by: Atabey, 25 Jun 2012 8:19 PM
From: United States, NYC
And if you really want to know how RACISM played out in Haiti, just do some history reading regarding race and check out WHO OUTLAWED WHITE AS A CATEGORY in Haiti. Hint, even some of Napoleons troops from Poland that ended up supporting the Haitian Revolution had to accept Black or Negro as their racial type.
So come again with RACISM being the reason for this problem. If anything, the problem of race had its problematical turmoil and development in HAITI. The DR had developed or evolved an extremely mixed racial society before the invasions from Haiti. And since Sugar plantation farming was not the engine of growth, animal farming, especially cattle ranching, was on the Spanish speaking part of the island, the invasions from the west actually formented racial tentions that under no pressure from the west may well have evolved into one harmonious and better atuned racial understanding in the coming republican era. But such designs went down with the Haitian invasions
From: United States, Bay Area, CA - (Dei sitio)
Adamo and NYGuy,
Dominicans and Haitian come from same blood as you said, but let's keep the French speaking Africans with darker skin on one side and the Spanish Speaking Africans with a little lighter skin on the other side and we will live like happy neighbors. We are not talking about race here, but numbers 10% - 15% illegal and uneducated immigrants in a country is a problem regardless of the color of those immigrants.
From: Dominican Republic, NEVER FORGOTTEN, NEVER FORSAKEN!
This guy keeps talking about race and skin color when this article is about the disorder this Haitian invasion is causing on our side of the island.
I find black people to be fixated on race all the time.
Written by: Pepe32, 25 Jun 2012 10:27 PM
From: Dominican Republic
Adamo if you smell a latrine perhaps you should close your mouth or go far from Haiti..
From: United States
To the dude who keeps bringing up that DR is 4th in prostitution(how many times does he mention this?), at least our women are attractive enough to warrant the position. But stick to the essence of the article and stop your meager attempts at belittling when you have nothing constructive to say. And as far as Haitians and Dominicans sharing the same bloodlines let me lay out some historical facts:
Haitians have no Taino blood- 40- 60% of Dominicans do.
Haitians have no Spanish blood, nor do they have much french blood since their great hero desalines killed off the white french colonists during their revolution.
The African component of our makeup is 500 to 400 yrs old and mixed with Taino and European. Yours is 300- 200 yrs not necesarally from the same african peoples. Your African blood is the last and least part of our makeup. (Other than the forced breeding during the 24 years of occupation there hasn't been too many mixing between us until recently).
From: United States
So the Haitian teachings that we are the same bloodlines and that this vein was wrongly cut off is nothing but wishful thinking. We are of African descent, we share the same foods, the same island and have shared our bloods in early 1800's, 1821-1844,1846,1848, and 1852. That's the extent of our interaction. We can build a new relationship and future as independent and sovereign neighbors,but first let's cut the fantasies and be honest with each other.
You have not been good political neighbors to us and thus our resentment and suspicions towards you. Two centuries ago your ancestors tried force intergration on us by force of arms and made things bad between us. Now you are trying to get the international community to back your permanence in our lands, calling us racists to garner sympathy. This will backfire. No peoples like to be forced into a union. We fought you back then and if pushed into a corner we will fight you again as well as your hypocritical UN backers.
Written by: cocoa, 26 Jun 2012 11:10 AM
From: Ecuador
benjamin......you are absolutely right on that one love.....I have to agree....and i been to dr many times and the dominicans are bigtime racists against the haitians.....really sad but true
Written by: Atabey, 26 Jun 2012 11:53 AM
From: United States, NYC
cocoa,
Read some history. It's never too late.
Written by: Adamo123, 26 Jun 2012 4:52 PM
From: United States
Dear Atabey wrote :
" And you should take a legal course or two before saying they are the same."
Not really, I was fortunate to receive a BS in engineering and my MBA at one of the prestigious Ivy League Schools. Needless to tell you that life has been good to me so far. I live it worries free.
Written by: Adamo123, 26 Jun 2012 5:07 PM
From: United States
Pepe32 wrote :
"Adamo if you smell a latrine perhaps you should close your mouth or go far from Haiti.."
Far from Haiti and closer to where you are ....Do I really need to do that if that smell is derived from your writing.....I will not waste my time in this forum replying to your nonsense blog. Out of some thousand posts I have read so far here, yours always lack of substance and value. Go back and read your posts here and outside of this forum to see if there are of any value. Your language speaks for itself and your personality.
Written by: Adamo123, 26 Jun 2012 5:26 PM
From: United States
To venganzaderafael :
I never played the racecard in my life...for where ever I go I am welcome for I have what it takes to get accepted into our society.. I don't give a damn about your genetic make up, accomplishments are more important to me in life. I tried to direct people to the right track when I voiced my opinons on the "same blood comment". Recently, there was an article on DominicanToday or elsewhere (don't recall) about the make up of the DR population. I do not recall the exact percentage though somewhere aroud 70% mulatto, the whites in the teen % and the blacks make up the difference. Though a mulatto is perceived to be .....see the next post
Written by: Adamo123, 26 Jun 2012 5:29 PM
From: United States
Though Mulatto is a term used to refer to a person who is born from one white parent and one black parent, or more broadly, a person of mixed black and white ancestry. Contemporary usage of the term varies greatly, and the broader sense of the term makes its application rather subjective, as not all people of mixed white and black ancestry choose to self-identify as mulatto. Some reject the term because of its association with slavery and colonial and racial oppression, preferring terms such as "mixed" and "biracial"[. Mulattos may also be an admixture of Native American, South American native and African Americans
That article did not refer to Dominicans as Tainos. Feel free to be whoever you want to be if that will facilitate acceptance. Do I care....ooooops! Tainos, mulattos, whites...whaetever.
Hence the mixture of African blood.
Written by: Adamo123, 26 Jun 2012 6:38 PM
From: United States
Venganzaderafael wrote :
"To the dude who keeps bringing up that DR is 4th "
Here is why!
Atabey wrote/asked :
"What matters is WHAT DOMINICANS DO IN HAITI."
My reply was a direct and an honest answer to that, somebody else expanded it, another intejected, I then referred them to the source of my info. To sum it all we were talking about what haitians are bringing to the table besides begging and the negativity surrounding their presence in DR, which led to name calling and attributes and so forth . I did not want you guys to ignore that both nations have their own dilemma to deal with and that they need to keep eyes on this one. Can't close eyes on it if they value their beloved country so much. I do not think it is a good thing either. Someone else may disagree with me, you might disagree with that but this is my personal opinion. I am from the old school.
Written by: Adamo123, 26 Jun 2012 7:28 PM
From: United States
More on the Tainos/Mulattos.
en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ta%C3%ADno
wordiq.com/definition/Mulatto
From: United States
Yo cocola, I just reviewed the entire posting and nowhere does Benji state anything about Dominicans being racist. Could you have confused the Haitians? Anyway yes there are many Dominicans who are racist or come from racist families. But it is a small minority and they are also racist against black Dominicans and even mixed Dominicans. The rest of the anti Haitian attitudes you may have perceived is actually fervant nationalism.
The DR was attacked 5 times within a 55 year period by the Haitians. Even the most Christlike person would harbor some resentment against such a people and would make sure their children and grandchildren learn that history. That is all it is. Yes its been over 100 years but the attrocity committed by these Haitian ancestors have not faded from memory. My own family members fought the invaders in four of these conflicts and passed on the stories of how they would find the beaten and raped bodies of DR women as they chased the Haitians back home
From: United States
Comia de popeye, i don't look at color in a women I look at shape. And you call us racist. I'm sure the Haitian soldiers never reported their cowardly behavior while invading our lands, many rapes of defenseless women by your undisciplined army did occur, especially in That left many Dominicans with hatred and disdain for you people. I repeat that our problem with you isn't race or color it was your behavior in our lands during your invasions. Correction, it was your ancestors behavior but you might have heard the saying " the sins of the father .....".
Espinaca all I ever read from you is insults and innuendos. You don't offer solutions or words of reconciliation. WE DID NOT START WARS WITH YOU. YOU CAME TO F*#k WITH US. Until you people own up to your ancestor's actions against us as the real reason there is bad blood between us, not racism, we will never agree. And by the way there is NO REASON in the world for which I would condone rape. That is a sick mentality.
From: United States
Adamo, as an educated and reasonable person, you can agree that the present situation cannot continue. Both our governments need to find solutions to this immigrant problem. We Dominicans have extended our hand in your time of need. Your people cannot continue to spill over to DR like "perro por su casa" . Haiti's main problem is overpopulation. We must both secure outlets to other nations not just DR. Our government should do something to legalize and normalize the lives of Haitian-Dominicans born and raised in DR, we just can't do it for all the new immigrants.
Written by: Adamo123, 27 Jun 2012 11:30 AM
From: United States
@Venganzderafael
I said all over my posts here and elswhere that DR as a sovereign nation has the rights to protect its land/borders and control the influx of immigrants, but that has to happen with tact and diplomacy .Some of the bloggers here sometimes took the opportunity to dog Haiti as a nation for its misfortune, not really providing a real answer to the issue at hands. I tried to be neutral in this forum but at times I had to take a stand, for the Haitins are not stepping up to the plate to plead their cause.
:-)
Hi Ven, did you know that Trujilio ( not sure about the spelling) less than a century ago ordered the killing of about 50K haitians living in DR. Should our world be prepared to see another one like this again. The way this is going, where too many are fed up and not want to put up with it going forwards.Looks like if we ever see again a deranged president in power in DR, the likelihood of this happening will not be zero. Your thoughts!
Written by: Pepe32, 27 Jun 2012 11:39 AM
From: Dominican Republic
Adamo,I could care less what you say because this has to do with MY country and though you try to appear polite you have the same ideas and discourse that all the other Haitians do .I don't understand why Haitians don't focus their efforts on cleaning up their own disaster instead of coming with their excrement to DR. We have enough problems as it is mostly due to all the previous Haitian invasions and the ignorance they brought with every wave. It is obvious that you are just one of the regular pitis with a different name but anyhow some of my countrymen may be fooled by you false words but I can see all the same anti-Dominican pro-Haitian bs in your words so as we say in DR
!!Vete al mismísimo carajo (o si prefieres a Haití piti de mierda)!!
Written by: Adamo123, 27 Jun 2012 11:49 AM
From: United States
Somebody may not have read Adamo's blogs in his enterity.... does not have to answer every moron post in this blog. Have a good day.
Written by: Adamo123, 27 Jun 2012 11:54 AM
From: United States
Pros & cons
dominicantoday.com/dr/economy/2012/6/26/44170/Talk-of-closing-US20B-per-year-border-market-worries-agro-leader
Did you know that guys? Who do you think would benefit most from the US 2 Billons?
Please read the DominicanToday daily newsletter of today!
From: United States
Yes Adamo I am very much aware of the murders of defenseless Haitians in the early 1930's by order of the goat Trujillo. Many were massacred as they were crossing the bridge back to Haiti. A despicable and cowardly act by our government , not to be condoned. My grandfather had a personal encounter with Trujillo's thugs when they were rounding up Haitians after Trujillo gave them 72 hours to leave the country. They came for my adopted Haitian uncle who my grandfather had taken in after his Haitian parents died. Grandpa stood in the front of the door and told the soldiers that they could take the boy over his dead body. Fortunately my grandfather had family members of high rank in the military and the soldiers did not take him up on his suggestion.
That Haitian uncle gave his life along with other family members fighting for Dominican sovereignty in the revolution of 1965 when the marines again invaded our lands.
Written by: Adamo123, 27 Jun 2012 2:41 PM
From: United States
@venganzaderafael
Thanks for sharing your history with us! I am sure there were/are Humble Dominicans out there with a good heart. This is a story to remember. Let's just hope that history does not repeat itself. So one should try to extinct not to ignite the fire for the tensions are mounting and mounting now to a high it has never reached before.
Written by: Adamo123, 27 Jun 2012 5:40 PM
From: United States
@Spinach....yesterday per DominicanToday
Though both sides are violent and raping women. I followed most of those stories.
"Two Haitians get 20 years in prison for rape of US missionary"
Here is the link below
dominicantoday.com/dr/local/2012/6/26/44175/Two-Haitians-get-20-years-in-prison-for-rape-of-US-missionary
From: United States
Hey popeye food, I just read an article in today's DT news that two Haitians were just convicted of raping (oops did I say RAPE again) a missionary and getting 20 years for it. Didn't you say Haitians don't rape unless its for robbery or revenge. I wouldn't stick my neck out with comments like that buddy. Why don't you try some constructive conversation instead of getting into this back and forth
Trading of insults. Or is that all you have to offer as a solution to our mutual problems? What do you think should be done to remedy the tensions building up due to the unrestrained flow of refugees to the eastern part? Or for that matter the situation of the offsprings of Haitian workers born in DR?
Written by: saru2191, 1 Jul 2012 12:47 AM
From: United States, New York
How unfortunate that the DR has to share it's island with the poorest country in the western hemisphere. What's even more unfortunate is the fact that it's neighbors had to be of significant African descent. If there's one thing the U.S. and U.N. are suckers for it's apparently white guilt. All Haitians have to do is pull the race card and claim that DR is being "rasis an sheit" against their blackness and the U.N. eats it all up while ignoring the real issues. Just look at this thread, how many of the Haitians here pulled the race card on this article and discussion that was solely based on illegal immigration? How many Haitians also started racial discussions on other forums and articles here that had nothing to do with race? Many of them claim we're race obsessed, yet they're the ones who always want to talk about how we view ourselves.
From: United States
Comida de popeye You are just full of hate . A truly foul mouthed soul. This is the extent of your writing abilities? Unfortunately there are many of your countrymen that think and feel like you. That's why we want to remain a separate people from your kind. Do not direct any of your foulmouthed postings at me , I will not have any further discouse with you moron. Comida de perro.
Written by: saru2191, 1 Jul 2012 3:37 PM
From: United States, New York
That's exactly my point, Can you tell me how many times has Haiti tried to invade DR? Now tell me how many time DR tried to invade Haiti? The People of DR have had ties to this island for at least 3 centuries longer than the people of Haiti. Yet we never never took the authority to invade your nation, or better yet, exile you from this island. However, Haiti tried to invade DR on multiple occasions, including now. What happened to the people of Haiti was unfortunate, but it's also unfortunate that DR has to have you as it's neighbors.
Written by: saru2191, 1 Jul 2012 4:36 PM
From: United States, New York
I'm in the country legally and I'm not detrimental to the U.S. like a lot of Haitians are to DR. Also, don't boast about money that was sympathetically handed to you by foreign aid, I'm sure some of that money came from DR as well.
From: United States
Saru don't waste your time answering comida de perro. He has nothing constructive or intelligent to say. All he can do is curse and threaten to curse some more. When the shit goes down lets see if he has the balls to come to the island to fight. If the present situation turns volatile I WIILL BE THERE and so will 1 million Dominicans from the diasporra. We didn't kick their asses 5 times to just hand over the country. I don't care if we have to fight the UN. This imbecil's attitude is more prevalent than most of us perceive. Do not be fooled by their plight. The majority of the invaders were not affected by the eaethquake. They just took advantage of our willingness to help them. But like comia de perro many have another agenda. Wake up my people, the invasion is for real. These people are not going back willingly. We're going to have to physically push them back.
Que viva Los Trinitarios!
From: United States
Yes nig you heard me correctly. Your ancestor's armies weren't fighting no one in the mid 1800's but us. What they were getting tired of was getting their asses whipped every time they invaded. And by the way moron, when Touissant " liberated "the island the french were in control of the whole island thru the treaty of Ryswick in 1797. The french recovered the east when Touissant was captured. After the slave revolt finally succeded and the french left Haiti in 1804 they continued controlling the Spanish side until 1810 when we threw them out ourselves. Then instead of working with us to keep them out you invade us and then paid them off for I don't know how many years so they wouldn't invade you. Talk about cowardly acts, and thank you for admitting most of your boys are nothing but thugs. Hope many of my countrymen read this blog and start putting pressure on our gov't to send them all packing. I'm done with you. Keep yapping your foul bs to the four winds.
From: United States
Pro-Haitian sympathizers fail to see the complete picture of the whole process. No doubt there is a human element that must be taken into consideration. But of course we can help and provide Haitians with as much support as possible as long as their numbers remain under !%-However this is not what has happened.
What we observe is that 20%-25% of the Dominican population is composed of undocumented Haitians. That means out of every 4 or 5 natives, 1 is Haitian. If we think about this for a minute, these numbers are extremely alarming and leave us no choice but to throw the "humanitarian" factor out the window. The bottom line and it all boils down to them vs us. I am not about to sacrifice my life and family to save a stranger. It is every man for himself. It is sad and unfortunate, but there aint enough resources to go around. "No hay cama pa tanta gente."
And this is not just about scarcity of resources, it is potentially dangerous for the DR
From: United States
Haiti is not just a country next door full of hungry people. It is almost like a cult, a complete system of backwardness. At first glance, we think of Haiti as a country in chaos, whose people seek refuge in the DR as solution to their problems, but it is more then that. It has religious, legal, political, economic and even military components. However, it is the cultural part which will serve as a tie for all the other components that will eventually seek to achieve the Haitianization of the DR. Haitianization occurs when there are big enough numbers to agitate demands for so-alled "immigrant rights."
When politically correct and culturally diverse societies agree to 'the reasonable' of Haitian demands for their rights,' they also get the other components under the table. Which is Ok and acceptable as long as the Haitian population remains at around 1% and will be regarded as a peace-loving and hard working minority and not a threat to anyone. (continued)
From: United States
However as they increase in size at about 2% and 3% they begin to gain a stronger foot hold as a disadvantanged minority and will gain the sympathy of other disaffected groups, NGO and the international community. From 5% on, they exercise an inordinate influence in proportion to their
percentage of the population. They will push for greater demands for social services such as food, health, education and the easing of requirements for the legalization of their legal status. Pro-Haitian organizations will increase pressure on the Dominican state to succumb to those demands. and will penalize them with threats for failure to comply.
At this point, they will work to get the ruling government to allow them to remain and legalize their status. Perhaps if their numbers become large enough, they will eventually request autonomy to rule themselves. When Haitians reach 10% of the population, we have noticed an increase in lawlessness as a means of complaint about their conditions.
From: United States
Potentially, after reaching the 20% mark, which is the point we have reached now, expect hair-trigger rioting, sporadic killings and violent outbursts: At 40% you will find widespread revolts, possible attacks and ongoing violent outbursts. These events are likely organized and supported by Jesuits or subversive pro-Haitian organizations.
What I have stated are only potentially possible, future case scenarios of what can occur if we do not control the flow of Haitians into Dominican territory. It has nothing to do with racism, love or hate of the Haitian people. This has to do with nationaliam, saving the the DR, keeping order, preserving the peace and alive the cultural integrity of our country.
From: United States
Bien dicho guillermone. Esta gente son aprovechadores. Usaron el terrermoto para realizar su suenos de mas de 150 anos de aduenarse del pais. Con el porcentaje que tienen en el pais se sienten seguros que ahora nadie lo saca. Es lamentable pero vamos a tener que sacarlos a la mala. Necesitamos un govierno nacionalista con cojones. Con todo lo que el PLD y Leonel han hecho para el progreso del pais su inactividad contra la violacion de nuestra frontera es imperdonable.
Veremos que hace Danilo para remediar este afrentamiento a nuestra soberenidad. Si no se le pone fuerte a estos invasores y su adulones internacional en estos 4 anos vamos a tener tremendo pleito para remediar la situacion. Solamente hay que notar su comportamiento altanero para realizar cuales son sus intenciones: quedarse a este lado. O tenemos un pequeno plieto ahora o tendremos guerra civil en el cercano futuro. Le doy 10 anos de plazo. Despierten pueblo Dominicano!
Y al ejercito que se prepare!
From: United States
Spinach the point of the article is that toooo many illegals have crossed the border straining the meager resources we have. With many of our own nationals leaving for lack of opportunities how can we possibly take in others. The Haitian population has grown too much in too short a time. Have you ever heard or read of the Scandinavian experiment regarding overpopulation? I see something similar happenning in the whole island. This issue must be addressed by both governments. Haiti must be helped to rebuild its infrastructure in order to lure some of their nationals back home and the international community must take some in to relieve the pressure. Both countries must exercise some form of birth control. Easier said than done I know given the Catholic influence. But especially necessary onthe part of Haiti with less resources and space. We cannot give " lebensroom" to your people.
From: United States
Over population means there are too many people for the available resources regardless of the amount or size of the populattion. If my next door neighbor is a couple with only 1 child and both are unemployed and unable to support another family member, they should not have anymore children regardless of the fact that a 1 child family is considered small or average. However, they have the right to have more children if they so wish, but please dont come knocking on my door in the middle of the night because they ran out of milk and have no money to buy food for the kids. If that is the case the couple has one too many children and should therefore control and restrain their urges until circumstances improve. This is what over population is really all about, the ability and capacity to satisfy the basic needs of the people to include food, clothing and shelter.
From: United States
This is the reason why China's established population control. Initially during post 1949, leaders viewed large populations as an asset. But the liabilities of a large, rapidly growing nation soon became apparent.
During the month of August in 1956, the Chinese govt pushed for a vigorous propaganda in support mass birth control efforts. These efforts, however, had little impact on fertility. After the interval of the Great Leap Forward, Chinese leaders again saw rapid population growth as an obstacle to development, and their interest in birth control revived.
Population growth targets were set for Chinese families. In the mid-1970s the maximum recommended family size was two children in cities and three or four in the country. Since 1979 the government has advocated a one child limit for both rural and urban areas and has generally set a maximum of two children in special circumstances.
It worked & today China is fast becoming a world superpower. Why because of foresight.
From: United States
@Spinach-You are an idealist and what you express is nothing but a Utopia. It does not exist in the real world. Our human reality is not the way you describe and if you believe it to be possible, disappointment is sure to follow. Don't bother to change things to fit your wants and desires, it will not happen. But I understand where you are coming from and I agree whole heartedly that a truely free world is one without borders, that is the way it should be. Unfortunately it is a dream and not reality and most of us have no choice but to accept our lot in life. The only thing that gives us the options to pick and choice and to be truely free to do as we wish is the good old almighty dollar. There aint nothing at this moment which can give you more alternatives to go and be anything your hearts desire.
From: Dominican Republic
Why you are crying when YOU are the ones who are benefitting most?
Why?
Haitians come here to WORK - a strange word for many Dominicans.
Illegal Haitians pay a lot of money to MANY corrupt Dominican officials along the way.
Just ask ANY illegal Haitian how he could enter this country - even without a passport. Just ask them.
It's a million peso (or even dollars) business - but not for the Haitians!
And ask the legal Haitians how much they have to pay to enter LEGALLY here. And then ask, how much a Dominican has to pay to get a visa for a European country for example!
From: United States
Calvoleon-Well since Dominicans are the ones who are benefitting the most. Then if that is the case lets just let the whole country of Haiti move over into the DR so they can get a job and work. How about that for a solution ?
From: United States
So now we no longer have immigration control. People have the right to violate sovereign nations' borders by simply paying money. I suppose u feel they now have legasl rights to stay?
From: United States
I will keep on repeating, we need a nationalistic administration in power that will tell these NGO's to F*ck off and start clearing the country of undocumented Haitians. This has happened before. We are in the midst of an invasion. These people are not leaving willingly and they are reproducing like rabbits. It is ridiculous that at 20% of the population they are giving birth at the rate of the other 80%.
DESPIERTEN PUEBLO MIO! Esto es una invacion pacifica pero una invacion comoquierra.
From: Dominican Republic
guillermone, maybe I didn't express myself. Of course the Dominican Republic has the all the rights to control immigration and can decide whom they want. That's not what I dispute.
But it's soooo boring to hear these people complain every day about the illegal Haitians. - WHO LETS THEM IN ???? All the corrupt DOMINICAN police along the way that get "bakshish" of all the busses full with indocumented people looking for a better future.
Who needs the Haitians to EXPLOIT them as CHEAP WORKERS? - many times working under conditions that in other countries the boss would go to jail immediately. Aren't that DOMINICAN companies?
SO STOP WHINING! Control your borders - it's only 340 ridiculous kilometers!
And somethging else to this strange priest: Isn't the word of God peace - and not hatred?
From: United States
Calvoleon, I don't know if u r Haitian but if u r there is no hate in my heart for u my brother. What I have is deep concern for my people and their future. I have advocated for full legal rights for the children of Haitian migrant workers born in DR before this mass border violation of the past few years. Those born in DR because their mothers decided to cross the border to give birth on Dominican soil do not deserve citizenship. The influx of such a large number of people is further depressing the already low wages being paid. Your people are taking jobs and resources ( medical attention, seats in the schools) that are needed for our own people and children. Your leaders must pressure the international community to open THEIR borders so your people can have an outlet other than DR. Yes we can help take some more of your people and give them legal status but the present #'s cannot be sustained otherwise the whole island will be doomed to war , famine and desease.
From: Dominican Republic
venganzaderafael: Of course I understand that the Haitian immigration is a big problem. And of course I agree that DR cannot solve the problems of the neighboring country. But as I wrote already, it's your own corrupt officials who let enter all the illegals for very good money. And when they deport them, they rip them off again. You have to face THAT truth. It cannot be that difficult to control this ridiculously short border. Of course it's not right when pregnant women come here to give birth to get Dominican citizenship for their kids. But it's the same thing that Dominicans etc. do in the U.S.!
And yet another thing is to deny citizenship to people who came here in the time of Trujillo, gave their whole life for the benefit of the sugar industry and now their children who are born here 20, 30 years ago and never even have been in Haiti are denied their papers.
I'm not Haitian, but European. Be sure that DR is closely watched in this matter & the sympathies are not on your side
From: United States
calvoleon-I know and aware, sympathies are not in favor of the DR. However, it is because outsiders are taking alook from afar, not from within, And it so happensd those "outsiders" created the root cause of the Haitian dilemna. The same people who are conveniently forcing DR to take in as many Haitians as possible so they can wash their hands of the mess they made in the first place. Yes we are in part responsible for for the uncontroled influx, but it is primarily the international community with France at the helm as the direct culprits for the invasions of destitute Haitians. You should point the fingers first at them and last one should be at us. And not only are Dominican companies expoiting Haitians but so are the thousands of European corporations mostly in the tourist industies. And finally, denial of citizenship to Haitians is a constitutional matter instituted by the wisdom of our founding fathers to keep their numbers low and prevent precisely a Haitian takeover of the DR
From: United States
Bravo Guillermone, especially pointing out the complicity of the many Euro owned companies who could care less about the quality of life in DR as long as they make more profits due to the low wages they pay the Haitians . Good paying jobs that supported many Dominican families years ago are now being given to Haitians at cut rate wages. That I would say is the driving force for the Haitians to cross the border. They know there is a job waiting for them if they accept less money. This depresses our internal economy and all the profits leave the country.
From: United States
@calvoleon-"And yet another thing is to deny citizenship to people who came here in the time of Trujillo, gave their whole life for the benefit of the sugar industry and now their children who are born here 20, 30 years ago and never even have been in Haiti are denied their papers."
My heart bleeds for the plight of probably a few thousand children of undocumented who have been denied a right to a nationality. However, before passing judgement, one must know and be aware, the Haitian consitution dictates any child born of Haitians parents can be given citizenship regardless of birth place. Therefore, they do have a right to legal papers, all they have to do is apply. The Rep of Haiti will give it to them, if they go to the Haitian Embassy or consulate and it shall be granted. Once complete, proceed on to residency and naturalization.
Meanwhile, if the DR grants nationality, it will establish a legal precedent and then we will be screwed, flooded with Haitians with no end in sight
Written by: airgordo, 24 Jul 2012 12:00 AM
From: Dominican Republic
Written by: calvoleon, 23 Jul 2012 4:30 PM
From: Dominican Republic
venganzaderafael: Of course I understand that the Haitian immigration is a big problem. And of course I agree that DR cannot solve the problems of the neighboring country. But as I wrote already, it's your own corrupt officials who let enter all the illegals for very good money. And when they deport them, they rip them off again. You have to face THAT truth. It cannot be that difficult to control this ridiculously short border. Of course it's not right when pregnant women come here to give birth to get Dominican citizenship for their kids. But it's the same thing that Dominicans etc. do in the U.S.!
----
FEW Dominicans that have a US visa and can support themselves for at least Three months on the US, How many Dominicans do you think fill that profile? did you know a Pregnant Woman will not be allowed to FLY past the 7 months? how do you think they get to US then, Swimming? PLEASE don't compare!!
Written by: airgordo, 24 Jul 2012 12:08 AM
From: Dominican Republic
Written by: guillermone, 23 Jul 2012 10:38 PM
From: United States
My heart bleeds for the plight of probably a few thousand children of undocumented who have been denied a right to a nationality. However, before passing judgement, one must know and be aware, the Haitian consitution dictates any child born of Haitians parents can be given citizenship regardless of birth place. Therefore, they do have a right to legal papers, all they have to do is apply. The Rep of Haiti will give it to them, if they go to the Haitian Embassy or consulate and it shall be granted. Once complete, proceed on to residency and naturalization.
Meanwhile, if the DR grants nationality, it will establish a legal precedent and then we will be screwed, flooded with Haitians with no end in sight.
---
They CAN'T apply because they don't exist ANYWHERE, the Haitian Goverment DOES NOT DOCUMENT it's own people!! in the past i read a figure of 40% of the Haitians population are UNDOCUMENTED!! just throw it to DR
Written by: airgordo, 24 Jul 2012 12:20 AM
From: Dominican Republic
It is PATHETIC when people that IGNORE what they are talking about come to DR and try to DICTATE what they want US to do with Haiti, on stuff like the documentation BUT they remain silent and don't say a Sh!T to Blame the Haitian Government for the Misery of it's OWN PEOPLE!! According to these people we have to bend over and take a Neighbor from HELL and DO NOTHING or we are racist pigs!!
It is an IGNORANT, EVIL AND RIDICULOUS ACT to even dare to compare the Haitian immigration to DR with ANYTHING else on this hemisphere!! I will not get tired of Writing here that Domincans that EMIGRATE do it on a LEGAL STATUS on the vast majority, because THIS IS A F@CKING ISLAND!! SEA every where!! and even those that BREAK THE LAW and go it illegally elsewhere AT LEAST EXIST, they have a NAME, they have a PASSPORT, you can track their criminal record, you can track the Hospital RECORD, THEY FREAKING EXIST on their COUNTRY!! now compare that to people that don't have ANYTHING!
From: Dominican Republic
That's the nicest thing about many (not only Dominican - because I'm no racist) people. Always pointing at others. No, of course no Dominican nor Mexican woman can go to the U.S. to give birth there - impossible! And of course it's the fault of France and who knows who else that Dominican officials make a good living with illegal Haitians. Always the others!
Occasionally I have been in Villa Hermosa in La Romana - something like a Little Haiti - on 26 of January - Duarte Day. What I saw nearly broke my heart. Dozens of black children, easy to recognize as Haitian descendants, with worn out uniforms, and none of them overweight like most of the Dominican kids in better areas, were marching with Doninican flags, drawn by themselves, singing the Dominican national anthem - not knowing that nobody here wants to know about them.
In La Romana I know young people, intelligent and eager to study. But they have to work as motoconcho drivers or doing some low works in the sugar industry.
From: United States
@calvoleon-God...........!!!!
It really hurts to read what you just wrote. It breaks my heart, believe me. But what can you do ?
It is a tough spot we Dominicans find ourselves in. This reminds me of a story of two drowing people struggling to keep themselves alive and to avoid dying, attempt to gasp a last breath of fresh air but only swollow water to further reduce the likelyhood for survival.
Unfortunately there is only a single life vest to save just one life and one of the two people happens to be a very close family member. How will you react ? Which of the two will you throw the life vest to ?
Written by: NYGuy35, 24 Jul 2012 2:02 PM
From: United States
Haitians should boycott until they get treated equally. What will the dumb in a cans (dr) do? Force them to work? Ha! Riot in the streets Haitians and take your island back. These dr people that claim they are nth generation Spanish come from Spain's jails and poor that fled Spain because they had no standing. They are the outcast of Spain. That's why DR is a platano republic. Haiti take back your island!
From: Haiti
nyguy,we ayitians got here last.
Written by: airgordo, 24 Jul 2012 8:51 PM
From: Dominican Republic
@calvoleon
Since YOU are writing stuff I NEVER SAID, like that stupidity of Blaming others and denying some women perform HUMAN DUMPING, You SHOULD then learn to read First then Post, NOT BACKWARDS, so cut the crap and lets talk here about FACTS not Opinions which are like the @sses, EVERYONE HAS ONE...
My statement was VERY CLEAR and is WRITTEN on black and white, could you please WRITE HERE how many Dominican Women FULFILL the PROFILE to go to USA and to Human Dumping as you are STILL suggesting?? Would you like to compare NUMBERS on that DUMPING for each side?? have you ever been on a public hospital on places like Santiago which is not close to the border?
Did you check with an Airline if what i wrote here about the months of pregnancy for them TO FLY? or do you think this is MEXICO??
Nice story about the Children, if it had been on the UK, they would have been singing GOD SAVE THE QUEEN, on the USA it would have been GOD BLESS America, get the point NOW??
Written by: airgordo, 24 Jul 2012 8:56 PM
From: Dominican Republic
Written by: NYGuy35, 24 Jul 2012 2:02 PM
From: United States
Haitians should boycott until they get treated equally. What will the dumb in a cans (dr) do? Force them to work? Ha! Riot in the streets Haitians and take your island back. These dr people that claim they are nth generation Spanish come from Spain's jails and poor that fled Spain because they had no standing. They are the outcast of Spain. That's why DR is a platano republic. Haiti take back your island!
---
From your post is more than obvious that You've got NO F@CKING CLUE of the History of the DOMINCAN REPUBLIC and it's people...
From: Dominican Republic
@airgordo: If they were singing the anthems in UK or USA they were in a good school, not in a tin hut with a loamy ground, they had books that would teach them something useful, not the rubbish like here, and most of all, they had at least a birthcertificate and the chance to learn some profession or study in the university afterwards.
I really love to live here in the Dominican Republic and get along very well with both,Dominicans and Haitians, but unfortunately I have to say, that the way many people (not all, thanks God!) are treating Haitians is a shame. I know many Dominicans abroad who always are wailing that they are treated bad, but that's absolutely ridiculous in comparation how they treat Haitians. And they always invoke God. I hope, God will never will hold them accountable for their deeds. Otherwise - poor DR! That's all I have to say now.
From: United States
"...And they always invoke God. I hope, God will never will hold them accountable for their deeds. "
@Calvoleon-Are you referring to me ?
From: United States
The day Haitians start rioting in the streets of Dominican towns is the day they will be forcefully and physically evacuated from this side of the island and I fear they will lose the sympathy of like minded Dominicans like myself who favor legalization for a portion of your population living and working legally in the country. I myself will return home to defend our sovereignty. So be careful what you instigate nyguy cause All Haitians will be at risk.
From: Dominican Republic
@guillermone: No, to all the Dominicans
Written by: airgordo, 25 Jul 2012 5:26 PM
From: Dominican Republic
@calvoleon,
1- Unfortunately THAT RUBBISH is WHAT is available to ALL DOMINICAN children, it is in consequence a Supreme and EPIC Act of STUPIDITY to think that children from FOREIGNERS, which ALSO are BREAKING THE LAW, should have it BETTER than what Dominican Children HAVE ON THEIR OWN COUNTRY
2- Bad Treatment? Haitian and ALL foreigners are also FREE to go elsewhere, i REPEAT, FREE, they can always GO BACK TO HAITI, Do you dispute that? now...YOU want to talk about TREATMENT? let's do it! WHY don't you write here about the treatment on the HAitians ON HAITI?, GOOGLE RESTAVEK and point me to evidence of same on the DR, do you have any Idea of HOW MUCH is invested on TREATING this people on hospitals Alone? probably Not since i DOUBT you have even been to a Domincan Hospital.
3- Get the DOMINICAN CONSTITUTION ARTICLE 18 , which is the LAW OF THE LAND on this country and paste on an ONLINE translator so you can Kill your Ignorance on the DOMINICAN Nationality subject.
From: United States
@airgordo-
ANDA El' DIABLASO !!!! Que pela...............!!!!!
From: United States
The Supreme Court of the Dominican Republic has repeatedly ruled on the matter of the children of illegal immigrants, whatever their origin, confirming that if those born to parents legally in transit are precluded from automatically acquiring the nationality, the children of those who cannot justify their legal entry or stay in the country cannot benefit from a greater right. However, despite your assertion to the contrary, statelessness is not at issue here. Given that Article 11 of the Haitian constitution establishes that “Any person born of a Haitian father or Haitian mother who are themselves native-born Haitians and have never renounced their nationality possesses Haitian nationality at the time of birth,” persons born within Dominican territory of Haitian parents are not stateless.
From: United States
The Dominican Republic cannot be asked to shoulder the consequences of the serious deficiencies that plague the Haitian civil registry. Neither can it be expected, as in fact has been said in many of the comments elicited by your post, to bear the brunt of the human and economic costs of the dire situation faced by the Haitian people, for which they see no better solution than to emigrate across an extremely porous border to the Dominican Republic.
Aníbal de Castro
Ambassador
Embassy of the Dominican Republic
Washington, DC
Written by: airgordo, 25 Jul 2012 11:22 PM
From: Dominican Republic
Written by: guillermone, 25 Jul 2012 10:50 PM
From: United States
@airgordo-
ANDA El' DIABLASO !!!! Que pela...............!!!!!
---
LOL, coji la cuerda!! es que esta maldita gente de verdad que tienen a uno Jarto de escribir vainas y hablar pendejadas de cosas que ellos no tienen idea!! vienen a este pais hablando mierda disque de Trato, pero no dicen ni Pio del trato que le dan los Haitianos a los mismos Haitianos en Haiti, es mas facil cojer piedras para RD!
Written by: saru2191, 26 Jul 2012 12:08 AM
From: United States, New York
I'm curious as to what conditions calvoleon lives in the DR as a foreigner. Does he have a job with credentials that most illegal Haitians don't have? Does he have to worry about not being able to find a job because illegal Haitians can offer the same labor as him, but cheaper? Do the illegal Haitians seem have more rights than he does? I have a feeling calvoleon is no better than your typical foreigner who complains about Haitians and their supposed rights for citizenship in the DR. You know, the same foreigners who naively judge the situation while living in a country like the U.S. or France, not having to live under the same conditions as many Dominicans in DR have to endure due to very serious issues with illegal immigration.
From: United States
we have thus far 154 comments on this thread..............
From: Dominican Republic
saru2191. How do you live in New York? Under what conditions? Legally or illegal?
I'm living here, doing more for the Dominican Republic than anyone who is living in New York. I'm having my papers and pay taxes. My work is NOT easy and I don't have any money in the back. I'm working alone and for myself, not for a NGO. But for my work, I see the whole country every two weeks on a roundtrip. And it's not only beaches what I see, but also Calle Duarte in Santo Domingo or Calle Pedro Clisante in Sosúa.
No Haitian and no Dominican could take away my work. Because none of them could do what I do. (What could that be?? - It's up to you to guess) But I'm giving work to Dominicans and Haitians. Not much, but something. And I get along very well with both nationalities.
And I'm very pi.... off when I hear some of these hysterical screamers preaching of war against the Devil and talking that the country is full of Haitians like talking of rats. Despiceable!
From: United States
Calvo leon what about the Haityian invasion of ALL of our towns that you don't understand. Back in 2005 there were perhaps 1/2 million Haitians living and working in the country. Today 7 yrs later there are nearly 3million squatting, begging, and employment undermining, resources (hospitals, schools, transportation, food) draining illegal economic refugees in the country. Yea... I would say like rats. These people are in the country illegally. We have had these problems with them before. Their belief is that this country is part of their territory. We are not going to lose our national and cultural identity because of the plight created by these people in their country or because of ignorant to our history NGO's and bleeding hearts.
I am glad to hear you are doing something to better the situation for some but if you really want to help both peoples advocate to your homeland to take in a couple of hundred thousand of these refugees and stop criticizing our legitimate concern
From: United States
Spinach , I understand the need of many Haitians to leave the area of devastation as the whole infrastructure around POP was destroyed by the earthquake. And obviously the DR authorities opened the border to the refugees. My problem is with the hundreds of thousand from the north who were not affected by the earthquake who took advantage and came over also. Let's see how many go back voluntary as things improve within Haiti and how many have an agenda to remain to "claim" the lost territory. Right now most are guests, let's hope they don't wear out their welcome.
Written by: saru2191, 29 Jul 2012 9:20 PM
From: United States, New York
calvoleon, so you have a job which you don't have to be worried about being taken from, that's good to hear. However, That's not the case for many living in the DR legally, including those of Haitian descent.
Written by: saru2191, 29 Jul 2012 11:01 PM
From: United States, New York
I'm an American of Dominican Descent, the child of two Dominicans who came here legally. You failed to see that I have nothing against Haitians living in the Country legally, but that's expected since you're a moron.
Written by: saru2191, 30 Jul 2012 12:44 AM
From: United States, New York
What is an American, SPiNACH? Please, do enlighten us. Is it the whites and blacks who are the descendants of colonists and slaves? Is it the Native Americans? Are the illegal Mexicans currently residing in the US more American because they're closely related to the Natives of North America? Is American a Race? Is it an ethnic group? Or maybe it's just a nationality?
Written by: saru2191, 30 Jul 2012 1:39 AM
From: United States, New York
Wrong answer, stupid. American is a nationality, therefore you can of any race or ethnicity and still be American. Dominican and Haitian are two different ethnic groups. There's a difference between nationality and ethnicity, learn it.
From: Haiti
spinach,my babie.
we ayitians have nothin' to do wit' tainos.
our french masters brought african slaves,ayitian ancestors after spanish population moved
from western side of island.
by then taino population absorbed an' decimated already.
ayitians arrived to party in island about 200 years late.
From: Haiti
creyole have no taino words.
From: Dominican Republic
The Dominicans only are lucky that the earthquake didn't happen here, otherwise they would be the same "begging rats". Only pray that this wouldn't happen here.
From: Haiti
spinach my son,you should be proud of bein' 100% african.
stop your butt kissin'.
we have nothin' to do wit' tainos.
i taught you betta my babie,you worryin' too much
about if dominiken are white,mixed,black or taino.
i want all of my ayitian peeple to come back to ayiti,to heal ayiti an' make it betta.
ayitians too busy smelling dominiken testicles an' we don' get to do poop,because
wew busy looking up to dominiken.
keep yo' head up my son,keep yo' head up.
From: Haiti
calvoleon,have a mud cookie,you sound hungry,time to argile my babie.
From: Dominican Republic
@kiskeyamama or papa or who else, for one last time:
Racism always is wrong. Because what makes one better than the other? It's pure coincidence that one is born in DR, the other in Haiti, the other in USA or Europe. Without any effort of oneself. So what is the merit to be Dominican? Or Haitian?
A Dominican racist is the same dumb a..hole like an American who hates Mexicans, a Russian who hates Chechens, a German who hates Turks, a Spaniard who hates Dominicans or a French who hates Moroccans.
Racism is dumb and stupid - no matter of which national. And the biggest problem is the racist himself, because he is the last to understand.
From: Dominican Republic
@kiskeyamama or papa or who else, for one last time:
Racism always is wrong. Because what makes one better than the other? It's pure coincidence that one is born in DR, the other in Haiti, the other in USA or Europe. Without any effort of oneself. So what is the merit to be Dominican? Or Haitian?
A Dominican racist is the same dumb a..hole like an American who hates Mexicans, a Russian who hates Chechens, a German who hates Turks, a Spaniard who hates Dominicans or a French who hates Moroccans.
Racism is dumb and stupid - no matter of which national. And the biggest problem is the racist himself, because he is the last to understand.
From: Haiti
again,calvoleon my babie,why an ayitian call another ayitian kakadyab?
From: United States
We need 8 more posts to pass the 200 mark of comments.
From: Dominican Republic
tell me, what means kakadyab? I cannot comment something I don't understand
From: United States
@caloleon-Kaka dyab in kreyol mean's devil's shit
It is quite funny when reading how some Haitians who put so much emphasis on racism as if there was no racism in Haiti. Kaka dyab is not only one of the worst insults to make but also racist against dark skinned. Even the darkest person in Haiti would call another kaka dyab (devil shit). So how do Haitians expect a light skin person to behave back in Haiti when most dark Haitians are not proud of their own color?
Many dark Haitians feel like foreigner in their own country, when they can not live in certain areas or attend certain schools. This is a so-called “black country” where most dark people are being mistreated because they are black, poor, low class, uneducated; in another word, the underdogs
Dont complain about racism, when in Haiti most are not being treated as human beings, so don't expect to be treated well even in the DR, where a black Dominican would feel insulted if a Haitian would dare call him Kaka Dyab
From: Dominican Republic
Thanks for the explanation. Of course - kaka and dyab. Some day I'll know Creyol.
Very sad to know all this, but it's only proving that racism is really stupid.
Of course it's stupid when a black says kaka dyab to another. What else? Stupid and sad.
Written by: saru2191, 31 Jul 2012 5:56 PM
From: United States, New York
Is the illegal immigration issue entirely based on racism? It seems some of you feel that way. It's more of a national and economic issue to those against illegal Haitian immigration than anything else. But people just love dishing out the race card, it's the trump card in this game.
From: United States
@saru2191-
A racist base accusation against the DR is the easiest weapon to use, but really the weapon of last resort to enable them to defend what is indefensible or like you say the trump card which they pull straight out of their sleeve.
From: United States
Funny comment on this race thing, actually more sad than funny: on on of my trips to DR back in the late 80's , I was getting a shoe shine. Somehow the conversation turned to Haitian art being sold in the streets of Santo Domingo and tourist thinking it was Dominican art. One of the shoe shine guys was this real dark Dominican, almost purple in color he was so dark, puts on this grimacing face and blurts out " Eto maidito NEGRO Haitiano blah blah blah blah." I don't even remember the rest of his comments, I just remember chuckling at the ignorance and irony of his comments. Spinach, I don't think the contents of your comments qualify to be counted so actually I WIN!!!
Bwa ha ha ha!
From: United States
Thanks Spinach for passing the 200 mark..............!!!!!
Written by: saru2191, 1 Aug 2012 9:01 PM
From: United States, New York
Good job, SPiNACH. Now try to reach the 300 mark.
From: United States
Spinach is trying to win a gold medal for the greatest number of senseless vertical posts.
From: Dominican Republic
What a pity that Dominicans don't like the truth and are offended so easily. They would be such nice people if they weren't such stupid racists! Anyhow, removing a comment they don't like, also shows the tolerance of them. Actions speak louder than words!
Written by: saru2191, 2 Aug 2012 11:18 PM
From: United States, New York
Your true colors are starting to show, calvoleon. You're just another troll, go figure.
Written by: Pepe32, 2 Aug 2012 11:48 PM
From: Dominican Republic
"Do conservatives tend to be less intelligent than liberals? A provocative new study from Brock University in Ontario suggests the answer to both questions may be a qualified yes."
Studies done by liberal leaning institutions can hardly be called "unbiased" and any trip into NYC and its ghettos will quickly prove this idiocy wrong!
Written by: Pepe32, 2 Aug 2012 11:50 PM
From: Dominican Republic
"Japan beats Dominican Republic in Olympic volleyball"
In other news Haiti wins the gold in feces throwing and nation destruction with a silver in head chopping with Iran taking the Gold.
Written by: Pepe32, 2 Aug 2012 11:52 PM
From: Dominican Republic
Are racists dumb?
We know Spinach is a total idiot
From: Dominican Republic
@saru2191. My true color always can be seen clearly: ANTI-IDIOT
And the racist for me always is the biggest idiot, no matter of his nationality or color. And worse if he comes dressed as a clergy-man who should preach peace instead of hatred.
And even you won't believe it: I love Dominicans! In general, as long as they don't talk about Haitians.
Like last night when I went home in a bus and like always the topic sooner or later comes to Haitians, as if there was no other topic - and one of the Dominican idiots said: put them a tire around the neck and set them ablaze!
Please, are those people humans?
My girlfriend is Haitian - much whiter than most of my Dominican neighbors. I never had any troubles with anybody, but since she is living in my house, hardly anybody greets me when we pass together, isn't that idiotic? Explain me, if you think it's not!
Written by: saru2191, 3 Aug 2012 6:10 PM
From: United States, New York
Could you be anymore obvious, calvoleon? Bow out, you're making a fool of yourself.
From: Dominican Republic
@saru... I know it's useless to try to convince racists. They are the same blind idiots as nazis, communists etc. But obviously that's how most people are, and that's why the world is like it is.
From: United States
240 post thus far and counting. Keep up the good work.....!!!!
Written by: airgordo, 11 Aug 2012 11:30 AM
From: Dominican Republic
@ calvoleon, 3 Aug 2012 2:02 PM
My girlfriend is Haitian - much whiter than most of my Dominican neighbors. I never had any troubles with anybody, but since she is living in my house, hardly anybody greets me when we pass together, isn't that idiotic? Explain me, if you think it's not!
---
1- the NECK thing is something VERY POPULAR to execute people on Haiti whenever they have one of their usual political disgraces, there are couple of VIDEOS on the net, that show exactly that, on this side we have never used that kind of things.
2- So if people don't greet you, then they are RACIST...nice conclusion! LOL, try greeting people FIRST instead of wait to be greeted like if you were from the royalty, that's what i do.
3- What exist here against Haitians might be called DISCRIMINATION , not racism, becase the Bad feelings that some people have against them, ARE NOT BASED ON RACE, are based on NATIONALITY, their main problem is not they are black, is that they are ILLEGAL Hatians.
From: United States
@airgordo-There you GO......!!!!
Thank you very much for your last post and bringing light to the Haitian issue
I really hate when people pull the race card against us, because it is the only defense they think they have, when in fact it is no defense at all. Dominicans are not racists and it is ludicrous to accuse us of racism particularly when the majority of our population are people of color
I am at times accused of being a racist because of my stance with regards to undocumented Haitians, until they see the charitable and humanitarian work I have done and continue to do to do to favor Haiti. What is wrong is wrong and I am not about to penalize one group to favor another. But on the other side of the coin, what is right is right, if an undocumented needs my help I will never refuse to give a hand but not at some one else's expense
I just do not understand what exactly people want Dominicans to do, commit suicide? We have done our fair share, but enough is enough !
Written by: airgordo, 12 Aug 2012 1:29 PM
From: Dominican Republic
@guillermone
That Race card is just like you stated, a last resource! now when people begin writing all that BullSh!t about DR being close to NAZI Germany or the Deep South of USA, and average Dominican People being racist, i present them with Two names and ask for a rational explanation on how these two individuals could have made it on a "Racist" country like they portray, the names are Ulises Heraux and Jose Francisco Penia Gomez, as you would imagine that is pretty much the end of the debate!!! BOTH were loved by thousands at a certain point, and specially Penia Gomez IS the biggest Mass leader the DR has ever had, so HOW a racist country could have embrace a son of Haitians like they did with that man??
From: United States
EXCELLENT !!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
Thank you again airgordo, Thank you so much.........!!!!!
You shut them right up. Now I want to see what they have to say now.
From: Dominican Republic
splitting hair is always the last prevarication if you don't have arguments left. Racism, nationalism, all the same crap. Haitians are human beings like Dominicans and anybody else. If they are here, it's because you let them in.
I don't know, how many times I wrote, that it's the fault of the Dominican corrupt officials that let in ANY Haitian, even without a passport, when they pay him. That's the reason why there are so many.
And airgordo: if the neighbors greet me first, and when I have a Haitian woman they don't greet any more - what is that then?? If not racism it's stupidity. And if I greet someone three times and he doesn't answer me, he doesn't exist fore me. I'm not even angry for those kind of uneducated idiots.
And now I heard another nice thing. In Sosúa, the motoconcho drivers have to wear an ID-card now. The problem is, the Haitians, even legally here, don't get one. So what will they do???? Think!
From: United States
Calvoleon what are you suggesting, that we give Haitians ID cards to drive when they shouldn't even be in the country? That's like the US govt giving driver's licences to illegal Mexicans. Tough s**t if they can't drive motoconchos. That is less of a chance they will be transporting their illegal brethren further into Dominican territory. This law should be nationwide, not just in Sosua.
And to put an end to this racism bullshit, let me lay out so that you simple minded bleeding hearts Haitian lovers can understand where a Dominican with no malice in his heart YET towards Haitians feels about this massive illegal immigration to my country. If there are 3+ million Haitians in my country, I can guarantee you that 2.75 million of them are men. Who the HELL do you think they are going to try to relieve their sexual desires (to be polite) if not our women? If they were 2.75 million Scandinavians do you think we would be happy to have them F**k our women? I want at least 2 mil gone
From: United States
Cont.
And as far as it is our " fault for letting them in", the first few 100,000 were let in as a humanitarian and brotherly gesture on our part to provide them with an outlet to escape the devastation of the Earthquake in the south, in and around Port au Prince. But Haitians that they are you give them a foot and they take a MILE. Everybody and their brothers came from ALL OVER Haiti whether they were affected by the quake or not. When our government tried to deport them they and the hypocritical bleeding hearts started yelling RACISM and taking the DR to international courts for violating their civil rights as if they had any in OUR country to begin with. Add to this clusterf@ck the corrupt border guards and we arrive to where we are now, innundated with millions of illegal, illiterate single men sh*tting and pissing in people's backyards and rooftops. Calvo FRAK you if you don't understand our dilemna and want to accuse an entire nation of mostly colored people of racism.
Written by: Pepe32, 13 Aug 2012 6:40 PM
From: Dominican Republic
" I want at least 2 mil gone" I think more like 2.7 Million and keep the best ones ..
Written by: airgordo, 14 Aug 2012 12:25 AM
From: Dominican Republic
@ calvoleon
YOU are accusing the Dominican PEOPLE, not an INDIVIDUAL of being RACIST, now i ask again the same, HOW a RACIST country like the one YOU portraid could have embraced, Voted and supported, CRIED and LOVED SONS of HAITIANS like Jose Francisco Penia Gomez, HOW CAN YOU RATIONALLY EXPLAIN that on a racist country like the one on your head?? , google is your best friend to find out about this man, there are HUNDREDS of Photos and Videos from his Rallies with the PRD party, google a Photo of His Burial and see for yourself KILOMETERS of people on the streets, ALL THAT FOR A FULL HAITIAN BLOODED BLACK MAN!! you can Chose More! like Ulises Hereaux
I WILL sit and wait here for your response, i WILL be waiting for you to show me a case of a MULATTO or a WHITE person shown that kind of Love ON HAITI, I will be waiting for you to show ANY RACIST COUNTRY doing the same we did here with this man, or would it be that we are NOT racist after all?...
Smaller
Bigger
Close Gallery
Facebook
Digg this
del.icio.us
Technorati
Yahoo
DR can and should continue to help Haiti BUT NOT at the expense of creating the same conditions that are driving massive numbers away from Haiti to gain a foothold in DR! Where and how will DR house feed and provide education and health to so many illegals? DR can't even manage that for its own people!
The international Community has to be made to understand that this massive unchecked flow of poverty dumping from Haiti into DR will only create conditions for BOTH sides of the island to align in both poverty and massive negative dislocations. The quality of life in DR does not improve by having massive numbers of poorer humanity swarming the already meager offerings that DR provides for its own poorest.
Adding huge numbers of desperately poorer humanity into the domestic mix isn't wise nor prudent policy for DR.
Why is that so hard for DR to explain?
Dominicans should have SSL (Spanish as Second Language) classes for the Hatians in school.
Whats that? Dominicans should not have to learn Creole? You mean you don't want your tax dollars subsidizing illegal children in school? In hospital payments?
I guess it's ok when illegal Dominicans do the same in the US.
Let's not create a second Haiti on the eastern side of the island. One is more than enough. Haitians need VISAS to first world lands as these visas hold the greatest and fastest turnaround for a people to gain a firm and prosperous future for themselves and their future generations. Also, these foreign lands provide the means to extend opportunities from financial help and investments from aboard via transfers.
International Community: step up to the plate!
Yes, there is a problem of unregulated crossings and it should be placed upon the shoulders of the government to stem the flow.
The flip side of this crisis there are many undocumented people of Haitian heritage, born and raised in the DR, who have contributed to its society are now in crisis fearing to be "repatriated" to a country they do not know. The gov't does not give a heck about them, they are just a number to be reported. The moral solution is for these people is to remain to continue to contribute.
Now, there are going to be some posters who out of their own xenophobic beliefs will blame the Haitians for all bad doings under the tropical sun and as such, they, meaning the Haitians, should return back to the foul earth of Haiti. I lament for people who suffer these beliefs. I have seen those who suffer misfortune. I too may have suffered a similar fate, but for God's roll of the dice it is otherwise.......
Some people are very confused. Some people THINK that DR is as rich and powerful as the USA! LOL
Leaves those dreams to puffin' sections with your creative blunt concoctions. LOL
DR did not create the conditions in Haiti. Thus, DR has NO responsibility, other than as another member of the international community interested in helping Haiti. The burden of Haiti needs to be shared BY THE INTERNATIONAL COMMUNITY.
Unless you want an island wide "Haitianization" with all the negative attributes that implies, we should be talking about how best the INTERNATIONAL COMMUNITY OF NATIONS can help turn the table on this long festering problem. The Haitian Question needs an international solution.
The Dominican Republic is NOT the solution to Haiti's problems.
The Dominican Republic is NOT the solution to Haiti's problems.
The Dominican Republic is NOT the solution to Haiti's problems.
The Dominican Republic is NOT the solution to Haiti's problems.
The Dominican Republic is NOT the solution to Haiti's problems.
The Dominican Republic is NOT the solution to Haiti's problems.
The Dominican Republic is NOT the solution to Haiti's problems.
The Dominican Republic is NOT the solution to Haiti's problems.
The Dominican Republic is NOT the solution to Haiti's problems.
The Dominican Republic is NOT the solution to Haiti's problems.
The Dominican Republic is NOT the solution to Haiti's problems.
The Dominican Republic is NOT the solution to Haiti's problems.
The Dominican Republic is NOT the solution to Haiti's problems.
EU should 'undermine national homogeneity' says UN migration chief
By Brian Wheeler
Political reporter, BBC News
Peter Sutherland's global migration forum brings together 160 nations to discuss policy."
How about providing some help to our Haitian brothers and sisters in need Europe?
Haitians will surely help de-homogenize the societies in Europe.
pronto!
Second of all ,how many Haitians will you take in your home?
Thirdly most Dominicans are in the US LEGALLY and those that aren't are subject to deportation as it is the US's SOVEREIGN right to maintain its territorial integrity and to determine who enters or doesn't enter .Haitians should be assisted in Haiti but they have absolutely no RIGHT to enter as they wish and the DR being a poor nation has every right to deport them .That is called JUSTICE and rule of law not the chaos that will ensue if the Haitians continue unimpeded in their stampede across the border.
DR has very little time to act ,because the situation is getting to a point that their will be a social explosion and of course DR will be blamed by the hypocrites who appeased the invaders.
From: United States
The Dominican Republic should take the policy of the US. Start printing forms in Creole. Allow the illegal Haitians to have government assistance. Allow illegal Haitians to enroll in school. Give the illegal Haitians a path to citizenship.
Dominicans should have SSL (Spanish as Second Language) classes for the Hatians in school.
Whats that? Dominicans should not have to learn Creole? You mean you don't want your tax dollars subsidizing illegal children in school? In hospital payments?
I guess it's ok when illegal Dominicans do the same in the US.
====
and EXACTLY how many ILLEGAL Dominicas do you think are on US??? please explain here exactly HOW an illegal Domincan reach the US because they don't go there SWIMMING do they? and even MORE, HOW is it a PATH to citiznship offered on US?? i will wait on your response before categorizing you as an Ignorant on what you post...
Good question Airgordo. I know people in the USA living without the proper documaents for more than 15 years, and they're still looking for " the path to citizenship".
From: United States
Do you have the stats to backup this claim "Thirdly most Dominicans are in the US LEGALLY". jajaja In Puerto Rico alone there is over 200000 illegal Dominicans not to count the Triboro . (QBM +B). You must be kidding. Have you been in the Bronx and Manhattan? I know you've been. Do not hide your first impression, it is always the right one.
===
Don't they get DEPORTED?? Answer Please...do you see any dominican on this site or on the press complaining about deportation of ILLEGALS??? Answer Please...IT is a FACT that the VAST majority of Dominicans are In fact on LEGAL status, WHY?
Because This is a FREAKING ISLAND!! NOT MEXICO! we HAVE to have documentation to get OUT, EVEN if you make to Puerto Rico by Boat, Puerto Rico is ALSO A FREAKING ISLAND!! and they check ALL from you when you try to get to US mainland!! so please don't write stupidities where people that actually know how this goes can read it...
Written by: Adamo123,
From: United States
Do you have the stats to backup this claim "Thirdly most Dominicans are in the US LEGALLY". jajaja In Puerto Rico alone there is over 200000 illegal Dominicans not to count the Triboro ."
Perhaps you haven't paid too much attention but Puerto Ricans and Dominicans share a common language, culture and I've yet to witness in PR massive numbers of Dominican children being used as street beggars. In fact, I'v never actually witnessed any Dominican child doing so, and I've been travaling to PR for more than 30 years.
Perhaps we should send the word-has it already been addressed by the recent boat full of Haitians across the Mona Passage?-that unlike Bad DR, PR is open to Haitians seeking opportunities.
How'd like that idea?
From: Dominican Republic
@pepe dominicans enter in haiti as tell please and they dont need any visa. second do you know how many dominican republica work in haiti. please follow your own rule. when you start buying visa to go to haiti then haiti will"
You are confusing yourself. It does not matter that Dominicans work in Haiti or go to Haiti.
What matters is WHAT DOMINICANS DO IN HAITI.
Are Dominicans sending to Haiti poverty stricken people that put enormous pressure on the Haitian government to provide Health, housing, educational and other services?
Are Dominicans that go to Haiti causing Haiti's population of poor people to explode?
Are Dominicans going to Haiti trying to deny they are Dominicans in order to try and pass as Haitians and engage in Identification theft?
Are Dominicans sending loads of pregnant women into Haiti to be born in Haiti?
????
Written by: , 25 Jun 2012 3:06 PM
From: United States
Even though we share a common language, I bet the vast majority of Puerto Ricans don't like the idea of 250k Dominicans on their island, legal or not."
And what would they say to having say another 250,000 Haitians?
Why is it NOT resonable for Europeans and other wealthy areas to help out by providing VISAS for Haitians to uplift themselves?
If the United Nations thinks Europeans have to become LESS HOMOGENIOUS, then why not add some Haitian into the pot?
Haiti was and is their creation after all.
We need a balance in the world, every one can't be a doctor, a nurse, or a lawyer. It is a vocational choice, understand. So people choose from a multitude of options available to them and I am not condoning those choices. Guess what....the haitians choose to beg but the dominican women turn into prostitution in DR and elsewhere instead of begging. Depending of one moral's ethics you will determine which one is the best option. To me both are degrading. By the way, back in 2008/07 you were awarded number 4 in te world sex market, it is a plus. It seems that you are not keeping up with the Dominican Today, just last month a Dominican boat capsized or were apprehended along the shores of Puerto Rico too. Is 'Sailing' becoming the hobby or the favorite sport of the Dominicans now. e e e e. One is a known beggar the other is known for providing high class 'Puta' prostitution. How about that?
Adamo123
The sex trade has a long tradition and Puerto Rican women have also provided rich terrain for horny men to engage their desires. Since you live in the USA and live in NYC remember Down These Mean Streets by Piri Thomas. That classic of inner city life should ring a bell or two in yea.
What we Dominicans seek is a JUST BALANCING of responsibity from the International Community. That's all. Haiti's problems and troubles WERE NOT CREATED IN DR. The shi*hole it has unfortunatedly become was due to foreign, ie., European and American refusal to trade and do business with her, French reparations that consumed a vast amount of her annual earnings and her own ineptitude in providing for a viable NATION-STATE.
If Haitians are people just like any other in the world, why should the RICH world NOT take in more of her looooooooooong suffering people? I mean, even the UN agrees that Europe has to become less homogeneous. LOL
Most or the majority of Dominicans living in Hait are working for the entertainment insdustry there. They are not smart like you in order to help out in "Health, housing, educational and other services" . Name a few that you know are working in any of those fields in Haiti. But I can pinpoint you where you can find at least 200 of dominicans at least. Believe me when they return back home they do get a homecoming due or similar to a war heroe or serviceman
Let's trade. We take back ALL the Dominican prostitutes in Haiti and Haiti can take back all the destitutes and poverty stricken people its dumping on DR.
------------
Both nations BENEFIT from having an exchange of goods and services-labor being one important aspect of the exchange. BUT what we find enormously troublesome is this continuing flow that has the feel of a mass povetty dump into our land. Can you imagine what Puerto Ricans, I not sure if you are, would say if Dominicans were swarming into small towns and setting up camp along riverbanks and sending forth their children to beg, steal or whatever to make a buck? And then have organizations and people defend their right to live in PR? Puerto Ricans would be up in arms and the political leadership would have to answer for the mess.
Just point at a single country in the Western Hemisphere that does not have prostitution?...Show me a single nationality?
What is the percentage of Haitians that engage into prostitution in the DR?...Prostitution is as old as the bible. Look in the web how many of the prostitutes that you see are Dominican?...What nationalities are they?
Show me sources to support your claim that DR has higher percentage of prostitutes per capita?
Opiniones sin fundamento.
I have been saying for the longest that we will never come to an agreement with Haitians and that we should do what is in OUR best interests and F the Haitians because if we allow them they will destroy our country just like the latrine they have created in the west. Atabay you are too nice in putting all the blame on others for Haiti's problems because the main problem in Haiti and on this island is the Haitians themselves yet they prefer to spit on us like adamo and then expect that we will receive them with open arms.
!!Que se vayan al mismo infierno o que se queden en Haiti que es peor!!!
Check this out ,
Read the Dominican Today and you will find it :
Article date : April 24, 2008 .....
Title : Dominican women rank 4th in world sex market
dominicantoday.com/dr/local/2008/4/24/27752/Dominican-women-rank-4th-in-world-sex-market
I removed the 3w's and the http to allow sending
You can't help Adamo, and your arms aren't big enough to help others. When you say we, do you count yourself in. Don't you need help yourself.
Talking of "latrine", by reading your post I can smell one.
But Piri's days were way tougher than any I experienced in NYC growing up.
I too met Thomas back 8 or so years ago.
But in all honesty Pedrin, I beg to differ that it's the same. While it's true that PR has something like 200-250 K Dominicans, the numbers in DR from Haiti are staggering and continue afoot with no discernable easing. And there is a GREAT DIFFERANCE in people moving about your country with extreme poverty and all that entails for your homeland. I've yet to see Dominican children in groups roaming the streets of the towns and cities of PR begging for a few coins. Think having boatloads of pregnant Dominican women wouldn't raise alarm bells in PR?
Illegal Immigrant Deportations by the Numbers
By Paul Bedard
September 6, 2011
For all the grief President Obama has taken over his immigration policy—Republicans say he's a wimp, Democrats say he's not compassionate enough—one fact has emerged during his term so far. He's deported about 18 percent more illegal immigrants than former President George W. Bush did in his last two years in office. And he's on par to have given the boot to nearly 1.5 million immigrants by the time this term is done."
So Obama term in office might very well see his Administration deport nearly 1.5 million people! More than George Bush did IN TWO TERMS IN OFFICE!
And there's is BIG differance with someone gaining VISA into a nation and those that simply walk across the border. The first ones are in the nation illegally from overstaying their VISAS, the second group willfully gained entry into the country and are thus violators of the first order: they never had permission to enter.
So long as you are busy fighting each other, the Europeans, savy Dominicans and my fellow Americans will continue to steal everything from DR and manipulate resources until all is exhausted.
...and who says we have the same blood, are we 100% African? NO. You know something, this color thing doesn't matter, as much as you wanna pull the race card you are WRONG.
Dominicans with light skin believe they descend from these same Europeans. Truth is, all Dominicans and Haitians share the same blood and descend from the same people
Nothing can be further from the truth, if someone is light skin, with straight hair, how can that person be 100% African, ARE YOU DUMB OR SOMETHING, not every Dominican looks like a Baseball player son, both my parents are 3rd generation Spaniard.
Au Contraire,
While many have similar background, due in great part to the invasions from the west, many Dominicans have significant differances from their average counterpart in Haiti. Many in Haiti have never gotten over their nations inability to control the entire island after invading the Spanish speaking part in 1821.Even small nations driven by revolutionary fevor can and do practice imperialism. The Haitians used the pretext of eliminating slavery and possible European invasions from the east to extend their land grab of the Spanish speaking part of Hispaniola. The Spanish part of the island had developed a very racially tolerant society by the standards of the day.
This poverty dumping by Haiti is the issue. All sensible people understand that both countries have a lot to gain from mutually supporting policies that increase their prosperity.
2) Sneak on US bound cruise ship in cargo hold using known smugglers.
3)K -1/3 visa fraud. They find a sucker get married, stay around until the conditional residency is final then file for divorce or separate.
These scams and methods occur every day. To recognize the game is not being ignorant. Dominicans thinking they are better than Haitians is ignorant because the only reason The Dominican Republic has more is due to the fact Europeans and American were able to exploit your beaches and natural resources via foreign ownership. Foreign ownership,is something the Haitian constitution forbids.
At the expence of the Haitians hungry stomach?
Wao, that's one of the dumbest things I ever heard.
China is buying trillions of Dollars of US debt, how do you explain that one Einstein.
If the NEW Constitution is any guide, this law has been amended and EVEN Haitians born elsewhere can now participate more boardly in the political, commercial and business spheres.
Correct Don't Be Silent, THIS IS NOT about Race!
Quality of life and poverty dumping are the REAL issues.
The library is free you should use it.
Now to your point if it is a good policy that I would agree however you you read the history of Haiti in the early years you will see why. The sugar industry owned DR and Cuba. In fact the only reason DR has major roads and railways, exempt the Metro, is because of the sugar industry.
Haiti does not want to be owned by foreigners hence the language in the constitution.
"Haiti does not want to be owned by foreigners hence the language in the constitution."
LOL!
I guess that's why it CAN FEED ITSELF and DOESN'T NEED MASSIVE HELP!
Talk about needing history and economic lessons!!
of all the immigrants in the US.
They work off the tax rolls. Without these illegals companies would have to hire Dominicans and as we all know, Dominicans don't want to work unless it is for the government where they have a license to steal.
There is no difference for the two ended up being illegals at some point in their life and illegal has only one spelling 'ILLEGAL' . Does the ended up being illegal who enters lawfully receives a better treatment than the other illegal while facing a deportation judge.
In your world, it seems that one is written with capital letters and the other with small ones.
From: United States
Dear Atabey :
There is no difference for the two ended up being illegals at some point in their life and illegal has only one spelling 'ILLEGAL' . Does the ended up being illegal who enters lawfully receives a better treatment than the other illegal while facing a deportation judge.
In your world, it seems that one is written with capital letters and the other with small ones."
Not so. And you should take a legal course or two before saying they are the same.
As for the REAL ISSUES. Quality of life and Poverty dumping are the main ones. Both put enormous pressures on the DR. The international Community needs to step in and offer these poor haitians options besides defending their movement eastward on the island.
--------------------
BTW, NYGuy35 , long BEFORE any Dictator Trujillo ruled the DR, Haitian military people were doing their own Cortes. LOL Just ask some CibaeNos in Santiago and Moca.
So come again with RACISM being the reason for this problem. If anything, the problem of race had its problematical turmoil and development in HAITI. The DR had developed or evolved an extremely mixed racial society before the invasions from Haiti. And since Sugar plantation farming was not the engine of growth, animal farming, especially cattle ranching, was on the Spanish speaking part of the island, the invasions from the west actually formented racial tentions that under no pressure from the west may well have evolved into one harmonious and better atuned racial understanding in the coming republican era. But such designs went down with the Haitian invasions
Dominicans and Haitian come from same blood as you said, but let's keep the French speaking Africans with darker skin on one side and the Spanish Speaking Africans with a little lighter skin on the other side and we will live like happy neighbors. We are not talking about race here, but numbers 10% - 15% illegal and uneducated immigrants in a country is a problem regardless of the color of those immigrants.
I find black people to be fixated on race all the time.
Haitians have no Taino blood- 40- 60% of Dominicans do.
Haitians have no Spanish blood, nor do they have much french blood since their great hero desalines killed off the white french colonists during their revolution.
The African component of our makeup is 500 to 400 yrs old and mixed with Taino and European. Yours is 300- 200 yrs not necesarally from the same african peoples. Your African blood is the last and least part of our makeup. (Other than the forced breeding during the 24 years of occupation there hasn't been too many mixing between us until recently).
You have not been good political neighbors to us and thus our resentment and suspicions towards you. Two centuries ago your ancestors tried force intergration on us by force of arms and made things bad between us. Now you are trying to get the international community to back your permanence in our lands, calling us racists to garner sympathy. This will backfire. No peoples like to be forced into a union. We fought you back then and if pushed into a corner we will fight you again as well as your hypocritical UN backers.
Read some history. It's never too late.
" And you should take a legal course or two before saying they are the same."
Not really, I was fortunate to receive a BS in engineering and my MBA at one of the prestigious Ivy League Schools. Needless to tell you that life has been good to me so far. I live it worries free.
"Adamo if you smell a latrine perhaps you should close your mouth or go far from Haiti.."
Far from Haiti and closer to where you are ....Do I really need to do that if that smell is derived from your writing.....I will not waste my time in this forum replying to your nonsense blog. Out of some thousand posts I have read so far here, yours always lack of substance and value. Go back and read your posts here and outside of this forum to see if there are of any value. Your language speaks for itself and your personality.
I never played the racecard in my life...for where ever I go I am welcome for I have what it takes to get accepted into our society.. I don't give a damn about your genetic make up, accomplishments are more important to me in life. I tried to direct people to the right track when I voiced my opinons on the "same blood comment". Recently, there was an article on DominicanToday or elsewhere (don't recall) about the make up of the DR population. I do not recall the exact percentage though somewhere aroud 70% mulatto, the whites in the teen % and the blacks make up the difference. Though a mulatto is perceived to be .....see the next post
That article did not refer to Dominicans as Tainos. Feel free to be whoever you want to be if that will facilitate acceptance. Do I care....ooooops! Tainos, mulattos, whites...whaetever.
Hence the mixture of African blood.
"To the dude who keeps bringing up that DR is 4th "
Here is why!
Atabey wrote/asked :
"What matters is WHAT DOMINICANS DO IN HAITI."
My reply was a direct and an honest answer to that, somebody else expanded it, another intejected, I then referred them to the source of my info. To sum it all we were talking about what haitians are bringing to the table besides begging and the negativity surrounding their presence in DR, which led to name calling and attributes and so forth . I did not want you guys to ignore that both nations have their own dilemma to deal with and that they need to keep eyes on this one. Can't close eyes on it if they value their beloved country so much. I do not think it is a good thing either. Someone else may disagree with me, you might disagree with that but this is my personal opinion. I am from the old school.
en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ta%C3%ADno
wordiq.com/definition/Mulatto
The DR was attacked 5 times within a 55 year period by the Haitians. Even the most Christlike person would harbor some resentment against such a people and would make sure their children and grandchildren learn that history. That is all it is. Yes its been over 100 years but the attrocity committed by these Haitian ancestors have not faded from memory. My own family members fought the invaders in four of these conflicts and passed on the stories of how they would find the beaten and raped bodies of DR women as they chased the Haitians back home
Espinaca all I ever read from you is insults and innuendos. You don't offer solutions or words of reconciliation. WE DID NOT START WARS WITH YOU. YOU CAME TO F*#k WITH US. Until you people own up to your ancestor's actions against us as the real reason there is bad blood between us, not racism, we will never agree. And by the way there is NO REASON in the world for which I would condone rape. That is a sick mentality.
I said all over my posts here and elswhere that DR as a sovereign nation has the rights to protect its land/borders and control the influx of immigrants, but that has to happen with tact and diplomacy .Some of the bloggers here sometimes took the opportunity to dog Haiti as a nation for its misfortune, not really providing a real answer to the issue at hands. I tried to be neutral in this forum but at times I had to take a stand, for the Haitins are not stepping up to the plate to plead their cause.
:-)
Hi Ven, did you know that Trujilio ( not sure about the spelling) less than a century ago ordered the killing of about 50K haitians living in DR. Should our world be prepared to see another one like this again. The way this is going, where too many are fed up and not want to put up with it going forwards.Looks like if we ever see again a deranged president in power in DR, the likelihood of this happening will not be zero. Your thoughts!
!!Vete al mismísimo carajo (o si prefieres a Haití piti de mierda)!!
dominicantoday.com/dr/economy/2012/6/26/44170/Talk-of-closing-US20B-per-year-border-market-worries-agro-leader
Did you know that guys? Who do you think would benefit most from the US 2 Billons?
Please read the DominicanToday daily newsletter of today!
That Haitian uncle gave his life along with other family members fighting for Dominican sovereignty in the revolution of 1965 when the marines again invaded our lands.
Thanks for sharing your history with us! I am sure there were/are Humble Dominicans out there with a good heart. This is a story to remember. Let's just hope that history does not repeat itself. So one should try to extinct not to ignite the fire for the tensions are mounting and mounting now to a high it has never reached before.
Though both sides are violent and raping women. I followed most of those stories.
"Two Haitians get 20 years in prison for rape of US missionary"
Here is the link below
dominicantoday.com/dr/local/2012/6/26/44175/Two-Haitians-get-20-years-in-prison-for-rape-of-US-missionary
Trading of insults. Or is that all you have to offer as a solution to our mutual problems? What do you think should be done to remedy the tensions building up due to the unrestrained flow of refugees to the eastern part? Or for that matter the situation of the offsprings of Haitian workers born in DR?
Que viva Los Trinitarios!
What we observe is that 20%-25% of the Dominican population is composed of undocumented Haitians. That means out of every 4 or 5 natives, 1 is Haitian. If we think about this for a minute, these numbers are extremely alarming and leave us no choice but to throw the "humanitarian" factor out the window. The bottom line and it all boils down to them vs us. I am not about to sacrifice my life and family to save a stranger. It is every man for himself. It is sad and unfortunate, but there aint enough resources to go around. "No hay cama pa tanta gente."
And this is not just about scarcity of resources, it is potentially dangerous for the DR
When politically correct and culturally diverse societies agree to 'the reasonable' of Haitian demands for their rights,' they also get the other components under the table. Which is Ok and acceptable as long as the Haitian population remains at around 1% and will be regarded as a peace-loving and hard working minority and not a threat to anyone. (continued)
percentage of the population. They will push for greater demands for social services such as food, health, education and the easing of requirements for the legalization of their legal status. Pro-Haitian organizations will increase pressure on the Dominican state to succumb to those demands. and will penalize them with threats for failure to comply.
At this point, they will work to get the ruling government to allow them to remain and legalize their status. Perhaps if their numbers become large enough, they will eventually request autonomy to rule themselves. When Haitians reach 10% of the population, we have noticed an increase in lawlessness as a means of complaint about their conditions.
What I have stated are only potentially possible, future case scenarios of what can occur if we do not control the flow of Haitians into Dominican territory. It has nothing to do with racism, love or hate of the Haitian people. This has to do with nationaliam, saving the the DR, keeping order, preserving the peace and alive the cultural integrity of our country.
Veremos que hace Danilo para remediar este afrentamiento a nuestra soberenidad. Si no se le pone fuerte a estos invasores y su adulones internacional en estos 4 anos vamos a tener tremendo pleito para remediar la situacion. Solamente hay que notar su comportamiento altanero para realizar cuales son sus intenciones: quedarse a este lado. O tenemos un pequeno plieto ahora o tendremos guerra civil en el cercano futuro. Le doy 10 anos de plazo. Despierten pueblo Dominicano!
Y al ejercito que se prepare!
During the month of August in 1956, the Chinese govt pushed for a vigorous propaganda in support mass birth control efforts. These efforts, however, had little impact on fertility. After the interval of the Great Leap Forward, Chinese leaders again saw rapid population growth as an obstacle to development, and their interest in birth control revived.
Population growth targets were set for Chinese families. In the mid-1970s the maximum recommended family size was two children in cities and three or four in the country. Since 1979 the government has advocated a one child limit for both rural and urban areas and has generally set a maximum of two children in special circumstances.
It worked & today China is fast becoming a world superpower. Why because of foresight.
Why?
Haitians come here to WORK - a strange word for many Dominicans.
Illegal Haitians pay a lot of money to MANY corrupt Dominican officials along the way.
Just ask ANY illegal Haitian how he could enter this country - even without a passport. Just ask them.
It's a million peso (or even dollars) business - but not for the Haitians!
And ask the legal Haitians how much they have to pay to enter LEGALLY here. And then ask, how much a Dominican has to pay to get a visa for a European country for example!
DESPIERTEN PUEBLO MIO! Esto es una invacion pacifica pero una invacion comoquierra.
But it's soooo boring to hear these people complain every day about the illegal Haitians. - WHO LETS THEM IN ???? All the corrupt DOMINICAN police along the way that get "bakshish" of all the busses full with indocumented people looking for a better future.
Who needs the Haitians to EXPLOIT them as CHEAP WORKERS? - many times working under conditions that in other countries the boss would go to jail immediately. Aren't that DOMINICAN companies?
SO STOP WHINING! Control your borders - it's only 340 ridiculous kilometers!
And somethging else to this strange priest: Isn't the word of God peace - and not hatred?
And yet another thing is to deny citizenship to people who came here in the time of Trujillo, gave their whole life for the benefit of the sugar industry and now their children who are born here 20, 30 years ago and never even have been in Haiti are denied their papers.
I'm not Haitian, but European. Be sure that DR is closely watched in this matter & the sympathies are not on your side
My heart bleeds for the plight of probably a few thousand children of undocumented who have been denied a right to a nationality. However, before passing judgement, one must know and be aware, the Haitian consitution dictates any child born of Haitians parents can be given citizenship regardless of birth place. Therefore, they do have a right to legal papers, all they have to do is apply. The Rep of Haiti will give it to them, if they go to the Haitian Embassy or consulate and it shall be granted. Once complete, proceed on to residency and naturalization.
Meanwhile, if the DR grants nationality, it will establish a legal precedent and then we will be screwed, flooded with Haitians with no end in sight
From: Dominican Republic
venganzaderafael: Of course I understand that the Haitian immigration is a big problem. And of course I agree that DR cannot solve the problems of the neighboring country. But as I wrote already, it's your own corrupt officials who let enter all the illegals for very good money. And when they deport them, they rip them off again. You have to face THAT truth. It cannot be that difficult to control this ridiculously short border. Of course it's not right when pregnant women come here to give birth to get Dominican citizenship for their kids. But it's the same thing that Dominicans etc. do in the U.S.!
----
FEW Dominicans that have a US visa and can support themselves for at least Three months on the US, How many Dominicans do you think fill that profile? did you know a Pregnant Woman will not be allowed to FLY past the 7 months? how do you think they get to US then, Swimming? PLEASE don't compare!!
From: United States
My heart bleeds for the plight of probably a few thousand children of undocumented who have been denied a right to a nationality. However, before passing judgement, one must know and be aware, the Haitian consitution dictates any child born of Haitians parents can be given citizenship regardless of birth place. Therefore, they do have a right to legal papers, all they have to do is apply. The Rep of Haiti will give it to them, if they go to the Haitian Embassy or consulate and it shall be granted. Once complete, proceed on to residency and naturalization.
Meanwhile, if the DR grants nationality, it will establish a legal precedent and then we will be screwed, flooded with Haitians with no end in sight.
---
They CAN'T apply because they don't exist ANYWHERE, the Haitian Goverment DOES NOT DOCUMENT it's own people!! in the past i read a figure of 40% of the Haitians population are UNDOCUMENTED!! just throw it to DR
It is an IGNORANT, EVIL AND RIDICULOUS ACT to even dare to compare the Haitian immigration to DR with ANYTHING else on this hemisphere!! I will not get tired of Writing here that Domincans that EMIGRATE do it on a LEGAL STATUS on the vast majority, because THIS IS A F@CKING ISLAND!! SEA every where!! and even those that BREAK THE LAW and go it illegally elsewhere AT LEAST EXIST, they have a NAME, they have a PASSPORT, you can track their criminal record, you can track the Hospital RECORD, THEY FREAKING EXIST on their COUNTRY!! now compare that to people that don't have ANYTHING!
Occasionally I have been in Villa Hermosa in La Romana - something like a Little Haiti - on 26 of January - Duarte Day. What I saw nearly broke my heart. Dozens of black children, easy to recognize as Haitian descendants, with worn out uniforms, and none of them overweight like most of the Dominican kids in better areas, were marching with Doninican flags, drawn by themselves, singing the Dominican national anthem - not knowing that nobody here wants to know about them.
In La Romana I know young people, intelligent and eager to study. But they have to work as motoconcho drivers or doing some low works in the sugar industry.
@calvoleon-God...........!!!!
It really hurts to read what you just wrote. It breaks my heart, believe me. But what can you do ?
It is a tough spot we Dominicans find ourselves in. This reminds me of a story of two drowing people struggling to keep themselves alive and to avoid dying, attempt to gasp a last breath of fresh air but only swollow water to further reduce the likelyhood for survival.
Unfortunately there is only a single life vest to save just one life and one of the two people happens to be a very close family member. How will you react ? Which of the two will you throw the life vest to ?
Since YOU are writing stuff I NEVER SAID, like that stupidity of Blaming others and denying some women perform HUMAN DUMPING, You SHOULD then learn to read First then Post, NOT BACKWARDS, so cut the crap and lets talk here about FACTS not Opinions which are like the @sses, EVERYONE HAS ONE...
My statement was VERY CLEAR and is WRITTEN on black and white, could you please WRITE HERE how many Dominican Women FULFILL the PROFILE to go to USA and to Human Dumping as you are STILL suggesting?? Would you like to compare NUMBERS on that DUMPING for each side?? have you ever been on a public hospital on places like Santiago which is not close to the border?
Did you check with an Airline if what i wrote here about the months of pregnancy for them TO FLY? or do you think this is MEXICO??
Nice story about the Children, if it had been on the UK, they would have been singing GOD SAVE THE QUEEN, on the USA it would have been GOD BLESS America, get the point NOW??
From: United States
Haitians should boycott until they get treated equally. What will the dumb in a cans (dr) do? Force them to work? Ha! Riot in the streets Haitians and take your island back. These dr people that claim they are nth generation Spanish come from Spain's jails and poor that fled Spain because they had no standing. They are the outcast of Spain. That's why DR is a platano republic. Haiti take back your island!
---
From your post is more than obvious that You've got NO F@CKING CLUE of the History of the DOMINCAN REPUBLIC and it's people...
I really love to live here in the Dominican Republic and get along very well with both,Dominicans and Haitians, but unfortunately I have to say, that the way many people (not all, thanks God!) are treating Haitians is a shame. I know many Dominicans abroad who always are wailing that they are treated bad, but that's absolutely ridiculous in comparation how they treat Haitians. And they always invoke God. I hope, God will never will hold them accountable for their deeds. Otherwise - poor DR! That's all I have to say now.
@Calvoleon-Are you referring to me ?
1- Unfortunately THAT RUBBISH is WHAT is available to ALL DOMINICAN children, it is in consequence a Supreme and EPIC Act of STUPIDITY to think that children from FOREIGNERS, which ALSO are BREAKING THE LAW, should have it BETTER than what Dominican Children HAVE ON THEIR OWN COUNTRY
2- Bad Treatment? Haitian and ALL foreigners are also FREE to go elsewhere, i REPEAT, FREE, they can always GO BACK TO HAITI, Do you dispute that? now...YOU want to talk about TREATMENT? let's do it! WHY don't you write here about the treatment on the HAitians ON HAITI?, GOOGLE RESTAVEK and point me to evidence of same on the DR, do you have any Idea of HOW MUCH is invested on TREATING this people on hospitals Alone? probably Not since i DOUBT you have even been to a Domincan Hospital.
3- Get the DOMINICAN CONSTITUTION ARTICLE 18 , which is the LAW OF THE LAND on this country and paste on an ONLINE translator so you can Kill your Ignorance on the DOMINICAN Nationality subject.
ANDA El' DIABLASO !!!! Que pela...............!!!!!
Aníbal de Castro
Ambassador
Embassy of the Dominican Republic
Washington, DC
From: United States
@airgordo-
ANDA El' DIABLASO !!!! Que pela...............!!!!!
---
LOL, coji la cuerda!! es que esta maldita gente de verdad que tienen a uno Jarto de escribir vainas y hablar pendejadas de cosas que ellos no tienen idea!! vienen a este pais hablando mierda disque de Trato, pero no dicen ni Pio del trato que le dan los Haitianos a los mismos Haitianos en Haiti, es mas facil cojer piedras para RD!
I'm living here, doing more for the Dominican Republic than anyone who is living in New York. I'm having my papers and pay taxes. My work is NOT easy and I don't have any money in the back. I'm working alone and for myself, not for a NGO. But for my work, I see the whole country every two weeks on a roundtrip. And it's not only beaches what I see, but also Calle Duarte in Santo Domingo or Calle Pedro Clisante in Sosúa.
No Haitian and no Dominican could take away my work. Because none of them could do what I do. (What could that be?? - It's up to you to guess) But I'm giving work to Dominicans and Haitians. Not much, but something. And I get along very well with both nationalities.
And I'm very pi.... off when I hear some of these hysterical screamers preaching of war against the Devil and talking that the country is full of Haitians like talking of rats. Despiceable!
I am glad to hear you are doing something to better the situation for some but if you really want to help both peoples advocate to your homeland to take in a couple of hundred thousand of these refugees and stop criticizing our legitimate concern
we ayitians have nothin' to do wit' tainos.
our french masters brought african slaves,ayitian ancestors after spanish population moved
from western side of island.
by then taino population absorbed an' decimated already.
ayitians arrived to party in island about 200 years late.
stop your butt kissin'.
we have nothin' to do wit' tainos.
i taught you betta my babie,you worryin' too much
about if dominiken are white,mixed,black or taino.
i want all of my ayitian peeple to come back to ayiti,to heal ayiti an' make it betta.
ayitians too busy smelling dominiken testicles an' we don' get to do poop,because
wew busy looking up to dominiken.
keep yo' head up my son,keep yo' head up.
Racism always is wrong. Because what makes one better than the other? It's pure coincidence that one is born in DR, the other in Haiti, the other in USA or Europe. Without any effort of oneself. So what is the merit to be Dominican? Or Haitian?
A Dominican racist is the same dumb a..hole like an American who hates Mexicans, a Russian who hates Chechens, a German who hates Turks, a Spaniard who hates Dominicans or a French who hates Moroccans.
Racism is dumb and stupid - no matter of which national. And the biggest problem is the racist himself, because he is the last to understand.
Racism always is wrong. Because what makes one better than the other? It's pure coincidence that one is born in DR, the other in Haiti, the other in USA or Europe. Without any effort of oneself. So what is the merit to be Dominican? Or Haitian?
A Dominican racist is the same dumb a..hole like an American who hates Mexicans, a Russian who hates Chechens, a German who hates Turks, a Spaniard who hates Dominicans or a French who hates Moroccans.
Racism is dumb and stupid - no matter of which national. And the biggest problem is the racist himself, because he is the last to understand.
It is quite funny when reading how some Haitians who put so much emphasis on racism as if there was no racism in Haiti. Kaka dyab is not only one of the worst insults to make but also racist against dark skinned. Even the darkest person in Haiti would call another kaka dyab (devil shit). So how do Haitians expect a light skin person to behave back in Haiti when most dark Haitians are not proud of their own color?
Many dark Haitians feel like foreigner in their own country, when they can not live in certain areas or attend certain schools. This is a so-called “black country” where most dark people are being mistreated because they are black, poor, low class, uneducated; in another word, the underdogs
Dont complain about racism, when in Haiti most are not being treated as human beings, so don't expect to be treated well even in the DR, where a black Dominican would feel insulted if a Haitian would dare call him Kaka Dyab
Very sad to know all this, but it's only proving that racism is really stupid.
Of course it's stupid when a black says kaka dyab to another. What else? Stupid and sad.
A racist base accusation against the DR is the easiest weapon to use, but really the weapon of last resort to enable them to defend what is indefensible or like you say the trump card which they pull straight out of their sleeve.
Bwa ha ha ha!
Spinach is trying to win a gold medal for the greatest number of senseless vertical posts.
Studies done by liberal leaning institutions can hardly be called "unbiased" and any trip into NYC and its ghettos will quickly prove this idiocy wrong!
In other news Haiti wins the gold in feces throwing and nation destruction with a silver in head chopping with Iran taking the Gold.
We know Spinach is a total idiot
And the racist for me always is the biggest idiot, no matter of his nationality or color. And worse if he comes dressed as a clergy-man who should preach peace instead of hatred.
And even you won't believe it: I love Dominicans! In general, as long as they don't talk about Haitians.
Like last night when I went home in a bus and like always the topic sooner or later comes to Haitians, as if there was no other topic - and one of the Dominican idiots said: put them a tire around the neck and set them ablaze!
Please, are those people humans?
My girlfriend is Haitian - much whiter than most of my Dominican neighbors. I never had any troubles with anybody, but since she is living in my house, hardly anybody greets me when we pass together, isn't that idiotic? Explain me, if you think it's not!
My girlfriend is Haitian - much whiter than most of my Dominican neighbors. I never had any troubles with anybody, but since she is living in my house, hardly anybody greets me when we pass together, isn't that idiotic? Explain me, if you think it's not!
---
1- the NECK thing is something VERY POPULAR to execute people on Haiti whenever they have one of their usual political disgraces, there are couple of VIDEOS on the net, that show exactly that, on this side we have never used that kind of things.
2- So if people don't greet you, then they are RACIST...nice conclusion! LOL, try greeting people FIRST instead of wait to be greeted like if you were from the royalty, that's what i do.
3- What exist here against Haitians might be called DISCRIMINATION , not racism, becase the Bad feelings that some people have against them, ARE NOT BASED ON RACE, are based on NATIONALITY, their main problem is not they are black, is that they are ILLEGAL Hatians.
@airgordo-There you GO......!!!!
Thank you very much for your last post and bringing light to the Haitian issue
I really hate when people pull the race card against us, because it is the only defense they think they have, when in fact it is no defense at all. Dominicans are not racists and it is ludicrous to accuse us of racism particularly when the majority of our population are people of color
I am at times accused of being a racist because of my stance with regards to undocumented Haitians, until they see the charitable and humanitarian work I have done and continue to do to do to favor Haiti. What is wrong is wrong and I am not about to penalize one group to favor another. But on the other side of the coin, what is right is right, if an undocumented needs my help I will never refuse to give a hand but not at some one else's expense
I just do not understand what exactly people want Dominicans to do, commit suicide? We have done our fair share, but enough is enough !
That Race card is just like you stated, a last resource! now when people begin writing all that BullSh!t about DR being close to NAZI Germany or the Deep South of USA, and average Dominican People being racist, i present them with Two names and ask for a rational explanation on how these two individuals could have made it on a "Racist" country like they portray, the names are Ulises Heraux and Jose Francisco Penia Gomez, as you would imagine that is pretty much the end of the debate!!! BOTH were loved by thousands at a certain point, and specially Penia Gomez IS the biggest Mass leader the DR has ever had, so HOW a racist country could have embrace a son of Haitians like they did with that man??
EXCELLENT !!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
Thank you again airgordo, Thank you so much.........!!!!!
You shut them right up. Now I want to see what they have to say now.
I don't know, how many times I wrote, that it's the fault of the Dominican corrupt officials that let in ANY Haitian, even without a passport, when they pay him. That's the reason why there are so many.
And airgordo: if the neighbors greet me first, and when I have a Haitian woman they don't greet any more - what is that then?? If not racism it's stupidity. And if I greet someone three times and he doesn't answer me, he doesn't exist fore me. I'm not even angry for those kind of uneducated idiots.
And now I heard another nice thing. In Sosúa, the motoconcho drivers have to wear an ID-card now. The problem is, the Haitians, even legally here, don't get one. So what will they do???? Think!
And to put an end to this racism bullshit, let me lay out so that you simple minded bleeding hearts Haitian lovers can understand where a Dominican with no malice in his heart YET towards Haitians feels about this massive illegal immigration to my country. If there are 3+ million Haitians in my country, I can guarantee you that 2.75 million of them are men. Who the HELL do you think they are going to try to relieve their sexual desires (to be polite) if not our women? If they were 2.75 million Scandinavians do you think we would be happy to have them F**k our women? I want at least 2 mil gone
And as far as it is our " fault for letting them in", the first few 100,000 were let in as a humanitarian and brotherly gesture on our part to provide them with an outlet to escape the devastation of the Earthquake in the south, in and around Port au Prince. But Haitians that they are you give them a foot and they take a MILE. Everybody and their brothers came from ALL OVER Haiti whether they were affected by the quake or not. When our government tried to deport them they and the hypocritical bleeding hearts started yelling RACISM and taking the DR to international courts for violating their civil rights as if they had any in OUR country to begin with. Add to this clusterf@ck the corrupt border guards and we arrive to where we are now, innundated with millions of illegal, illiterate single men sh*tting and pissing in people's backyards and rooftops. Calvo FRAK you if you don't understand our dilemna and want to accuse an entire nation of mostly colored people of racism.
YOU are accusing the Dominican PEOPLE, not an INDIVIDUAL of being RACIST, now i ask again the same, HOW a RACIST country like the one YOU portraid could have embraced, Voted and supported, CRIED and LOVED SONS of HAITIANS like Jose Francisco Penia Gomez, HOW CAN YOU RATIONALLY EXPLAIN that on a racist country like the one on your head?? , google is your best friend to find out about this man, there are HUNDREDS of Photos and Videos from his Rallies with the PRD party, google a Photo of His Burial and see for yourself KILOMETERS of people on the streets, ALL THAT FOR A FULL HAITIAN BLOODED BLACK MAN!! you can Chose More! like Ulises Hereaux
I WILL sit and wait here for your response, i WILL be waiting for you to show me a case of a MULATTO or a WHITE person shown that kind of Love ON HAITI, I will be waiting for you to show ANY RACIST COUNTRY doing the same we did here with this man, or would it be that we are NOT racist after all?...